Oh Mr. President, what now?

[12Footer]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

And this is where admin5 should post,<br />"The opinions of the guests, moderators, are not nescarily those of the staff or management of iboats.com LOL<br /> <br />I know he has an opinion, but is notoriously quiet on the more-heated topics. ..Must be hard to stay silent,and I wouldn'rt want to be him.....I'd explode from all the built-up opinion.

 

[SCO]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

Sometimes we get so involved in the minutia and details of the mechanics of the arguements that the ideas are lost or confused. I read 12footer loud and clear. We are in a stresfull situation that needs at least the show of solidarity. The appearance of weakness comforts our enemys, emboldens them and translates to lost American lives somewhere down the line. Our democratic freedoms( speech etc) come with a responsibility that REQUIRES intellectual honesty and discretion. There is a point when we back seat drivers have to shut up and let the driver steer us out of danger else the distraction will be what gets us. Refer to "The Godfather". A gang war started because Michael or someone showed a divison within the family.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

That's better 12'. It's just wrong to make judgements of patriotism against those that don't agree with you.<br /><br />"the individual is a soldier on one side or the other.If not, he/she is "neutral" to the conflict, and simply must stay sidelined,in the bleachers, or exhiled. These neutral individuals must remain neutral, or they obviously have suported one side or the other,by thier expressed support of one side or the other.<br /><br />I know this isn't the soldiers creed. It isn't written in the Constitution. It isn't a law or rule. This is your feeling. <br />History has shown that suppressed speech and rational thought or being nuetral or simply flocking with the masses. Along with standing idlely by while being duped or when wrongs are being commited, purpetuate those wrongs. This is dangerous! The next step is facism, don't go there 12'.<br /><br />"All I meant was you are iether with the U.S., or you are against us. In war, it must bethis way.<br />If you are on my side, welcome comrad. If not, die at my countrymen's hands, ememy. If you are niether, do not suport iether side, lest you be foundd a traitor to one side, martyr to the other.<br />The math is simple here.There are only two sides".<br /><br />Actually 12' you went there. In your view you've only given me three choices.<br />Agree with you lockstep.<br />Become a Sheeple and shut the flock up.<br />Or defend my life against people with your thoughts.<br />The choice would be simple for me 12'.<br /><br />"The moderators here and on all sites worth thier salt, are not democractic-based. They are dictatorships,and must be. At some point, just as in many heated topics, the gambit of thought and opinions has been penned, (many times,more than once). At that point,or some point close to it, the moderators will close out the topic". <br /><br />Well this is true I suppose.<br />However, if your going to allow political debate and discussion, you have to be fair. <br />There were rules put forth. If someone stays well with in those rules and write a very lengthy opposing opinion. Complete with facts and collaborating references to the facts. As well as quoteing liberals, moderate, and conservative opinions. To erase that post was irresponsable and completely not in the spirit of this debate.<br />It was erased because it had the potential of being inflamatory ONLY because it was an opposing view. (Shoot! It even quoted on of my favorite conservative heros, Amb. Jeanne Kirkpatrick, what an American!)<br />Again I have to disagree with you. I don't like ANY dictatorship. Or ANY manipulation of the truth.<br /><br />Thanks JB, I appreciate the difficulty of the moderators job. Generally good grades are deserved in my opinion. <br />While (emotions)pride, fear, greed, hate and deception are dang poor reasons to invade a country, assasination attempts on the President is a good one.

 

[12Footer]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

I understand your fears. I read some scarey threads on AOL's forum,about some anti-war protestors, who were beaten up by passers by.<br />Many replies were of the "Glad to hear it!" category, and only a few saw the blatent facism of these actions (the "lock-step" you speak of?)..<br />I am not blind to your point.Any American would be in utter shock to learn of this, yet there it is!!<br />These individuals are criminal in my opinion too.<br /><br />I don't know how your allies will get around this "resolve" that the current white house administration preaches about, but it is real.<br />Those who are following thier commander in chief should be 'lock-step' to victory or death, provided that common human rights are not violated. Now how can we seperate this from the tyrany of the street corner brawl?<br /><br />We will not answer attrocities with attrocities. Our form of government will not permit that. The only thing that seperates my country from the Hitleresc fears you envision, is not only democracy, or that we voted for what we have.<br />They voted for Hitler.<br />They voted for Saddam.<br />I could go on and on, but you get the point. There is a diference.<br />The differnce is that resolve President Bush declared two days after the attacks on our civilian and military population that day. ("You are iether with us or against us" ).<br />I just hope none of those anti-war protestors were seriously injured for expressing themselves. It is surely tyrany. Criminal tyrany! Understand wartime resolve,as the history books reveal it. We had "internment camps" on American soil in WW-II !!<br /><br />Nothing like that has gone-down yet. The populus that grew up in isolation will not allow us to box-up the E-Indian population of this country.<br />But the soldiers of Korean and Vietnam "conflicts" remember a different reality,that some of my countrymen cannot comprehand. Some are "still in Siagon".<br />I'm not expecting you to look the other way to such tyrany, Skinnywater. I'm only saying that I'll be marching in lock-step with my commander in chief, in any way I can. I'm too old for the machine rooms of the oridinance carrier, but maybee I can stand on a street corner,and wave "Old Glory" or something. But regardless of what is asked of me, the boss has my coperation.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

The damage to fair debate has already been done 12Footer.<br /> <br />Comrade, while not in lockstep, we're still in this together. <br /><br />God bless America and her Patriots.

 

[Fishbusters]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

I open up this mornings paper and what does the headline say but "4 More wareheads found." I did not have a chance to read the story but I wanted to post the headline here.

 

[12Footer]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

Damage to fair debate? WTH ?<br />And if you are protesting my country's actions, you must be neutral or pro-axis...period.

 

[62_Kiwi]

Re: Oh Mr. President, what now?

I saw the following article in our paper this morning - which demonstrates the USA's objective of removing Saddam, preferably without a war. Looks like one of the options is an exit for Saddam to live in exile... Needless to say, if they get a positive fix on him, he'll be toast before he knows it - let's hope he's not as good at hiding as bin Laden.<br /><br /> Satellites & Top Forces Hunt Saddam