1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

In reply to JB above - not really sure what I want it to look like. I'm not a mechanic - so my primary concern would be reliability. There is actually a local dealer selling some vintage motors, and I've been keeping my eye out. One of the nice things about this being a second boat is I don't actually have any agenda to get it on the water, so I can simply wait to see what comes along.

I went out looking for supplies today - and found a local supplier of epoxy - the dealer said it comes in either grey or black, costs about $70 for the kit, and told me it was what I was looking for. He also said some things that I know are incorrect (such as telling me that epoxy is never clear), so I'm a little leery of his advice. Being a long time woodworker, and using epoxy somewhat differently in that context, I had expected that the epoxy would be a clearcoat. I live in a remote area, so there is very little available locally. The only stuff I could find was an interior epoxy that is not suitable for exterior use. Is the stuff pictured here what you would expect for epoxy, or is the dealer off-base?

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

By the way JB - how do you get those pictures so big?

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

No major work on the boat today - out of town on business. Couldn't find rivets locally, but found them while I was out of town: $16 for about a hundred rivets of different sizes. Brings the total investment to $116, and another hour finding the parts, for 8.5 hours.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

I went out looking for supplies today - and found a local supplier of epoxy - the dealer said it comes in either grey or black, costs about $70 for the kit, and told me it was what I was looking for. He also said some things that I know are incorrect (such as telling me that epoxy is never clear), so I'm a little leery of his advice. Being a long time woodworker, and using epoxy somewhat differently in that context, I had expected that the epoxy would be a clearcoat. I live in a remote area, so there is very little available locally. The only stuff I could find was an interior epoxy that is not suitable for exterior use. Is the stuff pictured here what you would expect for epoxy, or is the dealer off-base?
View attachment 198602

That's paint, maybe epoxy paint/primer, but paint NOT epoxy:
Additional Product Information:
EP HiBuild Technical Data Sheet
MSDS Components A
• Standard Grey
• Standard Black
• Standard White
MSDS Components B

Read thru some of the Endura info, sounds like a good product, but perhaps not for wood & aluminum... Steel & fiberglass were the only 2 listed surfaces.

It might perform similar to epoxy, might not, but many tin builds use spar varnish as the primary water intrusion counter-measure, so it may be an alternative worth considering.

So I'd suggest you consider touching base w/ some of the Canadian Starcraft guys, DozerII & InMotion are both very active. Ask them about Canadian vendors &/or products. You can find several of their builds here:
Starcraft Rebuilds and Restorations, they're all here!

Again it depends on what you want the Naden to look like when you're done. If you used typical clear epoxy on any woodwork that's exposed & visable, it will be exposed to UV, so it must be covered w/ either spar or paint. If you're going to paint the epoxied wood, AND the Endura is wood compatible, then it might be 1 product that will perform both sealing & UV protection, IF the Endura is UV stable. Quite a few IF's.......

@Pix:
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Puts pix in your post like this:

There are settings in photobucket to make it more user friendly for YOU to use, but in those settings, select auto-size, that will get you the largest format pix possible for posting here.

 

[Dave Martelle]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

I just picked up a Naden fishing boat in Iowa from my Dad. One from Webster City and I'm taking it to my Cabin in Vermilion Bay Ontario. I knew nothing of the history of these boats until an hour ago......so you can imagine how floored I am of the coincidence of all this! To add too it.... I helped the guy who bought the Naden building in Vermilion Bay haul old boxes and stuff out of there last summer. I looked all over for some of the odd plugs and wished I would have grabbed some of the old literature! I'm leaving Friday to spend the summer at my place up there and will definitely be checking in with you guys and listening to your restoration stories. I'm definitely going to restore this one to original blue and put a good old vintage motor on it. If you have any ideas on where to get paint I would really appreciate the info. Take care and hope to talk to you guys soon!
Dave Martelle
Janesville Wisconsin

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Hi Dave,

Congrats on the boat and good luck with it! I suggest you start another thread on paint suppliers - you'll stand a better chance of getting a response. Put up some photos of the boat prior to restoration. I'm also going to start another thread on Naden Boats, looking for historic information on the company (check it out). In terms of paint, I know that there are some sources here on iboats for boat paint. There are also several marinas in Kenora that I suspect supply boat paint as well (haven't checked that yet).

Best of luck,

Peter

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

JB - thanks for the contact suggestion on Dozer - he got right back to me with some good advice.

I'm posting a question I sent to him regarding the transom, as it appears that locally, I'm limited to exterior plywood.

What should I use for plywood for transoms? I have a 1 1/4 inch thick transom to replace, but marine plywood is prohibitively expensive (I would have to buy a sheet of 3/4 inch and a sheet of 1/2 inch, which would be about $330 plus taxes). Araucoply isn't available locally (I assume I could have it shipped in). Locally, I can simply get 5/8" exterior grade plywood, which isn't pretty. What I was planning was laminating two pieces of 5/8" together to make the transom, then coating it and painting it. I would use the rest of the sheet to make the boat seats, which I then intend to cover in a marine vinyl. What do you think of this plan?

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Dozer can get a really nice high multiple layer exterior Birch plywood that works & finishes really nice. He should get back to you about that if you asked him in a PM. If not ask specifically about it....

Otherwise, 5/8" ply sounds like a good option, esp if it's that or $330 worth of marine

You can make some filler w/ epoxy and fill any voids along the edges of the ply & any defects in the exposed face (only the side facing the interior of the boat will be visible) then coat the sides of the 1 1/4" ply lamination w/ 2 coats of epoxy (do the edges w/ every coat, they'll get a total of 4 coats).

Finish the boat seat ply the same way, 2 coats each side, 4 coats @ edges.

If the seat ply isn't exposed, it won't need to be covered w/ paint. The exposed epoxy edges & interior face of the transom ply will need to be covered, epoxy isn't UV stable.

Dozer may be able to help you find a decent marine vinyl supplier in Canada too. He uses a lot of spar varnish instead of epoxy on his plywood. It'll last longer then the un-coated original ply did.

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

I was planning on starting the stripping process today, using aircraft paint stripper. A quick test patch revealed it worked quite well. Unfortunately, it had rained last night, so rather than nice dry dirt in the boat, I was confronted with mud. I also realised that I had forgotten to remove the wiring from the boat, as well as the bow cap. While getting the cap off, a neighbor wondered by - he happens to be an aircraft mechanic.

Got the boat cleaned out. Just a few things left to taken off, then I should be ready to strip tomorrow. Put about another hour into it today, plus $30 for the paint stripper. Total so far, 9.5 hours, and $146.

He suggested Metalset to fix the 20-40 holes in the gunwales (pictured below). Has anyone used this with any degree of success? I couldn't find any photos to see what it looks like when finished. The idea would be to fill the holes, then leave it. My guess is that it will simply look like I have filled a bunch of holes in the gunwale.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Sounds like aluminum specific JB weld. Are you going to polish bare aluminum on the gunwale? Then yep, probably look like a pock marked gunwale.

If you're going w/ paint, then sand smooth like JB Weld, and no one will know otherwise.

 

[dozerII]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Morning Peter, good looking project boat you have. JB has been giving you some good advice. JBweld is great for the holes just don't get any extra on as it is tough sanding. Windsor Plywood has Baltic birch exterior ply the 3/4"is 15 ply very stabile and strong. I have to travel a couple hours to the nearest Windsor ply here you are probably the same.

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

OK. Paint stripping a boat isn't fun.

Really.

No Really.

Really Really.

Don't believe me?

OK. Do you remember Bruce Campbell?

No, not the heroic-but-foolishly-comic "Hey What's that on Your Face?" Bruce Campbell of the Evil Dead series. I mean the evil-cut-people-into-pieces-mad-scientist-but-foolishly-comic "What a beautiful blue eye!" Bruce Campbell from Escape from L.A. He played the surgeon general of Beverly Hills, if you cannot remember.



Yeah.

That Guy.

I would rather meet the Surgeon General of Beverly Hills, without the benefit of Health Insurance, on Friday the Thirteenth, in his office on Elm Street, after a pre-consult with Nurse Ratchett, than strip a boat using paint stripper.

OK, OK, OK. I'm probably high from the aircraft stripper fumes, but starting stripping was actually kind of fun. I also managed to get the final pieces of the boat electricals and bowcap off.

Here is before, during and after. Only 4/5 of the boat left to do, plus going back over the bits I have already done. I'm going to try a couple of other things - a 3000psi pressure washer, a wire brush on a grinder, and a little more paint stripper, to see what works best.

For anyone looking at this for advice on how to strip a boat, you might want to go elsewhere, as I'm new at this. What I can say is you should spread on the stripper fairly thickly - as thickly as you can see in the second photograph below. If you spread it thinly, it doesn't seem to be enough to react with the paint and get it to bubble off.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Nasty business that aircraft stripper. Been there..

It was the only product that made a dent in the bedliner on the hull of my Jet. And it didn't get 100% either.......

Might try to scuff the paint 1st to give the stripper some purchase on the paint. Might be enough to let it work better.

Good luck..

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

I'll give scuffing the paint before stripping a try when I head out again tomorrow.

Dozer - I'll see what I can track down from the Windsor Plywood's near us. I have a call in to the local hardware store to see if they can track down some Arucoply as well.

Oh yes - another hour of work tonight brings the total to 10.5 hours. I'd work longer, but the kids really enjoy the starcraft, so we've been getting out in that most evenings.

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

OK - so scuffing didn't make much of a difference - I think the problem is that the paint is just so thick. There are places where there are large sags and runs. Used up the rest of the aircraft stripper today, and got about 4/5 of the inside of the boat done. Rather than simply buying another $60 can of paint stripper, I'm going to try a 3000psi pressure washer this weekend. I'm told it will strip paint...we'll see. If that doesn't work, it will be back to the paint stripper...or both. Another hour and a half tonight. 12 hours so far.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Be careful w/ really high pressure washers, it can deform the aluminum.

I used a 3750psi washer, but ONLY w/ the rotary blast tip, and it would still only peel back partially loose bedliner on mine :facepalm:

Good luck

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Thanks JB. You have hit my concern on the head. I don't want to punch holes in the boat, or create more problems for myself. I'll be careful, but I want to see what will happen with the paint that has had no stripper on it, versus the paint that has had stripper on it - some of the 'stripped' paint, even though I'm having trouble getting it off, is softer than the unstripped paint - so I'm hoping that will come off easily.

My original plan was to strip the interior and polish it up, but as I get further into this, I keep finding badly done minor repairs on the boat, things like improper screws used, which have now become rusty etc. When I peeled back the paint on the floor of the bow, I discovered a series of bolts in the "V" of the boat. It looks like a previous owner added a strip of aluminum to strengthen the front of the boat.

I'm removing, and will eventually rivet all these as I go, but my concern is that even once I get all the repairs done, and replace all the rivets, and get the boat watertight. I may need to Gluvit the seams as extra insurance against leaks. If I do that, I'm inclined to paint the interior as 64osby did in post # 67. of his 14' Lone Star restoration.

So, if I decide to repaint, as opposed to polish - to what extent do I need to get the original paint off? In some places I am down to bare metal, and in others, I am down to a baby blue coating - looks like either factory paint or perhaps a powder coat.

 

[Watermann]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Nice pair of boats you have there! I really like the smooth lines of the Naden. That Holiday of yours has a tower of power too!

On your paint strip chore, try putting on the stripper and then cover if with plastic for about 20 min before scraping.

 

[pckeen]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Thanks Watermann - I'll try that - I couldn't get the pressure washer in until tomorrow, so the boat is on hold until then. I'm finishing another project in the evening off - putting a few coats of polyurethane on a bed I've built (headboard only pictured here). As you can see, I'm competing for workshop space with an army of toys. I couldn't even get far enough away to photograph the entire bed.

 

[Watermann]

Re: 1968-71 Naden N-16 Big Fisherman Restoration

Ah yea, I remember those days of plastic toys and needy small creatures running around the house. Woodworking skills like that will come in handy on your boat rebuilds.