Another pit-bull tragedy!

12Footer

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Mar 25, 2001
Messages
8,217
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

Pit bull or mini-pin, it is like having monsters on the loose. Free-ranging monsters! I used to have to console my kids all the time, and assure them, "there are no monsters out there!! Take out the garbage!!"<br />If I only knew, I would've never let them out of my sight EVER.
 

88spl

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Mar 18, 2002
Messages
385
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

From Dallas Fox4 news station..............<br /><br />(PALESTINE, March 1) -- The SPCA of Texas and Anderson County officials seized 46 fighting pit bulls this morning from a residence in Palestine, Texas, about 125 miles southeast of Dallas. At least nine dogs were found dead in various stages of decomposition, some still chained to trees with their collars on.<br /><br />Sick isn't it.........
 

SoulWinner

Commander
Joined
Apr 16, 2002
Messages
2,423
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

88spl, obviously it's not the dogs that blow, but the owners..... my rotty (named Precious) is the most gentile puppy ever.
 

88spl

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Mar 18, 2002
Messages
385
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

I to SoulWinner have a dog, choc lab, she is my shadow. She for some unknown reason, when a stranger comes calling, will run up to them and I swear, she grrrrrrrowls, barks, you would think she is going to bite your head off, but she doesn't. I did not teach her that, but I feel safe leaving her to watch over my daughter of 16 yrs. She is a very good watch dog. She sleeps with me, except when me and the wife do the horizontal thing, eats with me, she will not eat unless I am there. If I give her a milk bone, and I leave the house, she will save it till I get back and then eat it. She rides with me in my truck, and her fav is to go fishing with me. She is my buddy. Oh and when we play catch, she tries to throw, but has not quite mastered it yet, she shakes her head and the ball goes to her side, we are working on it.<br /><br />I was bit in the face as a child 6 yrs old, by a pitt bull, from what my mother says I deserved it. After I did the hospital thing, the owner had the dog put down, I feel bad about it to this day, as I tormented it. Good thing was someone was around to get the dog of my face.
 

ae708

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jun 17, 2002
Messages
591
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

One of my friends in Jax had a retarded pitbull female. This dog was a riot to watch. She'd trip over her own feet, start walking and her rear would get faster than her front and she'd be walking sideways, get up to go in the yard and fall off the porch. Hilarious... but she was a sweet mutt... very loving and gentle.
 

jtexas

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Oct 13, 2003
Messages
8,646
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

I saw footage on the news last night of the pit bull fighting puppy farm. Most of the pups had at least one ear chewed off. All were starved for attention, some were just starved. I guess they must have used some of the weaker pups as live bait for the others.<br /><br />I wonder if there's a place for those dogs; Homeland Security may have a job for 'em. Or maybe the CIA needs some good interrogation dogs.
 

Stratocaster

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Aug 13, 2003
Messages
334
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

The Province of Ontario (as of yesterday) has just banned the breed.<br /><br />If you already own one, you can keep it, but it's illegal for the dog to be out in public without a muzzle. Breeders are to be shut down. If you move there and have a pit bull, you can't bring it with you.<br /><br />A step in the right direction, but an enforcing nightmare.
 

SpinnerBait_Nut

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
Joined
Aug 25, 2002
Messages
17,651
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

It's a shame that a few bad apples(owners) has lead to all this stereotyping of this breed.<br /><br />Can't blame the dog people, blame the irresponsible owners for the attacks by these dogs.<br /><br />People need to read up on this breed. A lot would be surprised at what they would find out about them.<br /><br />I did and I was.
 

SCO

Lieutenant
Joined
Aug 19, 2001
Messages
1,463
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

The flash presentation premise is that it is the treatment of the pit that makes it what it is. An unfair rap, nurture vs nature. Baloney. These animals have been artifically selected (vs naturally selected) to be what they are. They have always been fighting dogs, and the most vicious and meanest are the ones that the breeders have chosen to reproduce, ;like breeding racehorses, quarter horses, retrievers, or sheep herding dogs to do what they and only they can do best. In my observation, the people that buy these dogs, with exceptions of course, are impressed with the fearlessness and threat of the breed...it somehow transfers to their own self image, like wearing brass knuckles or having a shaved head with tatoos all over it. The dog is oft times an extension of the owners hostility. Don't get me wrong, I like feeling tough as much as any man, its part of our nature, but it's irresponsible, unless properly caged like you would a pet tiger, to allow an animal like this in any neighborhood let alone one with children while rationalizing that the treatment of the pit by the owner is what makes it what it is. A gun, a human can control. These animals have their own minds and nature. One of my idiot neighbors got his girlfriend(with 2 kids) one of these giant mastiffs something like what I imagine killed that poor woman in the hall of her apartment. I see her walking the dog which is bigger than she is and it bugs be. The next week the man ,a reasonably strong individual,is wallking the dog , has a good leash (he's a responsible dangerous dog owner), and another neighbors old broken down lab that usually waters and fertilizes all our lawns(another gripe, if he wants 2 big dogs in his back yard, he should deal with that problem not us), anyway the broken down lab, an animal I like but for the problem with the owner, goes over to sniff noses. The mastiff gets agitated, and with the idiot fully restraining said mastiff, starts going after the lab and bites him on the nose big time. Took two full grown men to break it up even with one dog on the leash. To the idiots credit, I havn't seen the dog being walked in the neighborhood since. Why am I angry?? because these idiots subject my kids, my neighbors kids, and their own kids to a dangerous situation.
 

SpinnerBait_Nut

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
Joined
Aug 25, 2002
Messages
17,651
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

The Un-Warranted Negative Stigma<br /><br />Unfortunately in today's society many people are ignorant about the American Pit Bull Terrier ( APBT ). Because of this ignorance, proliferation by the media of false data, and the false reports of individuals, this dog has went from a highly respected and desired pet to one that is unfairly judged, and in many cases around the country and even the world, are seized due to prohibition of ownership laws known as Breed Specific Legislation ( BSL ).<br /><br />Additionally laws have been developed and rules established by "so called" humane organizations which seek to practice euthanasia on these animals without even the opportunity of adoption or being sent to rescue associations.<br /><br />This stigma has hurt the Pit Bull dog more than any other breed of dog and caused unrealistic fear within much of the general community. <br /><br />It is of the utmost importance for us as lovers of these beautiful and majestic animals to not promote this unfair negative stigma and counteract such negativisms with truth both by example and word.<br /><br />To help promote the truth it is important for us to recognize the studies that have taken place which prove the true nature of the Pit Bull.<br /><br />Farmers Branch, Texas, a suburb of Dallas, has kept accurate records since 1980. During a 7 year period from 1980 through 1987, this is what was recorded. Total bites: 1,593. Pit bulls, 30 bites, or 1.89% of the total. Other studies tend to show the same results and because of so many mongrels that have similar features and the unfair lumping in with the American Pit Bull Terrier ( APBT ), it seems reasonable to assume that the figures are actually much lower. <br /><br />The American Temperament Test Society continually ranks Pits better in temperamnet than many other breeds such as the Airedale Terrier, Basenji, Beagle, Bichon Frise, Border Collie, Chihuahua, Collie, Dachshund(4 of 6 varieties), English Setter, Lhasa Opso, Pomeranian, Shar-Pei, Shiba Inu, Shih Tzu, Schnauzer, and Toy Poodle all score below average and many more far below than that of the Pit Bull. Even though their temperament score is less than average many would not even think twice in their ownership as a family pet. <br /><br />In a report from Dekalb County Georgia, the conclusion was reached that statistics could no be used to document the dangerousness of any one breed, or the comparison of one breed to another. The 5-year study of fatal attacks from 1975-1980 lists the German Shepherds first and "mixed breeds" second with the American Pit Bull Terrier ( APBT ) listed 6th. <br /><br />A 6-year study in Palm Beach County of "most severe dog bite by breed" shows the top 10 breeds who have been identified in this comparison.<br /><br /> <br />1988: APBT ranked 9th w/9 per cent of bites <br />1989: APBT ranked 5th w/15 per cent <br />1990: APBT ranked 5th w/16 per cent <br />1991: APBT ranked 9th w/10 per cent <br />1992: APBT ranked 2nd w/20.4 per cent (w/cocker spaniel showing in 1st) <br />1993: APBT ranked 5th w/16 per cent <br /> <br />Some of the breeds which placed above the Pit Bull's were Dalmations, Chows, Labs, Goldens, Rotties, Dobermans, and the Cocker Spaniel. <br /> <br />In a 1993 study, also in Palm Beach County, the bites were ranked by severity from 1 to 4 and the animal that was recorded as having inflicted the greatest number of severe bites was the domestic short-haired cat. A breed labeled as "pit bull" was in 5th place, following cat, German Shepherds, Chow and Lab. <br /> <br />The division of general pediatrics, emergency medicine, at Children's Hospital in Philadelphia conducted a study in 1989 as a result of a ***perceived*** increase in Pit Bull injuries. 12 different breed/crossbreds were identified as perpetrators, the top four of which were German Shepherds, Pit Bulls, Rottweilers and Dobermans. 54 per cent of the animals were contained and 45 per cent were provoked prior to biting (by parental report). <br /> <br />In 1991, in Australia, the Journal of Pediatric Child Health reported that the German Shepherd was implicated in dog bites presented to the ER of a children's hospital and were implicated more frequently than their prevalence in the community. <br /> <br />Finally, in an article in Pediatrics, June 1994, an article entitled "Which Dogs Bite? A case control of risk factors." concluded the following: <br /> <br />Dog bites cause an estimated 585,000 injuries resulting in the need for medical attention yearly and children are the most frequent victims . The study sought to determine dog-specific factors independently associated with a dog biting a non-household member. (88% occur in the dog owner's yard or home or in the **adjoining** yard. 62% members of the victims' families witnessed the bite.) <br /> <br />The identified risk group are children less than 11 years old, the average age is 8, males outnumber females. This is probably out of disrespect typically exemplified by these young children. Only 7% required hospital admission. <br /> <br />The method was to match 178 pairs of dogs selected from dogs reported to an urban animal control for a first-bite episode on a non-household member in which the victim received medical treatment. Controls were neighborhood-matched dogs with no history of biting a non-household member, selected by modified random-digit dialing. <br /> <br />The results were risk factors expressed as adjusted odds ratio, when the dog is.... <br />A German Shepherd 16.4 <br />A Male 6.2 <br />A Chow-Chow 4.0 <br />Living in a house with 1 or more children 3.5 <br />Chained in the yard 2.8 <br />Not neutered 2.6 <br /><br />The odds of being struck by lightning are 1 in 600,000 in the USA. Comparatively speaking you are 6 times more likely to be struck by lightning than you are to be killed by a dog of any breed. When you further break down the odds of being attacked and killed by a Pit Bull the odds are in your favor -approximately 1 in 145,000,000. That’s million folks. In contrast, you are 4 times more likely to be killed by a cow in the USA than any breed of dog, much less a Pit Bull. <br /><br />So why do some dogs attack? <br /><br />The answer is quite simple really.<br /><br />Irresponsible pet owners. <br />Irresponsible parents. <br />Instigation by the "so called" victims themselves. <br />Although there are some bad dogs out there these are in the minority and the tendency is to blame the dogs and / or their owners without just cause. <br /><br />In today’s society we have unfortunately moved away from personal accountability and responsibility. Many are looking for others to take care of them in every aspect of their lives including the proper raising of their children. When something negative happens then it is no longer their fault because they have been dependant on the care of others. Today’s society is eager to slap the victim label on anyone who becomes hurt even if this is due to their own negligence and in many cases is the choice of the individual and was their intent to behave stupidly. <br /><br />If you are an owner of a dog it is your responsibility to make sure it is properly confined. For the good of society you should additionally make sure it is well socialized. <br /><br />If you are the parent of a child it is your responsibility to raise your children with respect for you, themselves and others. In the category of others this includes both property and animals. If an animal mauls your child due to your lack of responsible parenting, this is your fault, and you must live with the moral consequences. Regardless of what a court may say you will always be the bearer of your morality and by not teaching your children respect and the proper ways to act then you bear this moral burden.<br /><br />So why am I preaching? The majority of people who are killed by dogs are children. These children often instigate the attack by trespassing, throwing objects at dogs, harassing, torturing, and otherwise acting in a threatening manner toward the attacking dog. When this is the case there is typically a strong tie to irresponsible parenting and improper education of morality and respect. From the dogs' perspective they are merely acting in self-defense, which is natural for any animal, including humans.<br />_________________________________________________<br />And that my friends are facts, not some media whoop la.
 

jtexas

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Oct 13, 2003
Messages
8,646
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

Originally posted by SBN:<br /> The Un-Warranted Negative Stigma<br /><br />Farmers Branch, Texas, a suburb of Dallas, has kept accurate records since 1980. During a 7 year period from 1980 through 1987, this is what was recorded. Total bites: 1,593. Pit bulls, 30 bites, or 1.89% of the total. <br />
A good example of how you can find statistics to support any claim. Those numbers are meaningless without knowing what percent of the total dog population is pit bull. If 2% of Farmers Branch dogs are pit bulls, the statistic is appalling; if 80% are pit bulls, then they are angels.<br /><br />Interestingly:<br />
<br />In a report from Dekalb County Georgia, the conclusion was reached that statistics could no be used to document the dangerousness of any one breed, or the comparison of one breed to another.
<br />The American Temperament Test Society continually ranks Pits better in temperamnet than many other breeds such as the Airedale Terrier, Basenji, Beagle, Bichon Frise, Border Collie, Chihuahua, Collie, Dachshund(4 of 6 varieties), English Setter, Lhasa Opso, Pomeranian, Shar-Pei, Shiba Inu, Shih Tzu, Schnauzer, and Toy Poodle all score below average and many more far below than that of the Pit Bull.
Oh my, Chihuahuas, weenie dogs and Toy Poodles, look I just wet myself!<br /><br /><br />
<br />A 6-year study in Palm Beach County of "most severe dog bite by breed" shows the top 10 breeds who have been identified in this comparison.<br /><br />1988: APBT ranked 9th w/9 per cent of bites <br />1989: APBT ranked 5th w/15 per cent <br />1990: APBT ranked 5th w/16 per cent <br />1991: APBT ranked 9th w/10 per cent <br />1992: APBT ranked 2nd w/20.4 per cent (w/cocker spaniel showing in 1st) <br />1993: APBT ranked 5th w/16 per cent <br />
top ten six years running. Wonder what happened in 1992?<br /><br />
<br />_________________________________________________<br />And that my friends are facts, not some media whoop la.
 

Twidget

Commander
Joined
Jun 16, 2004
Messages
2,192
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

I know that when my house was being built and I was shopping for insurance, all insurance companies wanted to know what kind of pets I have. Evidently, if you dog is on their black list, they wont insure you. Fortunately, I guess, Shelties havent made the list yet.
 

12Footer

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Mar 25, 2001
Messages
8,217
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

I agree with the stigma being unwaranted, but the facts are, ANY dog been be trained to kill,or to at minimum, die trying to.<br />It aint the animal, it's the "animal that leads the pack", who the blame falls squarely upon.<br />Stop the preditory trainer, and you stop the whole preditory pack.<br />They call them "man's best friend" for good reason.
 

SCO

Lieutenant
Joined
Aug 19, 2001
Messages
1,463
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

Well, I've spent some time google searching on pits, and there are a lot of people out there saying the breed gets an unfair rap. And, the descriptions sound like the dog would make a good pet in some instances. I see your points. I can see that in some places that could be a good dog if properly socialized. A big problem is that ,at least in my parts, the people that are attracted to the breed, are attracted to it for its ferocious reputation. They arent the ones to responsibly socialize the dogs as family pets. About once a year in this area a child or old lady is killed by a dog, and I don't recall that breed as being any other than a pit in the last 5 years. Theres usually a picture of the dog or video of it, they are pits. Doesn't mean people dont get bit all the time by all kinds of breeds. This is a case where bad nurturing meets an aggressive tenacious loyal unyielding nature. The traits that can make it a great and loyal pet, can make it a nightmare for those outside the "pack" . Yeah, my poodle is pretty aggressive sometimes and is also fiercely loyal and protective...but what can it do?? I wouldn't want to have to worry about my dog hurting anyone.
 

SpinnerBait_Nut

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
Joined
Aug 25, 2002
Messages
17,651
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

I have spent the better part of the last 2 days researching these dogs, cause just like the Dob's, they get a bad shake. Stereotyping if you will.<br />Matter of fact, I now have a 6 week old female pit in the house and I will see how well it trains.<br />So far it shows great promise. Very smart and very obedient.<br /><br />I will keep you posted. Just please do some reading and really find out about any dog, before condemning it.
 

SCO

Lieutenant
Joined
Aug 19, 2001
Messages
1,463
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

SBN, I have no doubt, knowing your nature from reading some thousands of your posts, that your pit will turn out to be a great dog. I consider you though to be an exception in the world of pit owners. I hope you too will keep an open mind. Maybe it isn't all stereotype.
 

kenimpzoom

Rear Admiral
Joined
Jul 13, 2002
Messages
4,807
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

SBN, just keep in mind that like all "good" dogs, they can be unpredictable.<br /><br />I wouldnt feel comfortable having that dog near any children, solely cause if they bite, it will do major damage.<br /><br />Ken
 

fixin

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Apr 23, 2004
Messages
775
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

I've had several pits over the years.None of them ever acted agresive toward anyone.I had one that got her hip dislocated by a 13 year old kid(that she just met that day) falling on her,wile playing frisbee.Didn't growl or nothing.
 

pjc

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jun 29, 2003
Messages
1,856
Re: Another pit-bull tragedy!

still imo, rots, pits, wolf halfbreeds, and the derivatives are inherently untrustworthy. Ban them. A movement is indeed underway in the US to this end in that insurers are denying coverage to people who posses these breeds, as well as some others known to be unstable. This is a start in the right direction. More to come over time. Local municipalities will soon begin coding them out too. <br /><br />And I do agree with SCO, in that people who get their rocks off by owning a potential vicious animal do so out of a need to fulfill their own inadequacies. Or the "mine is bigger than yours" syndrome.<br /><br />Again, I am not dissin' folks here who support these breeds, Just mo.
 
Top