I really want to understand

Bassy

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Aug 15, 2003
Messages
1,795
Hey, I really want to understand what those of you who will vote for Kerry are going by. Sincerely, would someone please explain what reasons you have? Please help me to understand. e-mail me at bassy123456@yahoo.com.<br /> This isn't a joke, I really want to understand.<br />Bassy
 

Boomyal

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Aug 16, 2003
Messages
12,072
Re: I really want to understand

Well Bassy, as you might know, I am not going to vote for John Kerry. However, here are the reasons that people will vote against George Bush. It is already established that hardly anyone will actually vote for John Kerry, just against GW.<br /><br />He lied to us about WMD's, even though JK saw the same intelligence.<br />He lost millions of jobs, even though the recession started the last two quarter of Clinton's presidency.<br />He gave tax cuts to the rich, even though Bill Clinton raised the top marginal tax rate in the biggest tax increase in modern history.<br />He wears his faith on his sleeve, even though JK never misses an opportunity to tell us how good a Catholic he is.<br />He's only out for Big Oil.<br />He's against Women's Choice, even though that means the continued killing of millions of unborn and nearborn babies.<br />He's pro gun.<br />He's for eliminating reverse discrimination.<br />Oh, and he ruined Clinton's budget surplus.<br />He has a Bible based sense of right and wrong.<br />He wants to destroy Social Security, even though he would like a program that is divorced from the mis-used, underfunded current program.<br />He want's you to be able to set foot in the public forests.<br />He believes in developing our own natural resources.<br />He believes that marraige is between a man and a women.<br />His Homeland Security is too intrusive but he's not doing enough to protect America from terrorism.<br />He does not think it necessary to wait for approval from the 'world village', before the US acts in it's own interest.<br />He believes, more, in the power and sanctity of the individual over government programs.<br /><br />In otherwords Bassy, back to that question you posed for your class, a while back, GW is a conservative(admittidly not a perfect one) and conservatism is an absolute anathema to the modern Democratic Party.
 

SlowlySinking

Master Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Oct 31, 2002
Messages
897
Re: I really want to understand

At first it was to honor his war record but now it's for his wife's social grace and honesty. ;)
 

Boomyal

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Aug 16, 2003
Messages
12,072
Re: I really want to understand

Originally posted by SlowlySinking:<br /> At first it was to honor his war record but now it's for his wife's social grace and honesty. ;)
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kd6nem

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jul 25, 2003
Messages
576
Re: I really want to understand

Bassy,<br />Let us know if you get any answers which are intellectually honest, logical, have the facts straight, and otherwise make sense. Of course, being a conservative, my preconceived notion is that the odds of that are pretty much one divided by infinity... ;)
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: I really want to understand

BP,<br /><br />I like your math......<br /><br />Bassy,<br /><br />Make sure that anyone who answers you has approval to do so. :) <br /><br />Chris.................<br />Against our 'hand holding' society.
 

Fly Rod

Commander
Joined
Oct 31, 2002
Messages
2,622
Re: I really want to understand

:) After listening to JK's speech the other night why wouldn't you vote for him!!!!<br /><br />He has promised free medical for all!!!; no more HMO picked doctors, you will have freedom of choice!!! and free pills for the elderly,they won't have to cut their pills in half any more!!!<br /><br />How can ya beat that????<br /><br />And he never mentioned who was going to pay for all the above!!!! 'TAXES!! TAXES!!! ;) :cool: TAXES!!!"
 

POINTER94

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 12, 2003
Messages
5,031
Re: I really want to understand

Just a note when they tell you how miserable you should be to be an American here are some stat's from the countries we "should" be emulating, regarding their unemployment rates. Remember this is the worst economy of the past 100 years-JFK.<br /><br />USA - 5.6% http://stats.bls.gov/ <br /><br />Sweden: 5.8% http://www.scb.se/templates/tableOrChart____23325.asp <br /><br />Canada: 7.3% http://www.statcan.ca/start.html <br /><br />France: 9.6% It must be considered that France has a 35hr work week and just slashed unemployment benefits. They also have nearly eliminated immigration. http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/cabs/france.html <br /><br />Germany 10% http://edition.cnn.com/2003/BUSINESS/11/06/german.jobless.reut/ <br /><br />President Bush must be doing something wrong??
 

Bassy

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Aug 15, 2003
Messages
1,795
Re: I really want to understand

One response so far, but doesn't tell me what is so wonderful about Kerry, just what is against Bush. Come on, Kerry lovers. Tell me all the wonderful things about your candidate. Here or at my e-mail. <br /> Thanks Boomyal and those of you who have replied to this. Thanks alot. Let's see if anyone can help figure this out.<br />Bassy
 

CoachHolland

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Apr 20, 2004
Messages
165
Re: I really want to understand

Funny thing. My dad is a life long Democrat and basically hates Republicans.<br /><br />He's not voting for Kerry. He's voting for Bush. Not because he likes Bush, but because he thinks Kerry will be the worst President ever.<br /><br />There are no reasons to vote for Kerry and he hasn't given voters any. He's only given reasons to vote against Bush.
 

Boomyal

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Aug 16, 2003
Messages
12,072
Re: I really want to understand

CoachHolland, kudos to your Dad for making a difficult choice but still fulfulling his Constitutional, moral, and patriotic duty.
 

mrbscott19

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
May 18, 2004
Messages
603
Re: I really want to understand

I have 3 reasons to vote Kerry.<br /><br />1. I can't vote for Wesley Clark<br />2. He's not George W. Bush.<br />3. I want to see Barbara and Alexandra in a mud wrestling match.<br /><br />Hmm....looking back, I guess I only had 2 reasons. :D <br /><br />For the most part, you're all correct. Kerry will only be elected out of hate of the current admin, which is sad from Kerry's POV, but even more sad from Bush's. But Bush is lucky...Just think how bad Bush would be doing if the dems acually had a nominee that was worth anything. personally, I think Clark would've blown Bush out of the water in this election.
 

mattttt25

Commander
Joined
Sep 29, 2002
Messages
2,661
Re: I really want to understand

agree with most posts. i'm not a democrat or republican. in fact, i hate the whole two party system. i think we should line up a bunch of qualified people, let them tell us their ideas and stances on all the issues, and then we vote. but, i usually side with the republicans because they historically support a strong military.<br /><br />i think the republicans will blindly vote for bush. the democrats will vote for kerry. and the undecided will vote based on whether they like or dislike what bush has done for 4 years. no idea how the election will go.
 

PW2

Commander
Joined
Apr 21, 2004
Messages
2,719
Re: I really want to understand

Ok, I will give it a shot.<br /><br />Foreign Policy. It is absolutely critical in this war on terror to seriously and credibly engage the rest of the world in this struggle. All the free world is at risk from terrorists, and we have shared values in this regard. We have to find those shared values, and develop them. Kerry is more likely to do this.<br /><br />Iraq. Whether you think it was a bad idea or not, we cannot let Iraq become a failed state, nor is it in the interests of the rest of the world that it fail. While it is doubtful we are going to enlist a huge number of foreign troops to fight this battle, we have to try, and we have to include the rest of the free world in the goal of stabilizing Iraq. It is not going to be easy, but we have to alter the direction we are going. And somehow we have to put something other than an American face on this, even though it is probably impossible to put anything other than an American wallet behind it.<br /><br />We have to stay engaged in the rest of the world, especially Pakistan, North Korea, Iran, and any other areas that truly threaten us and the rest of the free world, and of course, Israel and Palestine. This is a world of nuance and delicacy, and different cultures see things different ways. This is not an area where black and white views prevail, nor the notion of simply good vs evil. Bush is incapable of this nuance, and Kerry at least has a chance of success.<br /><br />Education. If we are going to have "no child left behind" we have to fund it. While it is a start, it is of course, not the ultimate answer, and like most problems we face, there is no simple answer. Being an educator, I am sure you know that the goundwork for successful schools is set long before the kids ever get to school--whether parents read to their kids from an early age yada yada yada. Government can only do so much, but we ought to stress early childhood education, preschool programs, etc. There are a lot of skilled professionals and scientists in this field, and we ought to try different things, test, and see what does and does not work. Approaching this from either a idealogic, or an evangelical, point of view is bound to fail.<br /><br />Government has to be involved in funding real science---many things have the ability to be privately funded if there is a short turnaround, but long term advances must be government funded, like alternate energy sources and energy independence. Not to mention stem cell research and the like.<br /><br />Economy--While there are lots of troubling statements from both sides of the economic debate in this election, I take it as mostly election hyperbole--as complex economic theory does not play well on the campaign trail. I take some comfort that Robert Rubin was sitting next to Teresa at Kerry's convention speech, as I would much rather have Rubin's advice than Karl Rove's.<br /><br />And we cannot continue to run record deficits with the advent of baby boomers retiring and the need for funds increasing no matter what we do from a spending point of view. This is nothing but a deferred tax increase on our children, and is not right.<br /><br />That is a start. This is a nuanced world, no matter what we think, and a black and white, simplistic approach to the problems we face simply won't work. We can, of course, always find others to blame for the failures, but they will be failures nonetheless.<br /><br />Now will all of this be easy? Of course not. And will Kerry solve all of these problems overnight? Of course not. Willl all of his appoaches work perfectly? Of course not.<br /><br />But on balance, he is the far better choice, and I would rather try something that might possibly work, even in a limited way, than continue doing what I know does not and will not work.
 

12Footer

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Joined
Mar 25, 2001
Messages
8,217
Re: I really want to understand

Huh?<br />I agree that foriegn policy is critical. But we need leadership, not surrender. Kerry is likely to develop shared values? With terrorists? Thanks , but no thanks.<br />As for the rest of the globe, they got the message that the United States is done bargaining with trerrorists. There will victory, or there will be more buildings blowing-up.<br />I prefer victory.
 

samagee

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Aug 7, 2003
Messages
644
Re: I really want to understand

You might as well forget about us chuming up to the rest of the world. They had their chance to help barbque some terrorist. They opted for the vegtables, we decided to keep putting meat on the grill. :D <br /><br />Putting something other than an American face on Iraq, when it was us that they wanted, would be ridiculous. They wanted us. They got us. Now they just need to fight like men.
 

crab bait

Captain
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Feb 5, 2002
Messages
3,831
Re: I really want to understand

Originally posted by 12Footer:<br /> Huh?<br />I agree that foriegn policy is critical. But we need leadership, not surrender. Kerry is likely to develop shared values? With terrorists? Thanks , but no thanks.<br />As for the rest of the globe, they got the message that the United States is done bargaining with trerrorists. There will victory, or there will be more buildings blowing-up.<br />I prefer victory.
bushy one an suspectly bushy # 2 already have ties to the bin landen family .. an numerous saudi's but as anyone knows,, they're not terroist .. they're our friends..
 

12Footer

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Joined
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Messages
8,217
Re: I really want to understand

Originally posted by crab bait:<br />bushy one an suspectly bushy # 2 already have ties to the bin landen family .. an numerous saudi's but as anyone knows,, they're not terroist .. they're our friends..
Ties? Hell, we were ALLIES with Binladen durring the Rusky/Afghan war, or did you forget about that?<br />That's just plain silly to accuse Bush #1 or 2 of "ties" to terrorists!! It was accepted foriegn policy before Osama BECAME a terrorist, or used terroist tactics ANYWHERE.<br /><br />BTW, with the help of US arms and support, the afghans won!!<br />And also, we used to be on the same side as Sadamn at one time, before he turned on his own people,and betrayed his allies.<br />Why do you insist to implicate America as the evil here, when my own countrymen died by the thousands in the "unprovoked, dastardly attacks" of 9/11/01, and even before that in the '92 attack on the WTC, and the attack on the USS Cole in Yemmen?!<br />THIS is how he repays us! This "Gihaad" against Christianity, and anyone who harbors it!<br /><br />I truely do not understand you guys and your allegiances!!<br />Why not just move over there, if you hate this country or it's leadership that much?<br /><br />Osama got po'd when we ignored his requests for rebuilding funds after theier war with USSR (which BTW, we also outlasted!). He was whacked-out crazy back then, but got even worse over the last 15years.<br />As for Iran, officially, we recognise the Saud Family as the true leadership of Iran, not the terroists who seem to be overnning that country. The official government,however soveriegn ,is weak, compared to the religious leaders within it. They seam to hold the power there. We do not negotiate with terrorists. We are in the midst of a war on Islamic terrorism, and Iran in a safe-haven for them. something will have to be done, but it will have to be under the control of the soveriegn leadership. We aren't out to rule the world. We are out to destroy terrorism in it's various lairs, ibncluding Iran. But we will do it by the diplomatic numbers. We are not monsters or dictators. [/QB][/quote]
 
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