baoting accident question.

[xtraham]

Re: baoting accident question.

I can say that if you are involved in a maritime collision if you have said, are you do say (I did not see them, it, whatever) you will be found guilty........

"All vessels must maintain a proper look out at all times with whatever means avalible"

BTW: hope your recovery went well, and good luck on the pending case........

 

[steve23guy]

Re: baoting accident question.

thanks for all the comments i do appreciate them, even the neg. its better to hear both honestly, lets me know what i may expect to hear and actualy come up with a defense towards each statement that can probably be made..
now, just so u all do know, i DO have an air horn, i have that to bring to court, it is all water damaged from being underwater for 2 hours before they drug the ski out of the river, but i did have a air horn in my front comartment (right infront of me) that i could signal back with..... by front compartment i dont mean the very front, i mean infront of me, just at the end of the seat before the handles, it was a 2003 sea-doo GTI.. if that helps u understand where that comartment is that im talking about.

 

[steve23guy]

Re: baoting accident question.

also, i dont know if i mentioned this above, but ive worked for a jet ski rental facility and have had to train people that have never ridden a pwc, as well as monitor them while on the water, i know the rules of the water, i was just making sure i was correct on them.. I AM a safe driver, honestly, ive never PASSED a boat without making me presence known, normaly i do so by riding along side of them at an angle where they know im there and i give them a wave then i pull away gradualy and go... ive NEVER cut infront of a boat., im very respectfull on the water, i dont spray people, i dont ride there.... butt. i dont cut them off, i do ride wake but i do it at a safer distance then most if i decide to do any stunts i do it near the shore line where no one is around (alcove/bay area) as far as people saying i should have looked longer.... how long am i supposed to look behind me? honestly, i had a boat on my right, the water was choppy, there was a bend in the river coming up.. am i supposed to drive the whole time watching MY wake? just wondering

 

[salty87]

Re: baoting accident question.

that sucks that your leg got messed up. i can't imagine anyone wants to hear of somebody getting hurt while trying to have a good day on the water. accidents are bad for all of us.

that said, the thing that bothers me is that you're looking to cite regs against this boater while you admit to running 30' to the side of another boat. how can you say he operated recklessly while it was ok for you to do so?

imo, the whole situation stinks and you guys should end up equally screwed. you, unfortunately being in the smaller vessel, had to pay a higher price as you were hurt. yet, by running with the big boys in such an unprotected vessel, you were playing with fire.

i'd say reckless operation for both operators with an honorable mention to the guy you crowded who stopped to render assistance.

 

[danpemby]

Re: baoting accident question.

Rick
I assume you have a copy of "The Handbook" I am reading it now and on page 14 'Encountering Other Vessels' it states:
Even though no vessel has the "right of way" it is the responsibility of BOTH operators to take action to avoid a collision. Followed by the 3 basic rules to prevent collisions;
1. good seamanship
2. keep a sharp lookout
3. maintain a safe speed

It seems to me that these basic rules were broken by both involved, hence the results.

I am not sure if these same rules apply to IL but I am sure they are close. I am by no means defending the actions of PWC operators but EVERYONE has a responsibity to ensure accidents do not happen.

 

[xtraham]

Re: baoting accident question.

no answer for you, there are so many variables in the uscg rules of the road that they can be construded in so many differant ways, forget about local laws, read the uscg rules of the road and request a maritime judge and attorney that are familiar with such a case......was the coast gaurd notified? if not you have a good defence just on that because there was a injury...and its obvious you could not contact them

 

[steve23guy]

Re: baoting accident question.

yeah, i jsut talked to my lawyer and well he said its not going to matter whos fault it was in this case, what it comes down to is that by the books, he was supposed to signal and did not, wethero r not people do it or not.. he was supposed to, its winning on a technicality, but a win none the less, his exact words

 

[rickdb1boat]

Re: baoting accident question.

EVERYONE has a responsibity to ensure accidents do not happen.

Yes, they do.........But I think you will find that if you look at any states boating accident statistics, you will see that PWC lead the pack. They do here by a long margin. And all I'm saying is that I have seen for myself why this is true. I keep a good lookout whenever I'm in a crowded lake or river. Sometimes it takes away from the enjoyment of just cruising along. But better to know than not know. I've had boats sneek up on me here and there(Hard to avoid where I boat), but I've never turned into one of them....I don't turn until I look and see the coast is clear....

 

[Firestar]

Re: baoting accident question.

Contributing negligence. I am amazed that the boater didn't recieve a citation. The boater had the first opportunity to plead his case to the reporting officer. I'm sure his account is totally damning to the PWC operator. The officer should have done an indepht investigation.....hear both sides.....before issuing citations. It is a damn shame that as soon as the PWC operator regains conciousness in a hospital the officer greets him with a citation instead of requesting his statement. One sided, blinders on, judgement made by the officer. The PWC operator should demand the boat operator be cited also. The PWC operator would be the complaintant. Just as the boater is the complaintant.
The officer wasn't on the scene when the incident occurred and therefore cannot testify as to what caused the accident. The boater will be in court to do that and if he isn't the case should be dropped. I would demand a citation be issued to the boater ASAP. That will put the boater on the defensive and the PWC operator will have his day in court. Right now it weights against the PWC. A citation against the boater will give the PWC operator some leverage. Both could drop complaints.....refuse to testify against eachother and let the insurance companies fight it out.

 

[salty87]

Re: baoting accident question.

he was supposed to signal and did not, wethero r not people do it or not.. he was supposed to, its winning on a technicality, but a win none the less, his exact words

i haven't gone back to read what you said happened. did the other operator admit to this? there's no way anyone would hear the horn that came with my boat...even people in my boat. do you have to prove that he didn't signal?

 

[steve23guy]

Re: baoting accident question.

understand, i DID look.. i looked to my rear left, nothing, double checked infront of me (bend in the river remember) and as i turned i was looking, but he was there, this happend all in less then a second... i turned left, saw him right away as i was turning, i tried to turn right, to avoid and continue in a straight line, but at the time he was turning right as well to come to me..... but i just plained right into his path, which then at that point i was no longer in total control of the PWC.. like i said, it was not even a second.. i didnt even have enough to to say "OH CRAP"

 

[Firestar]

Re: baoting accident question.

yeah, i jsut talked to my lawyer and well he said its not going to matter whos fault it was in this case, what it comes down to is that by the books, he was supposed to signal and did not, wethero r not people do it or not.. he was supposed to, its winning on a technicality, but a win none the less, his exact words[/quote

I think your attorney is telling you what you want to hear.
You cannot turn your craft into his path. What's the defense for that manuver? I'm sure you'll be asked that by the court. Just playing the devil's advocate here.

 

[steve23guy]

Re: baoting accident question.

he was supposed to signal and did not, wethero r not people do it or not.. he was supposed to, its winning on a technicality, but a win none the less, his exact words

i haven't gone back to read what you said happened. did the other operator admit to this? there's no way anyone would hear the horn that came with my boat...even people in my boat. do you have to prove that he didn't signal?

yes, considering i can hear people talking and laughing on boats and my family yellin to me from the shore while riding in my backyard, not to mention the man that pulle dme out of the water was the boater that was beside me.. he didnt hear anything eather....


I also want to add, that the damage on my jet ski is on the entire left side.. as well as the entire bottom.. so not only did he t bone me, but he was going fast enough to flip it over, toss me about 20 feet *according to the other boat driver* he also managed to run over a 10-11 foot pwc that wieghs 600 lbs without gas and run it over and tear the bottom open with his prop.......pretty much showing he was haulin #$#

 

[steve23guy]

Re: baoting accident question.

yeah, i jsut talked to my lawyer and well he said its not going to matter whos fault it was in this case, what it comes down to is that by the books, he was supposed to signal and did not, wethero r not people do it or not.. he was supposed to, its winning on a technicality, but a win none the less, his exact words[/quote

I think your attorney is telling you what you want to hear.
You cannot turn your craft into his path. What's the defense for that manuver? I'm sure you'll be asked that by the court. Just playing the devil's advocate here.

The defense is, he should have signaled, if he would have, i would not have turned, also he was way to close.. he didnt even give himself room to manuver in the first place.. according to one of the links that was sent to me it states in the USCG rules...

"Every vessel shall at all times proceed at a safe speed so that she can take proper and effective action to avoid collision and be stopped within a distance appropriate to the prevailing circumstances and conditions. "

i state this becuz in court he said he saw the choppy water tossin me around abit and was a lil worried but was in hurry, so. that being said. he knowingly put himself in that situation, and did not give himself enough safe distance to stop in the case something did happen, what if i just lost control from a wave and fell off right infront of him??? i wouldnt be typing to u fine fellas today thats for sure. and also, if he DID manage to pass me and i didnt turn, at the speed he was going, the wake he made could have easily tossed me into/on the boat that was to my right..... he did not look at the entire situation as far as i can tell.. he behaved incorrectly.. i may have turned yes. i shouldnt have maybe.. but i WOULDNT have if i knew he was passing. or even if i knew he was there. i would have eather A. Waited for him to pass, or B. gone ahead more/sped up and given myself enough breathing room to do a go around.

 

[Firestar]

Re: baoting accident question.

Just remember he's going to paint a picture of you as being at fault. Is it mentioned in the report how fast the boater was going? How close he was to you when he was passing? I would still ask that he be cited.

 

[danpemby]

Re: baoting accident question.

Yes, they do.........But I think you will find that if you look at any states boating accident statistics, you will see that PWC lead the pack. They do here by a long margin.

Agreed!

 

[xtraham]

Re: baoting accident question.

make sure your lawyer knows a vessel less than 12 meters long is not required to have a horn......

 

[steve23guy]

Re: baoting accident question.

can they issue him one even in court AFTER the accident... just wondering..

btw., i dont know if HTML works here so im gonna try.. here is a picture of me 5 days before the accident. on my GTI LE... this one has mirrors... LOL. the one i was driving was the same, but without mirrors, and purple, not gold.. as u can see, i enlarged it, i am looking, like always as i turn.... and this turn was exactly how i turned in the accident....

<img src="http://www.mssimages.com/uploads/20060830/20060830_looking_1156962626372894361.jpg">

if it did not work, please just use the link thats in the html code to see the picture, thanks

 

[Firestar]

Re: baoting accident question.

A citation can be issued long after the incident as long as you sign as the complaintant. I'd do it ASAP.

 

[Firestar]

Re: baoting accident question.

Get on the offense! Attack him as he is attacking you.