Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

[Tim Wagner]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

If Im not mistaken, these fishing clubs that hold these tournaments have "gentleman" rules
where they are not allowed to infringe on other fisherman nor allowed to fish within a certain distance from another boat. Especially one that is in the tournament.
Reporting this to the head honcho thats in charge of the whole thing would get that boat disqualified.
That kind of crap is something that these clubs DO NOT want.

 

[dingbat]

Re: Play nice

Re: Play nice

We get complaints all the time on the great lakes and the Detroit River every time the tourney guys decide to hold an event. Not sure if it?s the competitive nature of tournaments, or testosterone, or what?? I don?t think tourneys are what fishing is all about but to each there own. However if you think you can come in and force your presence upon where I happen to be, you will get met with great resistance. There is common sense that tends to be lacking and it?s usually with tourney guys when it happens. These are the people who know better and should be leading by example, but they don?t. I?ve seen it happen way too many times to suggest it was an isolated thing with one person. That isn?t fishing, that is poor behavior, and it isn?t nice or desired. For all the decent fishermen out there, make sure you get the boat registration #?s and turn these people in, they shouldn?t be allowed on the lake if they cant respect the rest of us fishermen.

Every year we fish one of the biggest tournaments on the entire east coast. In this tournament we are assigned a very specific and limited area to fish. Every year we arrive at our assigned location only to find it covered up with the recreational public. Despite the fact that the tournament is widely publicized and there are signs everywhere alerting the public of the tournament in progress and to be courteous to the participants.

Four times in the last 4 years we were in first place going into the last round of the tournament. On all four occasions we made it a point to walk around and talk with each of the people/groups in the area telling them what we were doing and asking them to give us some space, 100 yds to be exact, for the remaining 3 hours of the tournament. I would guess that 60% of the people where cooperative, if not supportive of our position, while the remaining 40% told us to blow off and proceeded to participate in provocative actions.

The second year we participated one of our members was physically assaulted by an individual that insisted that he had as much right to the water as we did. He kept running his wave runner back and forth in our assigned area then took offense when one of our sinkers passed too close for his liking. He drove his WR up on the beach in front of us and started swinging. The police were called and he was cited for disorderly conduct but not before we lost over an hour of fishing time because of the *****hole.

Moral of the story, there are more non-tournament *****holes in this world as there are tournament *****holes. A little courtesy towards each other will go a long way towards resolving the problem.

 

[Tim Wagner]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

I dont believe that in these tournaments your're allowed out of your boat.
Stepping on the bank is reason for disqualification.
In fact, altercations with pleasure boaters are grounds for disqualification.

 

[cwilt]

Re: Play nice

Re: Play nice

moral of the story, there are more non-tournament *****holes in this world as there are tournament *****holes. A little courtesy towards each other will go a long way towards resolving the problem.

.........................amen!!

 

[DANZIG]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

dingbat, I too wish I could reserve the whole of the water for a day or two,, but it just does not work that way. Could not work that way.


All I ask for is that small amount of space around me. I do not think that is unreasonable.

(Same as fly fishing a busy GSMNP trout stream.
Lots of folks use that water everyday and it works on account of 95+% of the anglers know and follow the etiquette. And those rules of courtesy are more far reaching in terms of space.)

If I plan for weeks to go,, get up at 3 am to get there,,, then find you on my "spot",,,,,,

,,,It's your spot. (for now) I toss a friendly wave at you and move elsewhere.
That is how it is done. It is just that simple and I expect the same from you.

I could care less if you have a $50,000+ boat, or paid $500 to play in the tournament, got up at 3 am, and/or traveled 500 miles to fish there, the rules of courtesy are the same for both of us.

Now maybe, if my mood is right and you ask very nicely, I might share "my water" with you. And who knows, maybe we will both share the contents of our coolers, swap some BS stories, and make a new friend.

Friend or foe, I can and will go either way,,,it is mostly up to you as to what you get.

 

[tx1961whaler]

Re: Play nice

Re: Play nice

The second year we participated one of our members was physically assaulted by an individual that insisted that he had as much right to the water as we did.

Problem is, the guy DID have as much right to the water as the tourney guy did, unless it's a private lake or the lake was officially closed for everyone that wasn't in the tournament. Just because someone is in a tourney doesn't mean they are instantly entitled ownership of a public resource.
Think of it another way. Say YOU are fishing or anchored at a spot, and somebody blasts up and tells you to leave the spot because he is "entitled" to it and you're not. Are you really going to pull up and leave and not get angry?

 

[dingbat]

Re: Play nice

Re: Play nice

Problem is, the guy DID have as much right to the water as the tourney guy did, unless it's a private lake or the lake was officially closed for everyone that wasn't in the tournament. Just because someone is in a tourney doesn't mean they are instantly entitled ownership of a public resource.
Think of it another way. Say YOU are fishing or anchored at a spot, and somebody blasts up and tells you to leave the spot because he is "entitled" to it and you're not. Are you really going to pull up and leave and not get angry?

This is a perfect example of selfish, me over you mentality that exists today.

Where did I say anything about entitlement? This is a respect and common courtesy issue. We make the point to explain the situation to everyone in the area and ask for their cooperation. A large percentage of the people are interested in what is going on and cheer us on. Then there are the people who are all about ?me?. I was here first and I?m going to belligerent and exercise my right to this location no matter what. I can?t possibly move 50 yards down the beach to allow you to participate in a city sanctioned activity. I was here first, so heck with you and your tournament.

Now to answer your question. If a guy comes up to me and explains that he is in first place and has been assigned that position to fish for the next 3 hours I would treat him exactly how I would want others to treat me if the shoe was on the other foot. I?d share information with him about the spot, wish him luck and move on for the next couple of hours.

What would you do?

 

[dingbat]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

I could care less if you have a $50,000+ boat, or paid $500 to play in the tournament, got up at 3 am, and/or traveled 500 miles to fish there, the rules of courtesy are the same for both of us.

Now maybe, if my mood is right and you ask very nicely, I might share "my water" with you. And who knows, maybe we will both share the contents of our coolers, swap some BS stories, and make a new friend.

Friend or foe, I can and will go either way,,,it is mostly up to you as to what you get.

That is why we make an effort to talk to the people in the area and explain to them what is going on. Most are sympathetic to the situation and either move on or stay to watch the competition.

Then you have the ?I have the right? crowd.

 

[tx1961whaler]

Re: Play nice

Re: Play nice

This is a perfect example of selfish, me over you mentality that exists today.

Where did I say anything about entitlement? This is a respect and common courtesy issue. We make the point to explain the situation to everyone in the area and ask for their cooperation. A large percentage of the people are interested in what is going on and cheer us on. Then there are the people who are all about ?me?. I was here first and I?m going to belligerent and exercise my right to this location no matter what. I can?t possibly move 50 yards down the beach to allow you to participate in a city sanctioned activity. I was here first, so heck with you and your tournament.

Now to answer your question. If a guy comes up to me and explains that he is in first place and has been assigned that position to fish for the next 3 hours I would treat him exactly how I would want others to treat me if the shoe was on the other foot. I?d share information with him about the spot, wish him luck and move on for the next couple of hours.

What would you do?

If somebody nicely explained that this was a designated area for a sanctioned event, I would most certainly move in a heartbeat. If I knew about such a large event before hand, or maybe even at the ramp, I wouldn't even be there. If someone without a badge on their chest rudely demands that I move in a belligerent fashion, then they can go pound rocks...and I'm not implying that that even happened in your case with the tournament. You don't know me personally, so don't go drawing conclusions about my character, and I didn't at all mean to imply that you personally act "entitled". I will say that a tourney fisherman has absolutely no more or less importance to me than a guy fishing in a tinny with his kid. They both get the same amount of respect, but I expect more courtesy out of a professional angler than I would from an average Joe.
I was not referring to anyone personally in the reply, except to ask what you personally would do in a situation if someone demanded rudely (not nicely) that you leave. I may suspect that your personal reaction may depend on how the other person that wanted to fish there presented his request.
Now if a member courteously and calmly explains to someone that the spot was needed for a sponsored and city approved tournament and the person blew a gasket, then I totally agree they are out of line. They still have the same right to be there, but it is rude that they did not just move.
It sound like the tournament organizers may need to mark off and enforce the fishing areas in the a.m. throughout the tournament to keep this from happening. Making individual participants act like water cops in a public waterway is not a real good idea, as most people are not trained to handle conflict situations very well at all.
Peace!
--whaler (40 years on the water and counting....)

 

[dingbat]

Re: Play nice

Re: Play nice

It sound like the tournament organizers may need to mark off and enforce the fishing areas in the a.m. throughout the tournament to keep this from happening. Making individual participants act like water cops in a public waterway is not a real good idea, as most people are not trained to handle conflict situations very well at all.
Peace!
--whaler (40 years on the water and counting....)

It been brought up to the tournament officials time and time again that something needs to be done with the user conflicts it creates. The areas are physically marked off and numbered. You would have to be dumb and blind not to know that a tournament of this size (750-800 participants) was being held at this place and time.

The problems never occur on the residential / locals part of the tournament area. The problems always arise on the ?tourist? end of the area. I drove here from such and such and I could care less about you or your activity. Whether you pay to fish a tournament or pay to lie on a public beach, money brings out the worst in people when they are asked to share anything.

 

[tx1961whaler]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

Yes, the freshwater tournies in Fla. I fished in with a buddy were normally roped off the night before and had either a tourney boat there, or a wildlife officer patrolling. I think it was as much to keep rec. people out of there as well as keeping the cheaters out. And this was in the mid-80's, when things weren't so big and intense. The offshore ones could get pretty hectic around the wrecks and reefs keeping the trollers and drifters and anchorers from killing one another. Lots of crossed lines and (accidentally ?) cut anchor ropes sometimes.

Yeah, if the areas are marked off and someone is in there and won't leave after some gentle reminding, they are just trying to prove a point. A visit from a sheriff patrol boat might change their mind.

 

[DANZIG]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

"Then you have the ?I have the right? crowd."


I reckon that would be me!

I don't give a care for your tournament. You get no special consideration from me.

I will not molest your fishing, Nor curb mine.

I will keep a courteous distance from your boat or stretch of bank and I expect you to do the same.
If you do not, I will do my best to see that you do not profit from your lack of manners and take it just as far as you want it to go.

It is just that simple. The choice is yours.

 

[Mark_VTfisherman]

Re: Courtesy Fishing: Where did it go?

Re: Courtesy Fishing: Where did it go?

Problem is, the guy DID have as much right to the water as the tourney guy did...Just because someone is in a tourney doesn't mean they are instantly entitled ownership of a public resource.
Think of it another way. Say YOU are fishing or anchored at a spot, and somebody blasts up and tells you to leave the spot because he is "entitled" to it and you're not. Are you really going to pull up and leave and not get angry?

Um - NOPE! He does not have a right to run his PWC like that! I don't think you are reading these threads closely.

Any first-year political science major can recite the Lockean philosophy which Jefferson and others firmly entrenched in the US Constitution. If the extreme views of Locke were in place, well.... you'd learn to be courteous! But no one has the right to trample on someone else's rights.

Here in Vermont, like many states, we have laws against a person or persons harassing a fisherman engaged in the act of fishing. I would assume there are similar laws in dingbat's region.

Anyway, that PWC guy was apparently rife with attitude, but he had no right to encroach on the activity at hand.

The issue here is a little common courtesy goes a long way... The threat to "take it as far as you want to go" immaturity doesn't get you anywhere but maybe jail time.

 

[scipper77]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

This thread has turned into a pissing contest.

I hope we all know that the truth is that the rules are the same whether you are in a tourney or fishing recreationally. Maybe the tourney rules will place greater restrictions an those guys.

If I want you to move from the spot where you are fishing it means I think my fishing is somehow more important than yours. It's up to you whether or not you agree.

If I get upset because you won't move, I am an a-hole.

If you get upset because I "asked" you to move you are an a-hole. Although getting annoyed at that request is understandable, that's when you say no.

It's really that simple in my world, I don't even understand what all the back and forth is about in this thread?

 

[tx1961whaler]

Re: Courtesy Fishing: Where did it go?

Re: Courtesy Fishing: Where did it go?

Um - NOPE! He does not have a right to run his PWC like that! I don't think you are reading these threads closely.

Any first-year political science major can recite the Lockean philosophy which Jefferson and others firmly entrenched in the US Constitution. If the extreme views of Locke were in place, well.... you'd learn to be courteous! But no one has the right to trample on someone else's rights.

Here in Vermont, like many states, we have laws against a person or persons harassing a fisherman engaged in the act of fishing. I would assume there are similar laws in dingbat's region.

Anyway, that PWC guy was apparently rife with attitude, but he had no right to encroach on the activity at hand.

The issue here is a little common courtesy goes a long way... The threat to "take it as far as you want to go" immaturity doesn't get you anywhere but maybe jail time.

Mark, I never wrote or implied that he had the right to operate his PWC like that, especially in the stuff that you quoted. In later threads it was clarified that this was a physically marked off area, so the PWC guy seems to be really out of line.

 

[DANZIG]

Re: Courtesy Fishing: Where did it go?

Re: Courtesy Fishing: Where did it go?

"The issue here is a little common courtesy goes a long way... The threat to "take it as far as you want to go" immaturity doesn't get you anywhere but maybe jail time."


Common courtesy is exactly the issue.
If you have and display it, there will be no other "issues".

If not,,, Well, I think have made myself plain about that.
No threats, just friendly advise. Think twice before you molest someone's fishing, that "someone" might be someone like me.

 

[tx1961whaler]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

I remember once "winter" fishing in Fla for seatrout in a hole in the intercoastal. I came up and a guy was anchored right in the middle of the hole, which is not a cool thing, plus you won't catch anything because they do have eyes and can see the boat. I just asked him if he was catching anything, and he said no, then I eventually in a roundabout way suggested that he move off to the edge where I was, wait a bit, cast into the hole and he'd slay them. We both did that and both had a fine day. I even told him where some other holes were (not all of them... .
Now if either of us had a 'tude, both of us may have gone home p-issed. It worked out in this case, but if he would have been unfriendly at first I would have just left and gone elsewhere.

 

[DonHof]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

If that ever happens again, blow out the hole, run the whole thing with your big motor then leave. He might as well leave then too.
Then that makes you just as big as A-Hole as him!
The lake where I go is no wake, and the guy's come flying in there with their $60,000 bass boats like they are late for a fishing tournament.(speed limit is 25 and most do 40-50) I just get out of their way and let them go if they are in that big of a hurry.

 

[Mark_VTfisherman]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

This thread has turned into a pissing contest....don't even understand what all the back and forth is about in this thread?

Ya, something like that. Or 12-year-old boys trying to determine who has a bigger- attitude I guess is a safe word to use.

I said my piece. On to funner stuff like fishing

 

[dingbat]

Re: Courtesy Fishing, Where did it go?

The lake where I go is no wake, and the guy's come flying in there with their $60,000 bass boats like they are late for a fishing tournament.

Nobody speeds in a $500 boats?