Minn Kota 3hp...anyone have one?

[sam am I]

Bit more info, sequence of things when flex pot is pressed (trace 4)

 

[gm280]

Nice scope sam I am. I have an older Tektronix 454 dual trace. But since it is a CRT setup, I wouldn't mind getting a flat screen scope. And it seems you have at least four channels as well. Niiccceee.

 

[sam am I]

Thx gm, yeah this thing cooks toast I think too!! Geeesh............These Chinese tek/agilent-keysight wanna-be's aren't too bad, this one being very well made and half'ish the price.

I have a few older tek's too but, just can't afford their current stuff of which, most if not all nowadays are developed, assembled by and in the same over sea's manu's building then re-branded with the tek or keysight names and are then sold out at better than twice the price....... One peek inside tells the whole story.......:facepalm:

 

[jeepwm69]

Sorry for the delay guys. I was out of town for the weekend.

Meter I'm using is this one. Cheapie for sure, but apparently has a diode test.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01ISAMUA6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Only way I've used my multimeter is checking batteries. All of the other functions are something I need to learn.

 

[sam am I]

Meter I'm using is this one. Cheapie for sure, but apparently has a diode test.

It'll work just fine if we need it..........

The other side (the white banded side/cathode) should be around 12V = ("12.46V" - 0.5'ish V = 12V) if the diode is good AND is forward conducting current...........(which it should be doing in our current setup and is perhaps why the flex voltages are not there)

First, check that banned/cathode side for 12'ish Volts

= "12.46V" - 0.5'ish V = 12V

All of the other functions are something I need to learn.

Np,

To check the/a *diode..........

1) REMOVE POWER to the board!

2) Set the meter into the "diode check" position.

3) Place the black/negative meter lead on the banded side (cathode) of the diode.

4) Place the red/positive meter lead on the non-banded side (anode) of the diode.

5) The meter will supply adequate current to "forward bias" turning on the diode (meter may beep once) and will display the voltage forward (Vf) at the diodes break-over "knee region" of conduction..........Should be in the neighborhood of *0.5V - 0.7V. (which is basically how it should be preforming in the live circuit that we were testing for above........."12.46V - 0.5'ish V = 12V"

6) Reverse the black and red meter leads on the diode should show an *open circuit. ("OL")

**Can be dependent and vary with inherent circuit configurations and types of diodes**

 

[jeepwm69]

Using the diode check I get 637

If I reversed the leads I get 1 (continuity?)

If I check for voltage on the download with power went to the board, I get nothing with negative probe on negative battery and positive probe on diode, but if I put the negative probe on to positive battery, with positive probe On diode I get -12.5 V on one side, and -12.17 V on the other side

No idea what these readings mean

 

[sam am I]

Using the diode check I get 637

Probably missed the "."

So it's most likely .637 which sound about right. The diode is good

If I reversed the leads I get 1 (continuity?)

Perhaps a "1" on that meter means open, which would be correct then.

but if I put the negative probe on to positive battery, with positive probe On diode I get -12.5 V on one side, and -12.17 V on the other side

Okay, recall the basic setup we had and that you are keeping the meter's negative lead on the battery's negative post..... probe with positive lead to diode.

So with the board powered up, meter set back on DC voltage,

The readings is now +12.5V on the anode of the diode?

And +12.17V on the cathode (white band side) of the diode?

If this is true, power the board back up in our basic setup with the negative meter lead on the battery negative, measure pin #2 of U1
(refer to post #64 to find U1. Note that pin #2 is just to the right of pin #1, see the black IC pic post #21 ) The voltage measurement should be approx 5.75V

 

[sam am I]

Also, are you sure you're checking D1 and not D2?

I measured my D2 and it measures 12.5V and 12.18V.....seems suspiciously close to your measurements

BUT, D1 measures 12.5V and 11.88V.

D1 is closest to the outside edge, see post #64

 

[sam am I]

I think also a little perspective on future meter usage and to perhaps alleviate any confusion when you reverse a meter's +/- leads during a voltage reading is warranted here.......

For example, if you measure "-12.5V" but when you "reverse the leads on the same to points you see "0v"

This, if you think about it, is impossible! If you measure the same two exact points, right?

It has to be either +12.5V in one direction or -12.5V in the other, right?

Perhaps think about it in terms of measuring directly across a battery's +/- posts. In one direction with the leads, the meter reads +12V and the other, the meter reads -12V. The potential difference (the voltage your measuring) has to still be there, you've just changed how your meter referenced the polarity with the reversal of the meter leads.

 

[jeepwm69]

I think also a little perspective on future meter usage and to perhaps alleviate any confusion when you reverse a meter's +/- leads during a voltage reading is warranted here.......

For example, if you measure "-12.5V" but when you "reverse the leads on the same to points you see "0v"

This, if you think about it, is impossible! If you measure the same two exact points, right?

It has to be either +12.5V in one direction or -12.5V in the other, right?

Perhaps think about it in terms of measuring directly across a battery's +/- posts. In one direction with the leads, the meter reads +12V and the other, the meter reads -12V. The potential difference (the voltage your measuring) has to still be there, you've just changed how your meter referenced the polarity with the reversal of the meter leads.

Believe me I sat there thinking about that while I was getting the readings.

I was on the D1 diode. 100% sure on that.

With neg meter probe on neg battery terminal, and positive probe on diode, I got no reading at all.

With neg meter probe on battery pos, and pos probe on diode I got the -12.XX volt readings.

I actually put the pos probe on the diode, and then moved the neg probe from battery neg (no reading) to battery pos (-12.XX reading) to make sure it wasn't getting an intermittent reading or something.

Maybe I can get one of the kids to video the readings on my phone to show you exactly what I'm doing, because I agree, it doesn't make sense.

 

[sam am I]

I was on the D1 diode. 100% sure on that.

k

With neg meter probe on neg battery terminal, and positive probe on diode, I got no reading at all.

But wait........Post #71

So, I swapped those around. Of course now the bottom of the board shows 12V when probed with + probe and - probe on battery ground (like it's supposed to, right?)

You had +12V once. Back up and start again..

Two wire set up again, negative meter lead to negative battery post, probe the foil again where you KNOW you measured +12V previous. A sanity check if you will...........It's (+12V) there still right?

Now move JUST the positive meter probe to the diode (D1).........measure both sides plz.
(Plz don't swap meter leads and wires around anymore, it's confusing you/the readings. Leave the negative probe on the battery negative post until further notice

)

The foil area you just checked again here and back in post #71, told me you had +12V, is the SAME electrical point as the anode (non-banded) side of D1.

See the schematic post #69 and the pic's below.........A "via" is a printed circuit board's electrical method of connecting top layer traces (foils) to bottom layer traces (foils).


It has to be +12V still...........no magic.

Or...........

gm.........you were nice to the via's weren't you? It looks like when you removed the old relay's, you had to de-solder a relay lead from that via...............Is this a smoking gun?

jeep.......focus!!, We needs some stable readings, lol, I smell victory.

 

[gm280]

sam am I, that via is a very good possibility. When I remove one of the relays there was a feed through that came out with the relay pin, now that I think of it, and when I installed the new ones, I solder it up and didn't think about installing another. So before going too much further, verify both sides of the board read continuity. If not, you can easily drill a small hole and install a piece of wire and solder both sides and it will work. I actually have an assortment of via's and feed through here and didn't even think about the new relays. DUH. :stupid:

 

[sam am I]

Thx gm..........no worries, slice of cake!!


jeep!

Warm up the soldering iron, you might just get to install a jumper wire!!

Lets make sure tho first eh? Re-take the above measurement as prescribed just above in post #91 and we'll go from there.........As such,

We might have an open, see below



If so, we can add this jumper wire, i think that might be the simplest way about a repair......See drawn in proposed red wire below.



Once soldered, the wire can be laid back on the board and tak'd with hot glued to hold it in place.

 

[gm280]

Okay I hope that last picture you shown is of another board and not the one I repaired. Because I know all the soldering on the one I repaired was near perfect and I see a ton of iffy places on that picture.

You could always drill about a 1/16" hole through the board and solder a straight solid piece of wire on both side and be good to go again. Heck even a cut off lead from a resistor would work great. Just an idea, if the continuity isn't there. JMHO

 

[jeepwm69]

k



But wait........Post #71



You had +12V once. Back up and start again..

Two wire set up again, negative meter lead to negative battery post, probe the foil again where you KNOW you measured +12V previous. A sanity check if you will...........It's (+12V) there still right?

Now move JUST the positive meter probe to the diode (D1).........measure both sides plz.
(Plz don't swap meter leads and wires around anymore, it's confusing you/the readings. Leave the negative probe on the battery negative post until further notice

)

The foil area you just checked again here and back in post #71, told me you had +12V, is the SAME electrical point as the anode (non-banded) side of D1.

See the schematic post #69 and the pic's below.........A "via" is a printed circuit board's electrical method of connecting top layer traces (foils) to bottom layer traces (foils).


It has to be +12V still...........no magic.

Or...........

gm.........you were nice to the via's weren't you? It looks like when you removed the old relay's, you had to de-solder a relay lead from that via...............Is this a smoking gun?

jeep.......focus!!, We needs some stable readings, lol, I smell victory.

I'll check those spots out. I did briefly look at all the little connections and wonder if there was simply a break in the connectivity somewhere.

I'm the king of splicing wires in to bypass electrical problems. LOL

 

[sam am I]

Okay I hope that last picture you shown is of another board and not the one I repaired. Because I know all the soldering on the one I repaired was near perfect and I see a ton of iffy places on that picture.

Ummmm, post #18 pic #2 gm............:noidea:

 

[sam am I]

I'm the king of splicing wires in to bypass electrical problems. LOL

Cool!..........Done a few myself over the years, I've used kynar 28 awg or 26 awg typically in low current sig app's such as this. Usually bend lil hooks on each end, tin the ends, melt the solder on the pcb and hook the tinned ends on the protruding component leads.

Solid telephone wire works well in a pinch too..........

 

[gm280]

Ummmm, post #18 pic #2 gm............:noidea:

Oh yes, one of the pictures I posted with the parts removed. I guess it looks better after replacing the parts and soldering them. Actually telephone solid wire would work perfect to provide a via from one side to the other.

I have a circuit board repair kit with eyelets and feed through's and pads and even different size runs that you can use to repair most any circuit board.

I will be watching this thread. I want this TM to "Come Alive" again. Yea, watched too much Frankenstein movies I guess. :facepalm:

 

[sam am I]

Actually telephone solid wire would work perfect to provide a via from one side to the other.

Yup.........However, in this specific case (a candidate two layer board) gm, the two traces that need to be reconnected with a proposed wire in drill hole won't work so well as the two traces in question aren't over lapping/crossing over each other in any particular area.

I'm thinking where jeep is at and guessing what he has to work with, just a point to point solid jumper wire (tele or kynar, whatever) would be better advised.

I want this TM to "Come Alive" again.

I think we're close gm

 

[jeepwm69]

No Title

Just to be clear, I should have 12V here right? I do not. If that's where I need 12V I will try a jumper.

Just don't want to fry anything.