Stuff is going to hit the fan!

[mellowyellow]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

well said SCO. don't know about logistics, but<br />it seems arresting him would have been less volitile.<br />Israel has also said that this is just the begining<br />and they are gonna go after all the militant leaders<br />including maybe even Arafat.<br />Hamas has already blamed the US and have called<br />for all muslims to help pay us and Israel back.<br />LOT'S of countries around the world have denounced<br />Israel for this act further polarizing the world.<br />title of this thread is very accurate!<br />scary days ahead I'm afraid...

 

[SCO]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

I wondered about that too, arresting him. Almost too much respect conferred that way, another form of appeasment maybe? Might send the wrong message and just enrage the new leaders. Can someone explain the Palastinian problem? WhatI get is that they are oppressed by the Isralies, and if Isralies didn't oppress them then they would eliminate the Isralies as infidels. How can you negotiate with that?

 

[gaugeguy]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

How would you arrest him, he had several body gaurds around him at all times. You plan a raid, somebody is gonna get killed, either him, the gaurds or the force going to arrest him. Then they have to get him out of Palestinian controlled areas...I dunno. I think he got what he deserved, a couple hellfire missiles up the wazoo. <br /><br />If he was arrested, the suicide attacks would not stop, nor would the kidnappings or other terrorist acts stop. The only options Isreal had were to take this guy out or to sit back and have more of their people killed by him. What do you think the response of any other nation would be if they had a 9/11 every month? Take out the threats.

 

[bobingardner]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

I don't think the answer is to isolate ourselves further by throwing out the UN and relying on a projection of power to solve our problems. I think we're a lot more vulnerable than many of us would like to admit and we would be beter served by heeding the advise "Speak softly and carry a big stick.". We've shown in Iraq and Afghanastan that we have the big stick. Now I think we should show a willingness to work with others, even the countries we consider to be traitors.

 

[mellowyellow]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

if they could fly a helicopter in and fire missles<br />at the exact moment he left the mosque, I am sure<br />they could have figured a way to ambush/surprise<br />him. might have been bloody, but at least they<br />would have tried to be civil and arrest him and<br />charge him with crimes of terrorism.<br />again, I don't know the logistics, but lowering<br />yourself to that level seems wrong to me and they<br />took the easy way out. after all, isn't that what<br />is supposed to seperate us from them?<br />maybe I'm dreaming, but it just leaves a bad taste<br />in my mouth...

 

[SCO]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

I don't disagree Bob. Downside of dropping out of the UN is that it , if it survived, would surely become a force against us(greater than they already are ). May be a case of keeping your friends close and enemies closer.

 

[gaugeguy]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

If I am not mistaken, there are more UN resolutions against Isreal than anyone else, and problably more "condemnations" against them than the rest combined. Isreal lives in a tough neighborhood, what do you think we would do if Mexico and Canada were terrorist rogue states?<br />If Juan and Pierre wore explosives and killed 20 to 50 Americans every week. I think we would be targeting more than a couple leaders, Ottawa and Mexico City would be bombed big time.

 

[bobingardner]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

Hi gaugeguy,<br /><br />If I understand your point, your saying that Isreal was justified in attacking Shiek Ahmed Yassin, and I'm in complete agreement with you on that. Unlike us Isreal is surrounded by countries that are focused on it's destruction. To make matters worst they're the world's favorite terrorist target, with the US being for once, second best.<br /><br />I think there's a second statement in your post but am not sure what it is.

 

[mellowyellow]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

you make a good point GG... not a good scenario<br />any way you put it eh?<br />and... since suicide bombings are commonplace in<br />Isreal, I feel WE will take the brunt of their<br />retrobution... 100 times more compelling if it occurs<br />here! <br />talk about serious escalation!!!!!!

 

[gaugeguy]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

Bob,<br />s-t-u-f-f i-s g-o-n-n-a h-i-t t-h-e f-a-n.

 

[bobingardner]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

Again, I agree GG.

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

Hey Bob, with all due respect, we were pretty connected with the UN and the World on 911 and suffered the worst attack in US history. We projected power and haven't been hit since. Coincidence? Maybe but I know the other way doesn't work...

 

[Toad2001]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

I've researched this and I think the Brits have it right. It will hit the fan in a big way. In the mean time, here was their reply.<br />"British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw echoed the sentiments of many Arab officials, saying the killing "is unacceptable, it is unjustified and it is very unlikely to achieve its objectives." <br />© The Canadian Press, 2004<br /><br />Watching my stocks fall...Toad.

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

You have to say in public, what you have to say public, especially in Europe where a mood of appeasement and socialism is rampant.<br /><br />Israel presented data (imagine that, actual facts) that showed after taking actions against terrorist leaders the number of terrorist attacks dropped.<br /><br />Deterrence works. It worked against the Soviets and it works against terrorists.<br /><br />If you encourage people to commit terrorist attacks, support terrorists or are the head of a terrorist organization, you are a terrorist and a fair target. It doesn't matter if you are 21 and an Olympic athlete or 60 and in a wheel chair.

 

[oddjob]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

I hate to be blunt, <br />but the objective was to take him out(kill the murderer). <br />Uh, based on the reports of his assasination, I'd say Israel succeeded. <br />To spin it any other way is intelectually dishonest denial. <br /><br />If the objective was not met then why haven't we heard from Yassin since his assasination?<br /><br />My heart bleeds for the muslim extremists, liberals, and America's envious. <br /><br />And I fear not their threats, I welcome them and thank them for alerting me of their plans and position.

 

[bobingardner]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

In my opinion Ralph improving our relations with the UN will not prevent terror attacks on the US. It will however make it easier for foreign governments to support us by reducing the negative reactions from it's citizens. For example, it might make it easier for us to extradite suspected terrorist. <br /><br />I think we haven't been attacked at home again because we've disrupted al-Qaeda on multiple front's and have increased our vigilance. Also, by attacking Afghanistan we showed that we will hold the terrorists' host country accountable. It also seems like they've taken a divide and conquer approach by attacking allies such as Spain.<br /><br />I disagree with the British Foreign Secretary's comments Toad. I don't think Israel had any objective other than to eliminate an enemy. I have to admit though I don't know much about Hamas so it's time to do some reading.

 

[mikeandronda]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

So true Oddjob, When the muslum extremeist get quite then we have to watch out.......Duh, we already know they hate us and are planing to attempt to terrorize us. How come everytime one ofthem does a suicide bombing against Israel the world go's ..."its such a shame", and thats that. But they(Israel) kill somebody who helps orginize these, plain and simple acts of terrorism, and the world is outraged.

 

[NMplayer]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

All of us hate to see killings and what not.....<br /><br />At first Israel's action left a bad taste in my mouth as well. But, as I think about it, I become more and more convinced everyday that this world is headed for another showdown and there just isn't any avoiding it. so we might as well get ready and get it over with.<br /><br />How do you make peace with people who fundamentally believe that you ought to be dead? You can appease them, give them money and honor their leaders in an attempt to try to put it off, but you can't stop it.<br /><br />It's like trying to make friends with a rattle snake. You may placate him enough to avoid being bitten for a long time, but in the end he'll strike

 

[SCO]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

Thats my exact take NM. A sense of resign and despair, that there may be no way out other than all out conflict. The Left wants to wiggle here, dance there, smooth talk around and find some magic way around this, and while they waste time doing that, we all get in deeper and deeper. What's their strategy now? Rewrite history, try and prove improper Bush motive and stupidity(takes one to know one)and get us back on the path of appeasment. The big stick works. Note that Hamas has taken back the threat against the USA. Would they be afraid of Kerry, or want to make him twist in the wind. This isn't about kindness, understanding, logic, or doing the right thing. They dont see Jews as worthy of life. Islam doesn't see any of us as worthy of life. Were they to win, the liberals would be the first on the chopping block. If anyone out there thinks of them as oppressed victims, think again. They are major bullies that fortunately for us, don't have as much power as we do.

 

[mellowyellow]

Re: Stuff is going to hit the fan!

SCO?<br />"Islam doesn't see any of us as worthy of life"<br />maybe the radical extremists, but for the most<br />part this is not true buddy.<br /><br />still a little uneasy, but as the old saying goes;<br />if you wanna change your results, change yur methods.