1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

[jasoutside]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Well fsh, I am glad to hear that you may think it may be a reasonable fix buddy!

So - tip it upside down???? Holy moly that would be a heck of a trick! I have done some fun rigging so far but I don't know if I can swing that maneuver

I think I'll jump over to the IO section and see what those fellas have to say about my misery.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Knowing nothing about motors, I'd agree that sounds pretty awful

 

[chrisp929]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Jas,

hang in there bro. Have a mechanic look at it. It may be work to get fixed but may pay off in the end. I don't know how mechanically inclined you are but those 4.3's are pretty easy to work on. Having only rebuilt a 67 international harvester bulldozer diesel before, i have to assume that the gas 4.3 is MUCH easier. I'm VERY curious to what's really wrong with it but i will admit it sounds like a death gurgle.
Good luck bro.

 

[dmoriarty51]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

at the very least you have a rebuildable core.. and a drive so it wouldnt be a total loss.

another possibility is a collapsed lifter, gm engines are notorious for it. this noise is a bit loud sounding for that, but then i normally listen to it in a car, with an engine compartment muffling things.

you could crank it over by hand via a bar and socket on the crank pulley bolt, see if you encounter any odd resistance, also pull the spark plugs and see if any have made contact with anything. compression test.

other thoughts

its not just something touching something it shouldnt is it?
or bouncing against that trailer?
it does have oil in it right?
any water in the oil?

they are pretty easy to work on, and are durable as all get out in automotive apps at least, i have one sitting outside with 220k miles on it, it ticks a little and uses some oil but still pulls the boat. i had another in a blazer i used for trail riding that found a small puddle that left a muddy water line at the middle of the headlights, it swallowed water and then it had a nice soothing knock to it but only when it was wound up. i ran for over a year before it broke the rings in that cylinder, and burned 4-5 qts of oil getting me home 100 or so miles.

good luck

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Jas,

hang in there bro. Have a mechanic look at it. It may be work to get fixed but may pay off in the end. I don't know how mechanically inclined you are but those 4.3's are pretty easy to work on. Having only rebuilt a 67 international harvester bulldozer diesel before, i have to assume that the gas 4.3 is MUCH easier. I'm VERY curious to what's really wrong with it but i will admit it sounds like a death gurgle.
Good luck bro.

Thanks chrisp. I am ok with my hands but man I have no idea what I'd be looking at if I cracked that thing open!

at the very least you have a rebuildable core.. and a drive so it wouldnt be a total loss.

another possibility is a collapsed lifter, gm engines are notorious for it. this noise is a bit loud sounding for that, but then i normally listen to it in a car, with an engine compartment muffling things.

you could crank it over by hand via a bar and socket on the crank pulley bolt, see if you encounter any odd resistance, also pull the spark plugs and see if any have made contact with anything. compression test.

other thoughts

its not just something touching something it shouldnt is it?
or bouncing against that trailer?
it does have oil in it right?
any water in the oil?

they are pretty easy to work on, and are durable as all get out in automotive apps at least, i have one sitting outside with 220k miles on it, it ticks a little and uses some oil but still pulls the boat. i had another in a blazer i used for trail riding that found a small puddle that left a muddy water line at the middle of the headlights, it swallowed water and then it had a nice soothing knock to it but only when it was wound up. i ran for over a year before it broke the rings in that cylinder, and burned 4-5 qts of oil getting me home 100 or so miles.

good luck

Thanks dmoriarty, appreciate ya stopping by. Yah, it's loud. I don't suspect any water in the oil and she sure isn't bouncing in the trailer (gosh wouldn't that be cool). I don't think anything is bumping into anything else.

 

[Huron Angler]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Sure hope it's something relatively minor that can be replaced. Sorry I have no good advice to offer.

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

OK, dudes. White flag is held high! I give.

Man do I hate to say that!

I have spent a fair amount of time in the manuals and lots of quality time getting to know this here Merc. I was just starting to feel confident about doing this remove and install all on my own. I had it pretty well laid out in my head how things were going to unfold. Grumble, grumble.

I have a local marine tech that comes very highly regarded and a close friend has gone to him form many years, very reasonable and good to his customers. At least that is the word on the street. I'll haul that driveline over to him and see what he has to say. My wallet is not happy about these words I am typing right now.

 

[fshngho]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Jason, You would have to drain all oil & fluids. Where the outdrive is bolted on (normally the transmission) is the back of the engine. Remove the outdrive and bolt on an engine stand. With an engine stand you can rotate the engine 360 degrees. Engine stands at HF about 30 - 40 $. by removing the oil pan and the valve covers you should be a ble to locate the knock.
Orrrrr, take it to a mechanic as you suggested. If possible have him show you what he finds, for your future education and understanding. Dosen't your school have an auto shop?

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Yah, I actually just emailed over that video to the marine tech guy and he told me to call him back in an hour. He also told me that if it is a busted rod he rarely rebuilds unless it's a super special motor (4.3 is definitely not). So anyway, it's in the pros hands now. He is only about 30 miles away from my place so he'll probably want me to bring it to him.

Although, I am fully expecting to call him and he'll tell me I suck at life and I should take up something like feeding pigeons as a new hobby.

Nope, my school gave up on the Auto Tech many moons ago. They still have metals and woods though. I have them working on a few things for me at the moment.

 

[dmoriarty51]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

doubt it broke a rod, it would likely lock up completly, or shove it out the side of the motor. a trashed rod bearing is pretty likely.. and is totally rebuildable.

someone correct me if im wrong, but any machine shop that does engine rebuilds should be able to handle a rebuild on that thing... they just need to be aware that it is a marine application so that the correct camshaft and valvetrain is used, and correct compression ratio etc... it would almost surely be at a lower price than a marine specific rebuilder.

after all its just a car engine once you ditch the water cooled manifolds and outdrive.

 

[v8mgbal]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Dang Jason that sux. I hope its something minor but it sounds expensive. I think we are all holding our breath and keeping our fingers crossed for you.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Although, I am fully expecting to call him and he'll tell me I suck at life and I should take up something like feeding pigeons as a new hobby.

That's a gross generalization. You simply suck at testing things before buying them

 

[fshngho]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Jason is there any chance you did a compression check? If not, can you? Just crank it enough to get readings. If we don't have compression on one then we have an Uh OH. If we do have compression on all then we may be lucky.

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

doubt it broke a rod, it would likely lock up completly, or shove it out the side of the motor. a trashed rod bearing is pretty likely.. and is totally rebuildable.

someone correct me if im wrong, but any machine shop that does engine rebuilds should be able to handle a rebuild on that thing... they just need to be aware that it is a marine application so that the correct camshaft and valvetrain is used, and correct compression ratio etc... it would almost surely be at a lower price than a marine specific rebuilder.

after all its just a car engine once you ditch the water cooled manifolds and outdrive.

Yah, he actually said that he was doubtful about the trashed rod theory too. He said he doesn't see it very often.

He said that he hires out his major engine rebuilds. I think he sorta focuses on OB's and IO's that can be and should be fixed. (I wonder if EZ will read this part)

Dang Jason that sux. I hope its something minor but it sounds expensive. I think we are all holding our breath and keeping our fingers crossed for you.

Thanks dude appreciate the encouragement!

That's a gross generalization. You simply suck at testing things before buying them

Yup, you have me on that EZ! I am usually much more conservative with things of this nature but I rolled the dice on this one. Snake eyes! But, could have gone the other way too! Well, still may after the pro looks at it! Maybe.

Jason is there any chance you did a compression check? If not, can you? Just crank it enough to get readings. If we don't have compression on one then we have an Uh OH. If we do have compression on all then we may be lucky.

Yah, I don't have a tester on hand here. It is equal distance to HF and back as it is to the tech place, so, I can go straight to the man, eh! He'll tell me way more than anything that comes out of HF!

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

OK, ran it again, just a couple of seconds. Long enough to pull each of the plug wires one at a time. Nada. No difference. Still knocking.

Maybe not a rod issue? Something else? Maybe this is better? Worse?

 

[Bwana Don]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

I'm thinking it's in the top end. Collapsed lifter sounds possible. I'll bet it can be fixed economically. Rod knocks (rod connects to the piston) are a deeper banging. Hard to tell from a video though.

Get an engine stand, put the motor on it. Start pulling the top end apart. Carb. manifold, lifters, heads..... flip it over take off the pan.........

I really wish you were closer, I love engine work. You coming down this way. I'll tear it down for you and inspect it. I've got micrometers, bore gages, engine stands, a next door neighbor who is a GM mechanic, a brother who is a car designer/hot rodder. I forgot, compression checker, leak down tester.

I wish you the best, If there is anything I can do, let me know.

 

[djpeters]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

Nope. Took the owners info, took the marine techs info, took the receipts that backed up what they said, and took the bet. Looks like I lost that one. Man that hurts!

So this so called marine mechanic with recipts were not for this motor? Doen't seem like someone would pay to have their motor knock like that. Hope it turns out to be something really simple like maybe the oil pan got bumped in from moving it around and the crank is thumping the side.....

 

[paparoof]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

That's a gross generalization. You simply suck at testing things before buying them

ROFLMAO!!!

Smash bang outta the park!

Jas - now you know how I felt the day I posted this picture:

(if you can't tell, that's five year old water sitting within an inch of the spark plug hole on the motor I didn't test before I bought it).

So you know I mean it when I say... I feel your pain man. I'm heartbroken to hear that knock too. Just keep pluggin away. You'll get there. Now you have more time for paint prep!

 

[Alpheus]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

OK, ran it again, just a couple of seconds. Long enough to pull each of the plug wires one at a time. Nada. No difference. Still knocking.

Maybe not a rod issue? Something else? Maybe this is better? Worse?

What was the oil pressure???

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

What was the oil pressure???

Sorry, should have mentioned that - 40#