hull extension in progress with pics

[oops!]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

hey john....

our team is called the kelowna rockets........they won the memorial cup a few years back and are rebuilding....

last year we were the joke of the league....this year we are front runners and have been knocking off the top teams regularly.....i figure two years and well win it again

we got a rookie here....names jamie bhenn......hes ripping up the scoring stats.....but hes injured right now.....so the team is struggeling.....were playing the spokane cheifs tonight....a really tough team......i hope bhenn is back ....but even if he is it will take him a while to get back in to it!

i was lucky enough to live in edmonton when the oilers were winning the stanley cups....so thats my fav nhl team......drank outta the cup lots....gretz and coffie held it for me.... i still chipped a tooth!.....

when detroit wins....and if you get to drink outta stanleys mug.....have someone hold it up for you....dont worry about spilling...put both hands on the cup either side of your mouth....then drink....or you will chip a tooth as well

cheers
oops

 

[jcsercsa]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

OHHHH MAN REALLY YOU GOT TO DRINK OUT OF THE CUP ??? OOOOHHH MAn too cool !!!!! I will rember that !!! We just had darren Macarty here with the generals , he went to the grand rapids griffens two weeks ago , and the wings just signed him and he is moving up !! too cool on drinking from the cup !!!! John

 

[klos]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

jcsercsa- Were about in Flint are ya.
I've been in the Flint area my whole life. Born and raised in Grand blanc, Now live in Goodrich.

 

[jcsercsa]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

jcsercsa- Were about in Flint are ya.
I've been in the Flint area my whole life. Born and raised in Grand blanc, Now live in Goodrich.

Hay cool, I am in burton just off of belsay and lapeer , wife is from here I grew up in saginaw !! you right in goodrich? moter in law live on 15 . we go out to hallaway all the time !! John

 

[Ataraxia]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

ataraxia......

ok...u me and john...(jcsercsa) and sarg
will climb in when its done for a few ....wave jumps....

i ran into a salty ol dawg tonight......he was saying that the transom should have some sponsons hanging off the back end...approx 2-3 feet behind the out drive....kinda like an inflateable......he said the sponsons would create bouancy behind the prop...thus the prop would not "dig" the water and raise the bow on quick accellerations from a dead stop.....swore it would give amother 5 mph top end.....and an instant plane on start.

some newer hull designs "kinda" have that feature....if i ever do this again...i might try it.....but then why do it again.......might be time for somthing new next time.....

cheers
oops

hey opps!, that old salty dog has some interesting ideas... Yeah i noticed some newer boats are starting to have the hull extended beyond the drive. (lol, actually i don't notice new boats that much... )

Interesting theory. but also you hear about people extending stern drives and outboard mounts, mainly outboards though... supposed to make a noticable performance gain when the prop is farther away from the rear.. Thats kinda opposite i guess. But ya, i can see how these sponsons would essentially be extending the boat and help with whole shot, also like a large trim tabs maybe?


About the dash.. that guys dash is TOTALLY impressive, but I just can't see that "smooth nonlinear fluid form" blending with the original style of older boats (...that actually have lines and edges). Whatever you do though, i'm sure it will look amazing.

Have you thought about having a large chunk of foam CNC machined, from your own design? Geometrically, It would turn out pretty much, perfect.




lol, or maybe, you got something like this on your mind?

 

[oops!]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

hmmmm cnc.......hadnt thought of that...... i am gonna use foam as the medium......ill check around for a machine around here that can do it.....

the town i live in... while growing very fast ...is still small....150,000 total so a cnc might be difficult to find but im only 5 hrs outta vancouver and i go there every week or two


good idea

cheers
opps

 

[Robj]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Oops,

Looking good. How will you be laminating the ply together? When I did mine, I wet out the wood with resin, let it soak. Made up a thickened resin with cabosil and maybe added small amount of chopped strand, spread it over both pieces of ply, layed a piece of matt down, wet it out with resin really well and then put the two pieces together with clamps and screws. Worked great. I used the thickened resin because it fills some of the voids in the wood. Glad to see you are using PT, that thing will last forever.

Have a great day.

Rob.

 

[oops!]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

hey rob how was your trip?

i hadn't thought of using cabosil....i was just going to use two layers of 1.5 oz matt between the ply. but one of the peices has a warp in it....

i cut the raw stringers yesterday.....

and found out some more of the peices of ply had warped

so i may be in trouble here.....

that means i wont have enough dryed ply to do the floor and foward gas tank setup......that means i will have to dry another few sheets of ply....that means another month!.......

i think im gonna go set the transom togeather today....the transom peice is warped a little...but i think i can pull it in place with screws.

if i cant get a good lamination on the transom....i dont know what im gonna do......

i know there is other peices of the proj i can work on .......bit the strings and floor will hold up everything.......

time will tell!

cheers
oops

 

[Robj]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Hello Oops,

Trip was fine. Just the way I like it, short and sweet. I think with your transom, you should be able to straighten it out. Once you have it all put together, clamp it to something straight. I used an Aluminum I beam that we have laying around at work. If you do have to redo the stringers, get the wet wood, cut it to rough size, then lay it down onto strips to have an air gap, and put lots of weight on top. That is how I did mine, and there was no warpage.

With your transom wood, you can also drill a few holes to allow the excess resin to escape.

Have a great day,

Rob.

 

[erikgreen]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

hey rob how was your trip?

i hadn't thought of using cabosil....i was just going to use two layers of 1.5 oz matt between the ply. but one of the peices has a warp in it....

i cut the raw stringers yesterday.....

and found out some more of the peices of ply had warped

so i may be in trouble here.....

cheers
oops

Couple things here...

First, don't bother putting matting between layers of transom. You're better off using a putty mix for glue. Fiberglass won't add any strength on the inside of the wood, and it adheres much less well than cabosil type putty.

Second, the warping is a good reason to laminate your materials outside the boat. Like folks suggest, just glue the pieces of stringers/transom together using a cabosil mix (I actually used wood flour myself) while they're outside the boat and laying on a flat surface. Once the stuff hardens they'll be permanently straight.

For two of my new stringers I laminated some cabinet ply to pieces of PT ply that were dry but warped... I just used unopened jugs of resin as weights until the stuff set.

Also note that when gluing ply together you don't want it clamped too tight... leave a bit of gap so there's a resin/glue layer. Same reasoning as leaving a gap at joints in a boat you're repairing with resin.

Oh, and when you spread the cabosil putty, do it with a notched trowel. When you press the wood together you'll get less squirting out the edges that way, plus better adhesion.

Erik

 

[oops!]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Couple things here...

First, don't bother putting matting between layers of transom. You're better off using a putty mix for glue. Fiberglass won't add any strength on the inside of the wood, and it adheres much less well than cabosil type putty.

Second, the warping is a good reason to laminate your materials outside the boat. Like folks suggest, just glue the pieces of stringers/transom together using a cabosil mix (I actually used wood flour myself) while they're outside the boat and laying on a flat surface. Once the stuff hardens they'll be permanently straight.

For two of my new stringers I laminated some cabinet ply to pieces of PT ply that were dry but warped... I just used unopened jugs of resin as weights until the stuff set.

Also note that when gluing ply together you don't want it clamped too tight... leave a bit of gap so there's a resin/glue layer. Same reasoning as leaving a gap at joints in a boat you're repairing with resin.

Oh, and when you spread the cabosil putty, do it with a notched trowel. When you press the wood together you'll get less squirting out the edges that way, plus better adhesion.

Erik

really good info here........all the books ive read say to use matt....
and on the other jobs i've done ive used matt.

but erik and rob have changed my mind.

and i was definitly going to do the lambinating out side out the hull.... on the flat garage floor
hope fully i wont be too bad off with the warped wood...a few dozen pt screws and i should be fine.

cheers
oops

 

[salty87]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

not sure why i didn't think of full resin jugs, i used various bricks and blocks i had laying around.

oops, don't go overkill on the screws. once the resin sets, unless both boards are warped in the same direction, one won't warp the other barely at all. think of the angle the warped board pulls on from when it's glued to the straight board, it's almost parallel.

weight em down good on a flat surface, they'll stay straight once the resin sets.

notched trowel would have been nice too.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Mat is not absolutaly needed between the layers of plywood for the transom, but it will be much stronger than putty and make sure the wood has been pre coated with resin before glassing over it. Let the resin on the pre coated wood at least start to get hard before laminating on it or the wood will suck resin out of the glass and leave dry spots.

 

[oops!]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

thank you ondarvr

 

[erikgreen]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Mat is not absolutaly needed between the layers of plywood for the transom, but it will be much stronger than putty and make sure the wood has been pre coated with resin before glassing over it. Let the resin on the pre coated wood at least start to get hard before laminating on it or the wood will suck resin out of the glass and leave dry spots.

How do you figure it's much stronger than putty? Fiberglass adds strength and stiffness by forming a truss structure between the two skins of what it coats, or else by being thick enough to stand on its own. A piece of mat sandwiched between two plywood pieces won't do much either way. And it won't adhere better than just using a thixotropic (peanut butter) putty either??

Erik

 

[oops!]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

erik ...

could it be because the matt strands will adhere to the ply with individual contact points with 2-3 inch peices of glass and join to the other ply as well?

thus in it self creating a "web of stregnth" between the sheets of ply?

somthing that cabosil by itself could not do?

your thoughts?

 

[ondarvr]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

That and putty (resin) has very little strength on it's own, it relies on the glass fibers to do the work. A layer of unreinforced putty between the 2 sheets will be brittle and when stressed or flexed can easily crack. Putty with milled fibers added will be much stronger, but a layer of mat is stronger yet. Go back to opps!'s resin breaking test, it's the same for the layer being used as glue to hold the plywood together.

 

[erikgreen]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Ah, okay.... I must just not be used to poly resin. Plus I forgot what cabosil does to a putty...I'm used to using wood flour, which is structural, as opposed to cabosil, which isn't.

I have some interesting pics of a cross section of my stringers to post in a day or so. Nice and tough with just the resin layer in there, and wood flour.

Better minds than mine would need to comment on whether the mat is structural in this case, when used with poly, but I'd be willing to bet the epoxy/wood flour combo will beat the mat and cabosil both. It's flexible enough to not crack, hardens like rock and bonds like super glue (which it is

Erik

 

[ondarvr]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

It's a whole different situation when your talking about epoxy, it's a very good glue.

 

[oops!]

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

Re: hull extension in progress with picks

well after a good sushi supper with my girl and her son
it was time to get back on the bote.

i had planned to add another layer of glass and do the tramsom tonight
but i im feeling very tired lately so i just started the transom.

the first step was to sand...(rough up) the new transom peices they are 3/4 inch pressure treated plywood that has been drying for about a month and some.

after sanding, it was time to wet out the peices with resin...im using a cold cure, beacause i wanted the resin to really soak in to the dried pressure treated plywood... at this time i also cut the peice of glass

after the wood was fully wetted out...i jumped back in the hull and strarted more grinding....and more grinding....

after an hour and a half the resin was starting to get hard on top ....and time to laminate the two peices of wood to the glass......

first wet out the glass......

if you look closely at the above pic....it showes the bottom half of the glass properly wetted and (except for the obvious)..the top section...only half wetted....i did this to show how fully wet the glass must be....(forget the really white parts....look closely at the top half and youll see some partial spots where the glass isnt fully wet......



rule of thumb....saturate the glass thouroughly...no more...no less...
after that i compressed the other layer of ply to the newly glassed section

the wood had warped a little during drying...so i used about 6 screws to pull the peices togeather after i placed the weight on the sandwich.

i was just going to use full cases of corona to weigh down the sandwich
but for some strange reason the corona bottles keep evaporating in that garage....weird...

it was really nice just to glass a simple section like that tonight.most of the stuff ive done latlely is 40 or 50 sq feet with corners and thick cloth...and ya gotta do it three times..... so this was a breeze

im going to let the new transom sit for at least 48 hours before i install it....i want to get another layer of glass over the strech section. so that means more grinding....oh joy