Labor Unions

Barlow

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 11, 2003
Messages
1,794
I created this from another topics conversation.<br /><br />well, what did I do to set you off?
 

rolmops

Vice Admiral
Joined
Feb 24, 2002
Messages
5,342
Re: Labor Unions

Unite workers of this world,you have nothing to loose but your bonds.<br />Religion is opium of the people.<br />I know a few more slogans written by my buddy Charlie Marx, but I suspect It would turn me into a suspect.Maybe I should just stick to my other buddy , mr Engels who happened to be a good friend of Charlie.<br />By the way,neither of these 2 guys ever claimed that property is theft.This slogan uttered by a frenchman fifty years earlier, allowed the heirs to the theory to steal everything that was not tied down and call it equality.<br />By the way,I am a proud member of the CSEA local in Upstate New York.<br />Black russians are great!!
 

Barlow

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 11, 2003
Messages
1,794
Re: Labor Unions

Crown Royal night for me.. <br /><br />don't worry .. they'll make more!
 

Barlow

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 11, 2003
Messages
1,794
Re: Labor Unions

Geesh ... pjc calls me a knob then disapears..<br /><br />what ever- this definately solidifies my text.
 

pjc

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jun 29, 2003
Messages
1,856
Re: Labor Unions

disapears is correctly spelled "disappears" Barlow. Sure, there are a portion of represented employees who "play the game" and use their status as a represented employee to benefit their own interest. Just as there are a portion of non-represented employees who behave in a manor that harms co-workers, thus furthering their career path. Ya know, the brown noses, smile in your face then stab ya behind a closed door meeting. That is the nature of office politics. IMO, such political games are detrimental to a business, time and energy wasted, shifting focus from productive activity.<br /><br />Your position of painting with a very broad brush that all Labor Union are harmful is a statement perhaps from the perspective of a person who has had a negative experience as a represented employee?<br /><br />I will copy/paste my post from the other topic to which you refer:<br />"[ EDIT ]<br />I just know your post flaming unions was all in fun, right [EDIT: out of respect due to all Iboats members I have removed commentary I posted that may be perceived as not appropriate]<br /><br />I be so sick of knobs beating on blue collar organized labor I see RED. Why don't ya beat on teachers unions, the lawyers Bar Association, the AMA (physicians union dude), the actors guild, keeerist, all professional groups that organize for like minded reasons and collective representation!! And knob radio talkers like Belling that beat the unions up even though Belling works under the guidelines of a contract he has with Clear Channel. Seems to me an individual legally binding contract with an employer is of no distinct difference than a like contract many folks (a union local) have with their employer. HA!!!<br /><br />sorry for the rant..am so sick of the union bashing and blaming same for loss of US jobs. I guess that all the white collar tech jobs that are in the pacific rim due to outsourcing must have been union jobs too hey!!!!!! "<br /><br />And I will copy/paste what Barlow posted that prompted the post of mine:<br />"quote:<br />--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<br />Originally posted by Twidget:<br />But what if they cant DO, or TEACH? <br />--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<br /><br />Then they join a labor Union and screw over ever company they work for and every person they work with.. just to have the Union reps (who fall into the same catagory) protect them as VALUED employees.. "<br /><br />Barlow, care to elaborate regarding what that truly means???
 

12Footer

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Mar 25, 2001
Messages
8,217
Re: Labor Unions

"Unions are the opiate of the masses"-12Footer,2005
 

BoatBuoy

Rear Admiral
Joined
May 29, 2004
Messages
4,856
Re: Labor Unions

Wonder how many non-union iboaters "screw" over their company reading/posting here using company-owned time and resources? Just a thought.
 

12Footer

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Mar 25, 2001
Messages
8,217
Re: Labor Unions

Wonder how many union ones do too, don't you?
 

pjc

Lieutenant Commander
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Jun 29, 2003
Messages
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Re: Labor Unions

Great point,....thank you BoatBuoy! You too 12.
 

KaGee

Admiral
Joined
Aug 14, 2004
Messages
7,069
Re: Labor Unions

I have never been associated with any union.<br /><br />Let's just say that on my list of people and organizations that contribute the most to society, unions rate right up there with trial lawyers.<br /><br />Shuttin up now before I get started.
 

Bigfun

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jan 21, 2003
Messages
305
Re: Labor Unions

I have experience with 2 unions. One was in a welding shop the other retail sales. I have nothing positive to say about either one. The welding shop shut down and the retailer is now struggling to compeat against wal-mart.<br /> IMO, unions protect the least productive workers, they discourage workers from excelling, they create and want a atmosphere of antagonism between managment and union workers, they take your dues and send them to liberal politicians and/or causes.<br /><br />www.mackinac.org Mackinac center for public policy.<br />www.nrtw.org National right to work legal defense foundation
 

pjc

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jun 29, 2003
Messages
1,856
Re: Labor Unions

A point I will make is this: A labor agreement is a legally binding contract that is negotiated AND agreed upon by mutual consensus of the negotiating parties. Simple and undeniable. Be mindful that "management", "the company", are one of the negotiating parties. Therefore, management finds that the "contract" is acceptable to the best interests of the company. <br /><br />You must agree that management accepts, and is supportive of, the language that is contained within the "contract". As well as the "Union".<br /><br />An aside..I would imagine most folks P&M about their auto insurance, home owners insurance, medical insurance, belly aching about what a rip off the premiums are. But, my G-D, when it is time to exercise your rights to file a claim you are delighted that you have the insurance coverage that protects you and your assets. <br /><br />Could be said that Union Dues provide similar coverage. <br /><br />To KaGee...please contribute and enlighten myself and others regarding the factual and logical data you used to form the basis upon which your post above is premised.<br /><br />"Let's just say that on my list of people and organizations that contribute the most to society, unions rate right up there with trial lawyers."
 

pjc

Lieutenant Commander
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Jun 29, 2003
Messages
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Re: Labor Unions

Bigfun, were you a represented employee at those businesses you noted above?? <br /><br />Please expand as to why in particular the weld shop closed and the WallyWorld competitor is failing. Perhaps the retailers business model is not as successful as Walmarts.
 

BoatBuoy

Rear Admiral
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May 29, 2004
Messages
4,856
Re: Labor Unions

WRT least productive:<br />IMO, the least productive employees are not the union workers, it's management. At least the union workers get SOMETHING done, or the company would be out of business. Management neither builds, creates, modifies, assemblies, or otherwise does anything but look important and pretty.
 

Twidget

Commander
Joined
Jun 16, 2004
Messages
2,192
Re: Labor Unions

I believe there are good points and bad points to most unions. At the time they were instituted, they were very badly needed. If they totally disappear, they will be very badly needed again. Human nature.<br /><br />On the other hand, BB, you are painting management with the broad brush that others are accused of using on union workers. Management 'manages', it doesn't perform 'manual labor'. If that offends, I apologize, its just the way it is.<br /><br />As an note to where I am coming from. Texas is a right to work state, so unions dont have the power here they do in some areas. I am a remote employee, so I am in no way a manager(unless you count managing myself.)
 

BoatBuoy

Rear Admiral
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Re: Labor Unions

Twidget, yea I know and I agree with you. Just tryin' to liven up the thread a little.
 

Barlow

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 11, 2003
Messages
1,794
Re: Labor Unions

ok .. breathe pjc .. sorry for type-o.. hope it didn't offend anyone else.<br /><br />I've never been a member of a labor union.<br /><br />however .. I've had my fill of experience dealing with both the 'union house' and their labor forces.<br /><br />sorry to cut this short but, I need to get to a job site to show union carpenters how to fix their F-ups ... something else comming from "Master Craftsman" of a union shop..<br /><br />I'm betting that I'm at least 10-15yrs younger than the guys I'm going to go "train" right now..<br /><br /><br />pardon the sarcasm but true .. and I'll respond further when I return tomarrow.<br /><br />pjc- no need to get worked up like you are .. I'm actually used to doing this now.<br /><br />have a good weekend all..
 

Bigfun

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jan 21, 2003
Messages
305
Re: Labor Unions

Pjc, yes I was and am represented and resented by morons.<br /><br /> Weld shop was a part of Kyser[sp] industries. I left 2 years before the shutdown. Why they shut down? I don't know but it probibly had somthing to do with profitability.<br /><br />The retailer has a business model that includes the union, wal-mart's model does'nt.
 

pjc

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jun 29, 2003
Messages
1,856
Re: Labor Unions

Twidget quote: <br />"On the other hand, BB, you are painting management with the broad brush that others are accused of using on union workers. Management 'manages', it doesn't perform 'manual labor'. If that offends, I apologize, its just the way it is."<br /><br />Yes my friend..that is the very premise that I live by as a represented employee. I rely upon "management" to create a process or system that will enable me to "do" work that is of the most efficient and profitable for the company! I do indeed recognize that management is the expert in building this scenario. Hopefully, there is a partnership between labor and management to discover what the true challenges, "bumps in the road", if you will, that could affect a given process. And ALL input from those people are given due consideration to build the best process or system.<br /><br />A huge challenge for all concerned is how to address those members whose input is BS and ensure them that, "yep, we hear you and have listened to what you contributed, but this is the path that this company will pursue". That "" applies to both labor as well as managers. I do believe that I am an expert and most qualified regarding specific talents I posses. And I can contribute valuable input into the process being developed. But...my input may be of a focus that may not fit the larger picture of what management is visualizing. Or the other way around, such as managers building their fiefdom regardless of the larger affect on the business.
 

pjc

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jun 29, 2003
Messages
1,856
Re: Labor Unions

thanks for the cloaked bash Barlow. Not worked up too much Barlow.......just that I do take exception when an obvious unenlightened opinion makes rash and irresponsible commentary. So kind of you by the way to contribute your vast expertise to those carpenters who may be working from engineering drawings you or those professionals like yourself may have created. <br /><br />BTW, I myself have been both professional salaried and represented hourly for the tenure of my 30+ year working career. I do believe that I have a valuable perspective, and not a mere snapshot of, working business dynamics.<br /><br />Thank You So Much.
 
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