Crazy service prices.

[H20Rat]

Re: Crazy service prices.

I looked into the software for my etec ,as far as I know you can get it but without the codes you can only look ,you cant do squat.if that has changed id love to know dingbat.well actually in 4 more years id like to know as I still got some serious time on my warranty and a good dealer.still would be nice to change idle settings by 50 rpm though.i was amazed at what that comp told the tech about my running of the motor .amazing.

So you are talking two different things there, diagnostics, which is easy and relatively cheap, or actually making programming changes, which is a bad idea during warranty. (say goodbye to warranty coverage!)

Anyway, dealers and skilled mechanics obviously steer the DIY'ers away from any diagnostic software, saying they are complicated to use and very expensive. The truth is that the OEM level stuff often is complicated and expensive, and has every knob possible. A home user couldn't buy it if they wanted to anyway. The stuff available to a DIY'er will show more basic info, but 99% of the time, all you need is the trouble code.

Look how things went in the vehicle-OBDII world... First scanners were proprietary and completely locked out to home users. Then the world of scanners that cost a couple hundred bucks. That made way to under $100 scanners, and now I can do everything I need with a $20 bluetooth OBD adapter and my phone running torque software. I also have full upload capability to my car's ECU and run my own firmware. (OEM dealers still have custom proprietary scanners with more capability, but they also side-step the OBD protocol to do it)

 

[agallant80]

Re: Crazy service prices.

So the funny thing is after I posted this thread I ran out of time and paid someone $400 to clean the boat. Well worth it. Peace of mind that she is clean and I did not have to spend the better part of a day cleaning her. Though I think $400 to clean a 25 foot cruiser is fair. They cleaned the decks, apolistry (cockpit and cabin), washed, waxed, removed scratches in the hull and shampooed the carpet in the cabin (had a bad spill this year I was not able to get out on my own)

 

[Slip Away]

Re: Crazy service prices.

$400 .......... Glad you can afford it.

 

[oldjeep]

Re: Crazy service prices.

So the funny thing is after I posted this thread I ran out of time and paid someone $400 to clean the boat. Well worth it. Peace of mind that she is clean and I did not have to spend the better part of a day cleaning her. Though I think $400 to clean a 25 foot cruiser is fair. They cleaned the decks, apolistry (cockpit and cabin), washed, waxed, removed scratches in the hull and shampooed the carpet in the cabin (had a bad spill this year I was not able to get out on my own)

Ran out of time? You live in NC, you've got months before it even gets sort of cold

 

[82rude]

Re: Crazy service prices.

smokingcrater. its just a small bottle of whine,lol.you are of course correct.for 6 years im not touching that motor other than to add oil.theres really nothing I can do anyways,even to change the programming to xd-100 takes the dealer if I wanted to go that way though right now im totally happy at the xd-50 setting.for a diy though, it is a little hard to not poke around even though you know you don't have to ,lol.i will learn to not touch ,I will learn to not touch ,I will.......

 

[crabby captain john]

Re: Crazy service prices.

Better deal than mine. I paid $385 but only 21' and no carpet...

So the funny thing is after I posted this thread I ran out of time and paid someone $400 to clean the boat. Well worth it. Peace of mind that she is clean and I did not have to spend the better part of a day cleaning her. Though I think $400 to clean a 25 foot cruiser is fair. They cleaned the decks, apolistry (cockpit and cabin), washed, waxed, removed scratches in the hull and shampooed the carpet in the cabin (had a bad spill this year I was not able to get out on my own)

 

[Brian 26]

Re: Crazy service prices.

Put me in the category of can afford to have it done, don't really have time to do it myself but still make time to do it myself. The two main reasons I winterize myself are that I don't want to feel like I'm getting gouged and I don't trust a random guy to do the work. Also it does take time to hook up the trailer, tow it somewhere, wait for a call, and tow it back.

Now if I could find a guy I trust that does house calls and stands behind that work, I would happily pay for maintenance and repairs.

 

[jkust]

Re: Crazy service prices.

So in MN we are usually high for dealer labor whether car or boat. Those prices are high to me even because our winterization package includes multiple of those services at a cheaper bundled price. Where DIY generally is concerned, unless I just can't or won't do it, I feel I always do a better job than the guy I hire to do it for me. Boat engine work is in the 'won't do' category for me. If someone walked me through a winterization on my boat, I would change my tune. Further the more money I accumulate, I more I want to save and do things myself. Like driving an old car that I paid cash for way back when, I feel like I'm beating the system a few hundred dollars at a time.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Crazy service prices.

As Don used to say about shop labor rates and bills:
1) Go to the yard and hitch up the boat
2) Move boat to service bay
3) Remove interior or gain access to engine
At this point you have an hour labor and nothing has been done
4) Hook up muffs or dunk the drive in test tank.
5) Warm up the engine for oil change.
6) Now the work starts.
7) Attach the oil sucker and remove oil. Then dispose of it.
8) Remove the filter and replace with new.
9) Now perform the other stuff the owner wants which may be replacing the water pump impeller, changing outdrive fluids, and then winterizing and moving boat to storage. If the boat has a fresh water system it needs to be drained and generally filled with pink stuff.

The labor rate is whatever the traffic will tolerate and the only way it goes down is lack of business or poor reputation. People will pay for a good reputation and quality work. They only pay once (generally) to get burned. This is a supply and demand situation. Overhead, parts inventory, insurance, heat, lights, a building, and salary all play into the labor rate. If you think marine labor is expensive, how about the salaries major league sports teams have to deal with. The rule is, "if you are worth it, people will pay it!." Unfortunately there are lots of people that own cars, boats, airplanes, trucks, tractors, and other powered stuff that they can't afford to maintain properly so they learn to do it themselves, generally by trial and error which can cost them dearly.

 

[QC]

Re: Crazy service prices.

Thanks for the Don reference

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: Crazy service prices.

So in MN we are usually high for dealer labor whether car or boat. Those prices are high to me even because our winterization package includes multiple of those services at a cheaper bundled price. Where DIY generally is concerned, unless I just can't or won't do it, I feel I always do a better job than the guy I hire to do it for me. Boat engine work is in the 'won't do' category for me. If someone walked me through a winterization on my boat, I would change my tune. Further the more money I accumulate, I more I want to save and do things myself. Like driving an old car that I paid cash for way back when, I feel like I'm beating the system a few hundred dollars at a time.

other factors that go into price are demand and market volume. To follow the above statement, in MN everyone needs to winterize in some fashion, due to freezing as well as long storage time. Not so in the south. High demand, high prices, unless/until the high prices attract competition (increased supply) and down come the prices--good old capitalism.

Volume is a two-prong fork there. You start with a big rush to winterize all at once--high volume. Then there are several months when there is no boating so no boating work to be done; the over-winter projects hardly keep the shop alive or even pay for the heat. So the business needs to bring in 5 months of revenue in one month's time--and up go the rates.

Looking at the issue purely on an hourly rate x time to do the job will not explain much and often distracts from the real forces that drive price--the comments in this thread throw many of the factors into the mix.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Re: Crazy service prices.

The Marina I used in WI did most of its re-power work in the winter. They offered specials just to bring in work for the winter months. Even then the place cut back on hours until spring.

Another I know of diversified into snowmobiles and ATV's

 

[agallant80]

Re: Crazy service prices.

Ran out of time? You live in NC, you've got months before it even gets sort of cold

I would love to keep on using her but the personal schedule filled up and we won't have time.

 

[spdracr39]

Re: Crazy service prices.

To me price is irrelevant. Changing the oil and servicing the boat keeps me in tune with any potential issues that may arise and every time I touch it I become more familiar with it for when I have trouble on the water. I make sure I have the tools available on the boat to do any work that is necessary (within reason) and if I am missing something I can add it to the toolbox. It is just another part of owning a toy and I enjoy the hands on part of it.

 

[agallant80]

Re: Crazy service prices.

To me price is irrelevant. Changing the oil and servicing the boat keeps me in tune with any potential issues that may arise and every time I touch it I become more familiar with it for when I have trouble on the water. I make sure I have the tools available on the boat to do any work that is necessary (within reason) and if I am missing something I can add it to the toolbox. It is just another part of owning a toy and I enjoy the hands on part of it.

I am with you 100% this is exactly why I like to do my own work. Now if I had crazy money then I would pay someone to do it and pay someone to pick me up when the thing broke on the water but I don't have crazy money for that.

 

[crabby captain john]

Re: Crazy service prices.

I agree price is irrelevant and that is why I let the pros do it. They will notice potential problems more readily than I will.

To me price is irrelevant. Changing the oil and servicing the boat keeps me in tune with any potential issues that may arise and every time I touch it I become more familiar with it for when I have trouble on the water. I make sure I have the tools available on the boat to do any work that is necessary (within reason) and if I am missing something I can add it to the toolbox. It is just another part of owning a toy and I enjoy the hands on part of it.

 

[crabby captain john]

Re: Crazy service prices.

I am with you 100% this is exactly why I like to do my own work. Now if I had crazy money then I would pay someone to do it and pay someone to pick me up when the thing broke on the water but I don't have crazy money for that.

You are also from NC. If on the coast or fish the ocean it is best to have Tow Boat or Sea Tow membership for when/if something breaks on the water. Not much you can do 10 - 60 miles offshore.

 

[agallant80]

Re: Crazy service prices.

You are also from NC. If on the coast or fish the ocean it is best to have Tow Boat or Sea Tow membership for when/if something breaks on the water. Not much you can do 10 - 60 miles offshore.

I do have seatow

 

[jkust]

Re: Crazy service prices.

other factors that go into price are demand and market volume. To follow the above statement, in MN everyone needs to winterize in some fashion, due to freezing as well as long storage time. Not so in the south. High demand, high prices, unless/until the high prices attract competition (increased supply) and down come the prices--good old capitalism.

Volume is a two-prong fork there. You start with a big rush to winterize all at once--high volume. Then there are several months when there is no boating so no boating work to be done; the over-winter projects hardly keep the shop alive or even pay for the heat. So the business needs to bring in 5 months of revenue in one month's time--and up go the rates.

Looking at the issue purely on an hourly rate x time to do the job will not explain much and often distracts from the real forces that drive price--the comments in this thread throw many of the factors into the mix.

Good summary however, that doesn't explain our insane auto dealer service rates. I'm guessing that a lot of the Marine Max's revenue (that does my winterizing) is earned from winterizing and related service in an 8 week span. As for the increased rates, A few years ago at my 100 hour mark, I needed some service done to the outdrive as it was using outdrive oil. It was cheaper to just have the full 200 hour service done with my winterization instead of the add-on of the outdrive work. I was pleased that they offer a bundled price when they could have just as easily charged me full price and I'd have paid it.

 

[crabby captain john]

Re: Crazy service prices.

Good summary however, that doesn't explain our insane auto dealer service rates. I'm guessing that a lot of the Marine Max's revenue (that does my winterizing) is earned from winterizing and related service in an 8 week span. As for the increased rates, A few years ago at my 100 hour mark, I needed some service done to the outdrive as it was using outdrive oil. It was cheaper to just have the full 200 hour service done with my winterization instead of the add-on of the outdrive work. I was pleased that they offer a bundled price when they could have just as easily charged me full price and I'd have paid it.

There are great reasons to get to know your shop and mechanics. When they see they receive all or most of your work they most often treat you well.