Intex Mariner 4 modifications and Tips

[ScottishScript]

Good research techniques Scottish.
Problem here in the US, our history doesn't date back like other countries but there is a lot to find in the U.S. and North America.
I do research like you stated, I have access to very old and accurate maps plus data bases (helps to have friends and relatives who work/worked in high places lol).
The reasons I keep mentioning your area is because its beautiful there and I have a fondness for castles. I have detected many castles in other countries and love it.

It sounds crazy but the Mariner 4 is turning out to be a good detecting transport and even a diving platform (yes there are better boats for diving but this one is doing good so far and with a bow board/platform like you made will make it even better).

Thanks for your reply and good ideas, greatly appreciated!

Research is everything, not so much for finding things but for avoiding a thousand blind alleys.

And yeah America's history might not match that known this side of the pond, but my basic research over the years suggests there have been civilisations around there for which there are a few clues. I mean you have pyramids down there in the Mississippi delta from a lost people. There were plenty of people predating the Native Americans, but they don't like to publicise it too much.

http://discovermagazine.com/2004/feb/uncovering-americas-pyramid-builders

Then there's some really weird pyramid structures found recently in Bosnia of all places. However the establishment archaeologists are up in arms about exactly what they are.

http://www.bosnianpyramids.org/index.php?id=49&lang=en

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/05/pyramid-bosnia-1_2.html

And let me just point out, archaeology is one of the most close minded and least scientific fields you can find, which leaves the door open to amateurs to make monkeys out of them.

And I'm guessing you've already seen this stuff?

http://listverse.com/2013/05/20/10-mysterious-underwater-anomalies/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rq2cvO-7TKc

If I were over there I'd be out in my M4 looking for the next underwater pyramid. There's still plenty unknown to be known.

 

[ScottishScript]

I pulled the handle off. The issue is the "notch" feeling your feel when you extend the handle is from a raised peg with a spring loaded ball bearing which catches in a small indentation at every stop of the extension movement. Minn Kota failed to put some type of "stop" tab when the handle is extended past the final extension point. So, If you keep pulling, it pulls right off the motor. It is a design defect.

I had it coming off when I still had the notch feeling, but now after losing the 'bearing' that covered the spring, the notch feeling is gone and it just comes off smoothly.

I managed to find the spring, but not the' bearing.' Thought about using another bearing from somewhere then use it to pin the spring down then cover loosely with duct tape to see if I can retrieve the notch. But I don't know.

Minn Kota owes us a new tiller me thinks.

You use the Weedless Wedge Stark? Notice extra thrust with it if you do?

 

[IN Mariner4]

Scottish,
I am laughing hard right now after your comment about making the comment "archaeology is one of the most close minded and least scientific fields you can find, which leaves the door open to amateurs to make monkeys out of them". I copied your post and let my uncle read it, he is/was (retired now) an Archaeologist and I am always messing with him about he makes a living playing in the dirt, he loved the monkey comment and said it is true

You are right, there is a lot to find here and things not yet discovered!! Thanks for all of those links and information. It looks like you have an interest in history and exploration too. If I ever make it your way I will buy you dinner and we will hoist a few liquids together.

While discussing this post with him (still laughing and having a hard time typing ), I told him about our boats and what I am doing with mine. He gave me some ideas that a fellow archaeologist of his did to a similar boat. He didn't know the boat type but it sounds like the Excursion 5 or similar (this was back in 1990 or so, not sure if the excursion was out then) but anyways he made a boarding ladder out of webbing for getting back in the boat easier with diving gear (like I did already), he made mounting clips (like our Oar holders/clips) for his detectors, had a sonar mount that retracted/collapsed when transporting (like some have done with fish finders), and a few mods to the floor and small storage bins. He is going to call the guy and see if he has any photos and will send them. He also said that the boat had a bow platform (like yours I am guessing) that he strapped his tanks onto..... To keep this short, I will look into the ideas and post them here if they look like they can be done to out boats.

My wife is now saying that by the time I am done the Mariner 4 will look like an exploration boat , but she is very happy with the Mariner 4 and loves to go out in it. She even wants to go out on it on Mother's Day and celebrate on the water (if it is not raining).

Sorry for the long post, thanks for your thoughts and making me laugh!

 

[IN Mariner4]

I had it coming off when I still had the notch feeling, but now after losing the 'bearing' that covered the spring, the notch feeling is gone and it just comes off smoothly.

I managed to find the spring, but not the' bearing.' Thought about using another bearing from somewhere then use it to pin the spring down then cover loosely with duct tape to see if I can retrieve the notch. But I don't know.

Minn Kota owes us a new tiller me thinks.

You use the Weedless Wedge Stark? Notice extra thrust with it if you do?

I am looking at my Minn Kota Endura's manual and the diagram showing the handle. If I understand the issue correctly, it is the "ball detent" (their names) that is coming loose or out. I am thinking maybe you could use a slightly larger bearing (Ball in their terms) i.e. if it is .08 maybe a .09 (I do not know the size and they do not even show the bearing/ball in the parts diagram for my TM). I am not sure if the duct tape would be a good idea because it would not provide the rolling of the ball but how about using silicone or bearing grease to semi-hold it in place? Just trying to think of ideas here...

 

[Starkonian]

I'm thinking the best potential fix would be to remove the head cover and install a "stop" of some kind at the end of the tiller which would catch on the case. Maybe a screw inserted half way or...? I talked to a Minn Kota service man, sounded like some guy working out of his garage. He confirmed it's a manu defect. He said he's wrapped a zip tie at the end, after taking the cover off, and it may hold if not pulled too hard. Pretty lame technique imo. He said he'd do it but I'd have to pay for it...what??? Minn Kota asked for my receipt and serial number after I told them they need to remedy this. I'm waiting for their response.

 

[Starkonian]

Here's Minn Kota's response: "I will do an order tomorrow, and send you a new part." I asked for an explanation of what part and if this will prevent it from happening again. As it stands now, I wouldn't hesitate a second to buy an ebay motor for half the price and twice the thrust.

 

[ScottishScript]

Scottish,
I am laughing hard right now after your comment about making the comment "archaeology is one of the most close minded and least scientific fields you can find, which leaves the door open to amateurs to make monkeys out of them". I copied your post and let my uncle read it, he is/was (retired now) an Archaeologist and I am always messing with him about he makes a living playing in the dirt, he loved the monkey comment and said it is true

You are right, there is a lot to find here and things not yet discovered!! Thanks for all of those links and information. It looks like you have an interest in history and exploration too. If I ever make it your way I will buy you dinner and we will hoist a few liquids together.

While discussing this post with him (still laughing and having a hard time typing ), I told him about our boats and what I am doing with mine. He gave me some ideas that a fellow archaeologist of his did to a similar boat. He didn't know the boat type but it sounds like the Excursion 5 or similar (this was back in 1990 or so, not sure if the excursion was out then) but anyways he made a boarding ladder out of webbing for getting back in the boat easier with diving gear (like I did already), he made mounting clips (like our Oar holders/clips) for his detectors, had a sonar mount that retracted/collapsed when transporting (like some have done with fish finders), and a few mods to the floor and small storage bins. He is going to call the guy and see if he has any photos and will send them. He also said that the boat had a bow platform (like yours I am guessing) that he strapped his tanks onto..... To keep this short, I will look into the ideas and post them here if they look like they can be done to out boats.

My wife is now saying that by the time I am done the Mariner 4 will look like an exploration boat , but she is very happy with the Mariner 4 and loves to go out in it. She even wants to go out on it on Mother's Day and celebrate on the water (if it is not raining).

Sorry for the long post, thanks for your thoughts and making me laugh!

Glad you got a laugh. And yeah I have an interest in history as well as alternative history, which is just history before the establishment accepts it.

Something else you might consider, just buy a mid sized cheapo dinghy for $40 which you can tow behind the M4 with all your gear in it. Fit it with a small strap down tarp to hold all the gear in place and pull it alongside when you need something. This would totally free up the M4 for getting changed and prepped. Something like this.

http://www.bluerushshop.co.uk/bestway-rx-inflatable-rubber-dinghy--boat-4151-p.asp

When you stop to dive, strap it to the side of the M4 as a counterweight for when you climb in and out of the M4 using your ladder. And speaking of ladders, check out the boarding ladders section at West Marine.com.

According to that your best bet might be an actual aluminum ladder. However I would bolt it to the wooden floor rather than the boat itself to avoid wear and tear.

 

[ScottishScript]

I'm thinking the best potential fix would be to remove the head cover and install a "stop" of some kind at the end of the tiller which would catch on the case. Maybe a screw inserted half way or...? I talked to a Minn Kota service man, sounded like some guy working out of his garage. He confirmed it's a manu defect. He said he's wrapped a zip tie at the end, after taking the cover off, and it may hold if not pulled too hard. Pretty lame technique imo. He said he'd do it but I'd have to pay for it...what??? Minn Kota asked for my receipt and serial number after I told them they need to remedy this. I'm waiting for their response.

Funny that, the closest Minn Kota repair guy I could find was also a garage, one specialising in exotic cars. Not sure if that's a good or a bad thing.

Looking forward to what they come back to you with.

 

[ScottishScript]

Here's Minn Kota's response: "I will do an order tomorrow, and send you a new part." I asked for an explanation of what part and if this will prevent it from happening again. As it stands now, I wouldn't hesitate a second to buy an ebay motor for half the price and twice the thrust.

Well that's not good enough is it?

My MK is working fine right now, but what happens when that handle no longer does its job. And honestly there can be no standard fix for what is in fact a design flaw. And you're absolutely right, if they cannot remedy basic stuff like this competently, people are just going to try their luck with their cut price competitors.

 

[IN Mariner4]

Well that's not good enough is it?
..... if they cannot remedy basic stuff like this competently, people are just going to try their luck with their cut price competitors.

This is so true.... Maybe they should do a product recall if this is a common problem. I have read a lot of reviews before buying mine and I do not remember reading about this issue, I think the worse I saw was it would stick or semi-hard to turn speed control (tiller). I think if it is a manufacturing defect they should do the recall, what happens when one of us is out in the middle of no where and it comes off or loses control and rams another boat or have an accident... lawsuit time...
Just my warped 2 cents on the subject

 

[IN Mariner4]

Glad you got a laugh. And yeah I have an interest in history as well as alternative history, which is just history before the establishment accepts it.

Something else you might consider, just buy a mid sized cheapo dinghy for $40 which you can tow behind the M4 with all your gear in it. Fit it with a small strap down tarp to hold all the gear in place and pull it alongside when you need something. This would totally free up the M4 for getting changed and prepped. Something like this.

http://www.bluerushshop.co.uk/bestway-rx-inflatable-rubber-dinghy--boat-4151-p.asp

When you stop to dive, strap it to the side of the M4 as a counterweight for when you climb in and out of the M4 using your ladder. And speaking of ladders, check out the boarding ladders section at West Marine.com.

According to that your best bet might be an actual aluminum ladder. However I would bolt it to the wooden floor rather than the boat itself to avoid wear and tear.

I love history and your "alternative" too. To me alternative is what is fact and not how the powers that be reports it. As you know, especially in the states, the history we were taught when growing up (at least in my parents' day and my day ) is not totally accurate and is biased by the publishers, agencies and governments. There has been "new discoveries" that prove that some topics have been wrong etc... I always say that history is HIS- STORY, meaning that it all depends upon who is telling the story (does that make sense or am I too tired trying to put thoughts to message).

I have thought about a smaller boat/raft/dinghy but am concerned about it causing a lot of drag and eating up more battery "juice". I did get my second battery today and will run it parallel. I am tossing the idea of a 3 hp outboard for the river though, but want to get all mods done first and make sure I will need it. Have you towed anything behind your boat yet? I think even a small one person would do the job if I went that route of towing one behind.

I am happy with my web ladder for now but will look into your idea. I am all for new and improved ideas .

So as of right now my current projects for this week are a) Bow board like yours; b) a dolly (I was going with JC's idea but came up a set up that mounts to the transom/engine mount and folds up out of the water when boating/after launch, like some I have seen on the Zodiacs), c) attaching more d-rings for holding gear, d) get the replacement swivel seat mounts (I got the wrong ones :-( ). and e) make a board across the stern so that I can mount a light for night fishing/boating as required by Indiana law.

Once again, thanks for the information Scottish and the laugh (still laughing at the monkeys ).

 

[IN Mariner4]

IN Mariner4,
The only end caps I used were on the 1.25" PVC, not the 1". Below is what the axel looks like minus the end caps.
Also, I don't think you'll need straps. The weight will hold our boats in place between the bunkers. I'm able to hold a few things without putting to much stress on the dolly.

I started making the dolly from your idea but got delayed on getting more PVC (had enough for just part of it). I thought of another way of doing one. I am going to take two wheels and mount them to a frame that will mount to the engine mount. This frame will have a hinge that will allow the wheels and supports to swing up when not in use and down when in use. I THINK this will work, at least in my noggin it will. I am not sure if it will be strong enough but will try it out. Once I finish painting it (it is steel pipe) and finish mounting it to the engine mount I will report back and show photos etc... I got the idea from other boats (I believe the Zodiacs and others) that have wheels mounted that swing up. Granted I am not sure I like the idea of wheels sticking up in the stern but I like the idea of not running back to the truck/car to get the dolly. This way I can load the whole boat up in the bed of the truck, pull up away from the boat ramp, wheel it to the ramp and launch without loading there. Then when leaving all I have to do is drop the wheels, pull boat out of water, and wheel to truck and load back into. At least thats my thoughts. if it doesn't work I will continue with your design. The whole object is to be able to do it all by myself and quickly. Granted the scuba tanks will add a lot of weight but if I have to load those separately, it will still be quicker.

 

[ScottishScript]

I love history and your "alternative" too. To me alternative is what is fact and not how the powers that be reports it. As you know, especially in the states, the history we were taught when growing up (at least in my parents' day and my day ) is not totally accurate and is biased by the publishers, agencies and governments. There has been "new discoveries" that prove that some topics have been wrong etc... I always say that history is HIS- STORY, meaning that it all depends upon who is telling the story (does that make sense or am I too tired trying to put thoughts to message).

I have thought about a smaller boat/raft/dinghy but am concerned about it causing a lot of drag and eating up more battery "juice". I did get my second battery today and will run it parallel. I am tossing the idea of a 3 hp outboard for the river though, but want to get all mods done first and make sure I will need it. Have you towed anything behind your boat yet? I think even a small one person would do the job if I went that route of towing one behind.

I am happy with my web ladder for now but will look into your idea. I am all for new and improved ideas .

So as of right now my current projects for this week are a) Bow board like yours; b) a dolly (I was going with JC's idea but came up a set up that mounts to the transom/engine mount and folds up out of the water when boating/after launch, like some I have seen on the Zodiacs), c) attaching more d-rings for holding gear, d) get the replacement swivel seat mounts (I got the wrong ones :-( ). and e) make a board across the stern so that I can mount a light for night fishing/boating as required by Indiana law.

Once again, thanks for the information Scottish and the laugh (still laughing at the monkeys ).

I have not towed anything behind the M4, but thinking about your needs, towing a smaller cheapo dinghy on a rope is definitely out.

For one, you don't want a rope anywhere near your prop as you know what will happen. Two, it's just not an efficient way to drag something along. Wind and currents could cause chaos when at slow speeds or stationary.

I think your best bet is a custom job. I'm thinking two poles about four to five foot long connected to the rear of your transom via hinges or ball socket joints. On the other end of the poles bungee cords which connect to two D-rings on the cheapo dinghy.

This should not only keep the tow dinghy close, but it should turn instantly as you turn the M4, whereas a tow rope has zero control. Make sense?

 

[Starkonian]

Well that's not good enough is it?

My MK is working fine right now, but what happens when that handle no longer does its job. And honestly there can be no standard fix for what is in fact a design flaw. And you're absolutely right, if they cannot remedy basic stuff like this competently, people are just going to try their luck with their cut price competitors.

Minn Kota told me they were sending me the inner handle assembly part #56. It didn't look right so I called them and spoke with someone else. The now say I need the outer handle assembly and there is a "bearing" which should keep the handle from pulling off but is missing or malfunctioning. They asked for the ID of their service guy who said it was a manu defect. Here's the manuals description of the initial outer handle assembly-

"3. Push the outer handle into the control box until handle ?clicks? into place. The handle is held in place with locking fingers, so some force may be required to lock the handles together."

These locking fingers are the bearing they now describe? Not much confidence inspired after almost being sent the wrong part. I'm anxious to examine the part and see these locking fingers for myself. Anyways, if that's the fix, you can order both the inner and out handle assemblies for around $10 total and install it yourself or have that local car dealership install it for you. )

 

[ScottishScript]

Minn Kota told me they were sending me the inner handle assembly part #56. It didn't look right so I called them and spoke with someone else. The now say I need the outer handle assembly and there is a "bearing" which should keep the handle from pulling off but is missing or malfunctioning. They asked for the ID of their service guy who said it was a manu defect. Here's the manuals description of the initial outer handle assembly-

"3. Push the outer handle into the control box until handle “clicks” into place. The handle is held in place with locking fingers, so some force may be required to lock the handles together."

These locking fingers are the bearing they now describe? Not much confidence inspired after almost being sent the wrong part. I'm anxious to examine the part and see these locking fingers for myself. Anyways, if that's the fix, you can order both the inner and out handle assemblies for around $10 total and install it yourself or have that local car dealership install it for you. )

Thanks for that Stark.

At this point I'd like to give Minn Kota a locked finger myself, one locked firmly in the upright position.

Tell me how you get on with the part and I may very well venture to the mysterious Minn Kota dealership up north to get mine fixed.

 

[IN Mariner4]

I think your best bet is a custom job. I'm thinking two poles about four to five foot long connected to the rear of your transom via hinges or ball socket joints. On the other end of the poles bungee cords which connect to two D-rings on the cheapo dinghy.

This should not only keep the tow dinghy close, but it should turn instantly as you turn the M4, whereas a tow rope has zero control. Make sense?

That makes good sense and is a good idea.
I just got done with my work and BS around here, so tomorrow I will be out in the garage continuing the mods unless it doesn't thunderstorm tomorrow and if it doesnt i will be out on the water mapping a location I want to go to.

 

[IN Mariner4]

JC,

I worked on my idea for a built in dolly/wheels today. Had them mounted up and looking good....until I wheeled it out of the garage to the truck. Then they collapsed. LOL. I am working on a new brace for it than if that doesn't work I will finish on your design.

 

[Starkonian]

Thanks for that Stark.

At this point I'd like to give Minn Kota a locked finger myself, one locked firmly in the upright position.

Tell me how you get on with the part and I may very well venture to the mysterious Minn Kota dealership up north to get mine fixed.

Scottish-
I received a shipped confirmation from Minn Kota today. They've shipped the inner handle assembly after they told me I need the outer handle assembly. They also attached these instructions and from I can tell, don't look like the inner handle assembly I see when I pull the outer handle off my motor. This is getting comical. I'd be irate if my motor wasn't functional.
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Edit: Looks like they are sending me both the inner and outer handle assembly. Trying to figure out why...

 

[ScottishScript]

Scottish-
I received a shipped confirmation from Minn Kota today. They've shipped the inner handle assembly after they told me I need the outer handle assembly. They also attached these instructions and from I can tell, don't look like the inner handle assembly I see when I pull the outer handle off my motor. This is getting comical. I'd be irate if my motor wasn't functional.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Edit: Looks like they are sending me both the inner and outer handle assembly. Trying to figure out why...

It would appear they have no idea what they are doing. But this keep this up and they may send you a whole new engine.

 

[Starkonian]

It would appear they have no idea what they are doing. But this keep this up and they may send you a whole new engine.

This is what they say, "Typically, the outer handle will take care of the issue. At this point, it is up to you whether you want to replace both. Replacing both would more than likely take care of anything else that may have happened."

I'm tired of them at this point. Their warranty support/communication is crap. I'm kicking myself I didn't spend the extra $50 for an Ebay motor with twice the thrust. Live and learn. I'll post on what happens with the part install.