BRP reveals a new style of outboard, Rotax powered, horizontal crankshaft....

[havoc_squad]

The three big no goes were as a buyer for me are:

1. Complex leak mitigation system makes flood damage a real risk.

2. Performance reported in their tests was twice as worse of this new ghost motor versus as a similar HP outboard motor in reaching planing speeds.

3. Rear deck triming up/down to me is a huge liability and reliability issue.

The design is an overcomplicated pile of crap that creates problems instead of creating solutions that the buyer is willing to pay for.

 

[Texasmark]

Yes, the people we bought the MFG in my signature from were water skiing behind it. And that's with burnt pistons (per the marina that did some maintenance for us). But that was a bare bones, no frills, awfully light boat....nothing like the floating sofa boats these days which require a lot more power to move.

Agree, the new to the arena FG boat of that day were hollow shells. A 30 hp could provide plenty of power. Bare bones semi V hull, deck was sealed (supposed to be sealed) and provided an air chamber for flotation, and a shell for a deck to support a plastic molded, one piece windshield and steering wheel. Most had one flat wooden seat with wooden, walk through back rest (you brought your own cushions) which worked for Coast Guard throwable devices. 1 or 2 six gallon gas cans under the splash well (if it had one at all) and an automotive size 24 battery. I had a Taylor Craft 14' of such design and powered by a Scott Atwater 28 hp that was adequate for what I did and FIL had a 14' of such design with a 35 Rude....a real tugger for the day....low RPM big block.

 

[Texasmark]

I'd rather buy an old used Mercury branded Force outboard than that BRP abomination of an engine.

BRP/Evinrude never got the hint of really learning from their mistakes. They just rebrand them or shifted the blame to the previous design that failed.

I can understand the desire to create a groundbreaking horizontally operating outboard 4 stroke powerhead in a compact package that functions reliably. The issue is their engine design ignores the primary reason for the form factor of an outboard motor, ease of installation and servicing.

It doesn't help BRP's reputation as a manufacturer either if they got lazy on business network security solutions and got crippled by ransomware causing them to not to be able to function. If they got shut down longer than a week I would guess that they must have not taken proper precautions to secure and backup their data and lost a lot of critical data.

Failure to properly secure company data can result in prolonged poor customer and dealer support as the tools needed to their jobs won't work and nothing gets actually done.

On the Mercury Force comment: I had a 1972 Chrysler 85 HP I bought new with a 16' Chrysler Sport Fury tri hull, bow rider....a very simple, 3 cyl., crossflow engine with plenty of power. Only gripe is that I ran with the OMC Looper crowd and they smoked me on fuel consumption. None of us had reliability issues.

 

[redneck joe]

old chryslers were the bomb. honestly i feel force was also a good basic engine, other than my l drive.


i'm still after my basic old (last ever) starcraft but if future changes I'll be doing something like a ski nautique direct shaft. kinda like me switching from gas tools to electric for less spark plugs and carbs in my life, less gears is never a bad thing.

 

[briangcc]

I'm calling it vaporware for now until there's an actual review...or find one on a showroom floor to lay hands on.

Only thing we've seen is BRP's PR machine pumping out videos for the 3 brands that will initially be built with the new rotax engine....yeah, yeah, reworked Evinrude G2.

 

[McGR]

As if it wasn't bad enough for us Johnnyrude fanboys lately... now this!??

 

[briangcc]

It's still vaporware until you can lay hands on it. My local marinas who sell either brand show nothing in stock and nothing on order. They do show other brands with 2023 model year as on order.

IF I was guessing, based off the videos, BRP got an earful on the poor performance and is reworking it. Then again, who knows as they may just release a sub-par product to try recouping engineering costs...then bow out again of the outboard market.

 

[Texasmark]

Actually, Rotax has been building aircraft engines far longer than BRP has existed. The Rotax 912 is legendary as an aircraft engine for reliability and durability, and received FAA certification in 1995. In 1998 Rotax outsold all other aircraft engine manufacturers combined. Rotax has been building aircraft engines for over 100 years, they were founded in 1920 in Dresden, Germany. It was purchased by Fichtel & Sachs in 1930, and by Bombardier Inc. in 1970. Today it is headquartered in Gunskirchen, Austria.

BRP was spun off from Bombardier Inc. in 2003 and retained ownership of Rotax. Rotax is a well-regarded engine manufacturer, renowned for building high quality engines in both two-stroke and four-stroke configurations.

The powerhead in the new Rotax outboard is an Evinrude E-TEC G2, 1.9L three-cylinder two-stroke used formerly in the Evinrude 115 and 150hp outboards, rebranded as Rotax. The 150hp version uses RAVE (Rotax Automatic Variable Exhaust) exhaust valves.

I suspect these will be quite popular in pontoons. They are so quiet and smooth that you can't tell that the engine is running if you touch it while it's running. It is a perfect match for pontoon boaters since the engine is totally maintenance-free, doesn't require oil changes and has has one touch winterization by just pushing a button. There was nothing wrong with the Evinrude E-TEC two-strokes, they are superior to any four-stroke for torque, power-to-weight and durability, get better fuel economy, and they use less oil than oil changes require in a comparable four-stroke. The main problem was market perception because everybody got four-stroke tattoo's on their forehead and if it wasn't four-stroke then it must not be any good.

BRP intends to change that with the re-branding to Rotax, because especially the pontoon crowd could care less how many strokes it has. If it's quiet, out of the way, just runs and doesn't require any attention or maintenance it's perfect for Party Barges, Lake Luxury Yachts, or whatever you want to call them. And pontoons are the single most popular hull style on inland lakes. Our lake here has over 100 miles of shoreline, cruise the shores and look at what's moored at all the lake home docks, out of 100 boats only 5 or 6 are v-hulls, the rest are pontoons. They are popular because people put the whole family on them, plus invite their friends with their kids. They go out for a day of boating, they got a grille going on the deck, kids are jumping off the side and having a blast, everybody else is kicked back in like barco loungers enjoying a cold one in the shade because it has a big top on it - they are an incredibly popular boating style. The boating industry sells almost 5,000 pontoons for every salt water boat that is sold.

I predict BRP will sell these by the truckload on pontoons.

......and a lot of them have a "privy" which is probably 80% or so of their popularity, especially for beer drinking guys and the ladies!

 

[chris.olson]

I'm calling it vaporware for now until there's an actual review...or find one on a showroom floor to lay hands on.

Only thing we've seen is BRP's PR machine pumping out videos for the 3 brands that will initially be built with the new rotax engine....yeah, yeah, reworked Evinrude G2.

So far they are still vaporware. They revealed the Manitou Explorer at the show in Salt Lake City with a Rotax on it and claimed they are in production. However, the Alumacraft Trophy is now claimed to be available summer 2023, not available for early order to arrive on dealer showroom floors in time for spring.

 

[MattFL]

Certainly the promise of 2 cycle DI motors was low emissions, and 4 cycle outboard technology was unusual and therefore unproven. I think this created a market for 2 cycle DI outboard motors.

At this point, with 4 cycle OB motors having been around for a decade plus, those disadvantages have largely disappeared. Will we see large 4 cycle OBs that are 30 years old, as we routinely do with carb 2 cycle OBs? In my mind the jury is still out.

I do not see large 4 cycle motors older than 10 years, however, my sample size is my waterfront neighborhood.

I know of 2 guys that run 150 - 200HP 2 cycle DI OBs, and a few that run older carb 150HP 2 cycle OBs (like me). The rest have those 4 cycle Yammys from 150-300HP. One neighbor has twin 225 Tohatso 4 cycle motors, to replace his original Merc 225HP 4 cycle motors. The Mercs lasted 10 years, and he had no idea what was wrong with them so he replaced them for $40K.

It seems like Americans simply do not like 2 cycle engines. Everything that can go to 4 cycle or electric seems to go that way. Electric lawnmowers and chainsaws claim to out power gasoline versions.

Off topic for sure. Still a question why BRP is going with 2 cycle DI motors.

4T outboards have been around forever, Honda started making them in 1964. I bought my Honda new in 1999, it gets year round use in salt and the 4th hour meter is reading over 500 hours, I don't know how many hours total it has as it went several years without an hour meter after the 2nd or 3rd one died. Zero major 4-stroke specific repairs as of yet (hopefully not cursing myself now) and it has been living under the "care" of my teenage son for the past year. 4-strokes last really well if they're properly cared for. If abused or neglected they'll fall apart like anything else, mostly due to corrosion, at least here in S. FL. Based on my own experience, I have no desire at all to go back to a 2-stroke.

To stay on topic: this new motor looks like it's very specifically targeted to fresh water lakes. I really doubt that thing would survive a day fishing in the ocean. Imagine 2-3' rollers towards the stern and everyone runs to the back of the boat to haul in a fish, or even worse you have to back down on a fish. Regular outboards are partially submerged in this situation, that thing would be fully submerged for some time.

 

[briangcc]

Right but......BRP claims its built in a sump system for that very situation. Time will tell if that's indeed the case or not.

 

[racerone]

Find ---clarke troller----It was a little outboard where cylinder block was fully submerged.----Eliminated the need for driveshaft / gears / water pump.-----I do not see a problem with this set-up to do with it being submerged !!----These people are not a bunch of dummies !

 

[Scott Danforth]

jet skis can operate under water for about 10-seconds before the natural boyancy will pop it back to the surface. this is done with a labyrinth style air box and the ability to expel water

same technology that allows submarining a jet ski also allows for this low-profile outboard to live life at or below the water line in rollers

remember, this isnt just a north america launch. the outboard was globally launched with reviews from Australia, north america, south america, europe, etc.

 

[redneck joe]

if a sterndrive can live under water, and have a big a.. hole into the boat, don't see why this wont work. But then again I thought the L Drive was a good idea.

 

[MattFL]

They would have to put a snorkel on it for ocean use. For example, picture backing down on a fish with that motor, it would be completely submerged. I couldn't find an example on youtube with an outboard, but picture the video below but with that motor. We've done this several times in my boat with an outboard and a regular outboard is buried up to the cowling, that thing would be completely under for extended periods of time, not just a few seconds. We obviously try not to let this much water over the stern, but you definitely get water in the boat.

 

[racerone]

The folks at BRP have been around boats for more than 1 weekend.-----This unit can be fully submerged for long periods I am sure.----Many ocean liners run with engines fully below the waterline.

 

[MattFL]

It's about the air intake being below the waterline, that's the challenge. I guess my point is, I doubt we're going to see these marketed for ocean going saltwater boats.

 

[Scott Danforth]

It's about the air intake being below the waterline, that's the challenge. I guess my point is, I doubt we're going to see these marketed for ocean going saltwater boats.

yet, they are being marketed all over Australia

 

[racerone]

Has anybody inspected one to see where the air intake is ???

 

[Scott Danforth]

its snorkled to the boat