87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

Does anyone remember the movie 'aliens'? well... thats it then...GAME OVER! GAME OVER MAN!! :grumpy:

Filled it with some new oil, hooked up battery and hit the key... CLUNK. no turn over... put a torque wrench set to over 200ftlbs on the crank pulley, cant budge it. Shes seized solid. So i started pulling some plugs.. 3 cylinders full of milky oily goo.. oh, and its leaking/dripping down the bell housing again. Now if I could only scratch up $4500, I could buy this parts boat i just found locally, with a 330 hp merc 454 and B1 drive, 200hours on it...

 

[zool]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

Bummer man, sorry to hear that....you can get a ready to go Contessa in Buffalo...

1986 28 Foot Bayliner

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

...ready to go Contessa in Buffalo...

1986 28 Foot Bayliner

:lol: ya...bit out of my driving range, and likely price to...

A buddy just came over and we were working on it for the past few hours, we poured diesel into the intake, sprayed wd40 in all the plug holes, ran hot water from my house washing machine into the drive and heated up the motor, and to my disbelief, we managed to get it turned over! Well, not all the way... about a half turn, and it will go back the same... seams (and sounds) like maybe a chunk of ice is stuck on the crank, and not letting it make a full rev.. so if winter would gtfo already, ad give me 3-4 days of warm weather I might be able to fire this pig and see how bad it is... (ie; a bit bad, really bad, or just NFG) :facepalm: I think its beer oclock..

 

[Speak]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

:lol: ya...bit out of my driving range, and likely price to...

A buddy just came over and we were working on it for the past few hours, we poured diesel into the intake, sprayed wd40 in all the plug holes, ran hot water from my house washing machine into the drive and heated up the motor, and to my disbelief, we managed to get it turned over! Well, not all the way... about a half turn, and it will go back the same... seams (and sounds) like maybe a chunk of ice is stuck on the crank, and not letting it make a full rev.. so if winter would gtfo already, ad give me 3-4 days of warm weather I might be able to fire this pig and see how bad it is... (ie; a bit bad, really bad, or just NFG) :facepalm: I think its beer oclock..

Big D! Dahm that doesnt look good. That brown poop in the cylinders is not a good sign. I just would hate to see you lose on this project. only you can decide if its time to throw in the towel. If the boat is worth fixen then maybe a repower is an option.
Stu......

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

...That brown poop in the cylinders is not a good sign...

no poop eh? :lol: Well, i just jumped in there again, figured no harm in giving her another try... got almost a full rev out of the motor now, but its still locking up. Also, it shot diesel/brown poop/wd40 out of the plug holes all over my leg in the process.. :facepalm: I'm guessing from the 3 cylinders that bleed brown goo, the water/ice pushed the oil up past the rings, and now as its thawing, any water up there is draining back down.. explains why the first time the motor appeared dry, but the next day i pulled more oily water out. I guess one thing is 'good' tho, the block is likely not cracked, as it appears to hold water :laugh:

 

[Speak]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

no poop eh? :lol: Well, i just jumped in there again, figured no harm in giving her another try... got almost a full rev out of the motor now, but its still locking up. Also, it shot diesel/brown poop/wd40 out of the plug holes all over my leg in the process.. :facepalm: I'm guessing from the 3 cylinders that bleed brown goo, the water/ice pushed the oil up past the rings, and now as its thawing, any water up there is draining back down.. explains why the first time the motor appeared dry, but the next day i pulled more oily water out. I guess one thing is 'good' tho, the block is likely not cracked, as it appears to hold water :laugh:

Big D- Put a heat lamp in the bilge tonight?? that "L" fix that ice in there. That Big block has to Fire up!!!! by the way how did all the water get in her?

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

That Big block has to Fire up!!!! by the way how did all the water get in her?

Ya, I'm hoping it will run still... Me and my buddy have come up with a 'plan' to at least hoist the motor up a few feet (i beam across the rear sides of the boat) to change out the oil pan gasket if need be.. I got in there tonight after work and it spins freely now with a 1/2" ratchet (and 1' bar) by hand, with a slight drag, but it's even. IE; no tight spots in the rotation, and I went around about 8 full revs and pushed most of whatever was in the cylinders out the plug holes. (water/oil/diesel) I'm gona give it a few more days, to make sure whatever might still be frozen to the crank will melt off, then its round 2 this coming weekend... suck the bad out, dump in fresh oil, attempt to crank...

As for it getting in, I have an evolving theory on it... It would have started even before this I'm sure, but likely most of it would be from last year, when my marina moved the boat to the front of the yard (to put for sale) and blocked it. The poor thing had already sat for 2 seasons, so the top and hatches were not keeping the water out very well at all anymore. At some point, the center hatch in the cabin got cracked/broken, and I assume the drain plug hole in the transom became blocked early last spring.. a spring and summer of rain, and no one paying attention to it filled her up pretty good, till the day the front of the hull broke/cracked at the blocking wood. That drained the cabin for the most part :lol:, but I'll bet the engine bay was still quite full, and they likely just un-clogged the plug hole, let her drain, and that was that. (keep in mind the marina was out 3 seasons of storage, as well as some outstanding shop labor/work for this boat at the time)

At this point, my marina lifted and re-blocked it but I believe there was enough water in the engine bay it could have gotten in the dipstick tube, as well as past the spark plugs (which were not very tight btw) and when I checked it upon purchase, I did notice the engine oil was slightly milky/grey but didn't think much more of it.. also, I now think it may have been getting some water in through the intake manifold to block area, as I can see some rusting areas that look to me like water was sitting for a while.. either way, its kind of a moot point now.. it got in, it likely did some damage, but time will tell if it's salvageable. If so, I'll obviously be taking steps to prevent any more such issues in the future :laugh: and be sure to test run the next boat/motor I buy :laugh:

 

[redneck joe]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

I got lucky on mine; I didn't start it. It had sat for three years, but inside. New batteries when I got it home, started fine the first time. Ran like crap for the first hour or so until the Seafoam cleared it out but like a champ since. I figured for the price I paid I would put in a new one if I had too.

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

It is a sad day....

I retract my previous statements about 'the block being good' as it definitely is NOT at this point... its been warm enough the last few days, any ice left in the motor would be thawed by now, so I got in with the intention of pulling whatever more water that accumulated out, along with the now contaminated new oil (5L) I put in the other day... well, I got 10 liters of straight clear water out, before ANY oil appeared in the clear plastic sucker tube.. :facepalm: So I think its a safe bet to say, she's cracked internally and the hot water I ran into the drive from my house the other day didn't ALL go through the motor and back out the prop.. It rolls over by hand, but has a slight tight spot now as well... I see no point in even trying to start/run it, or spend any more time/$ on it at this point.. So that is that, might put the drive up for sale, along with the various 'parts' on the motor and see what I can get out of it. The hull is worthless to anyone else at the moment, but there's a chance I can get enough $$$ out of the drive and other things to make that a wash.. then carry on and hunt down another power package, piece by piece if I have to. Pretty much puts me on dry land this season for sure tho, which sucks... water levels are gona be up, may be the best season in years.. :cold:

 

[redneck joe]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

take one last look....

 

[GT1000000]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

Dang it!
But like redneck joe said...take one last look...
Maybe, just maybe, you have a blown head gasket...or even a cracked head and the block is OK?
If you are going to part it out...it might be a good idea to blow the motor apart...take the exhaust risers off, pop the heads and have a good look inside...at the very least, you'll drop a couple hundred pounds off the block, which will make it easier to take out of the hull...and if the block really has become nothing more than an anchor, you might be better off selling the individual parts on evilbay...
IDK, I guess I am a sucker for punishment or an eternal optimist...but if the engine is repairable, it ain't that big of a deal and you could probably handle most of it, if of course, the main components are salvageable...

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

... if the engine is repairable, it ain't that big of a deal and you could probably handle most of it, if of course, the main components are salvageable...

Well that's what I fear, is the crank may be bent, as it has a tight spot when turning it over by hand now. I think either way I will pull the risers and manifolds tomorrow, and start the tear down on the top end of the motor... easy to store most parts on a shelf to sell off bit by bit.. I'm thinking it would be between $1500 and $2500 by the time its all said and done to re+re this motor and put back in.. plus finish the bulkhead repair, plus finish the cabin floor/carpet, and all the other things it needs to be ready to go back in the water.. I would be further ahead to add all that up, plus what I can get out of parting it, and buy another boat.. and I'm really leaning towards throwing in the towel and parting/stripping the thing down at this point now.. on top of everything else, I have today discovered what appears to be a crack/de-laminating tabbing in the glass on the rear bulkhead, behind the fuel tank. Where it attaches to the main stringers. :facepalm: With the amount of water that sat in this tub, and the forward bulkhead being as bad as it was, I'll bet its done too. So it was an adventure.. it was something to do for the winter, and some learning experiences.. but I think its time to call it.

 

[redneck joe]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

well your sig line tells us you'll be on to another one soon if you throw in the towel on this one.

 

[projectcop]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

After 10 years+ working in machine shop, I will just say this. If I had your boat in my driveway; I would be trolling craigslist for an ford van or beater motorhome with a 460 in it. I would find one for about a grand, tow it or drive it home, pull the motor; put all the boat accessories on it and drop it in the boat.
Just my 2 cents. Think about it. Not much difference between the truck and boat 460's. At least consider it.

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

After 10 years+ working in machine shop, I will just say this. If I had your boat in my driveway; I would be trolling craigslist for an ford van or beater motorhome with a 460 in it. I would find one for about a grand, tow it or drive it home, pull the motor; put all the boat accessories on it and drop it in the boat.
Just my 2 cents. Think about it. Not much difference between the truck and boat 460's. At least consider it.

:lol: A fellow machine shop veteran eh? Well I did consider just that, as they used the 460 in many RV and hauler trucks and vans, up into the 90s (EFI even) and its not that I don't have the skills or ability to do it.. after searching around, ya, I could drive a few hours, pick up a beater camper van, pull the motor, somehow fight the motor out of the boat, switch it all over, and after much work and aggravation possibly have a good motor back in there. By the time its all said and done, things breaking, or needing replaced, I'll be in another $2000. Plus the added cost ($?) and work of digging into the rear structure of the boat now, and whatever surprises that brings, + + + +..... I really feel like this is the breaking point for me, and its starting to seem like a huge money pit. I know, its a boat, the hole in the water you throw money into, but in the end it all adds up to this; Its always going to be just an old Bayliner with outdated OMC power that no one wants, or makes parts for. I think I want out before I'm in too deep..

Waiting to hear this weekend about a boat I found locally, a 93 Crownline 250cr.. New camper top last year, smaller but fully outfitted cabin w/cooking, fridge, head, AND... a Merc 7.4/B2 drive package. Its been serviced and winterized (guaranteed) by the marina its at, needs cosmetic and minor work, (seats are all pretty worn/cracked, its pretty dirty inside and out atm) for $2500. I think for another $500 it would be ready to splash in a month or so. I'd be hard pressed, I think, to get this bayliner finished for another $3000, and in seaworthy shape, and definitely not this season. Plus this other boat would be WORTH putting some effort and $$ into imo, is trailer-able, and will cost less for dockage.

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

well your sig line tells us you'll be on to another one soon if you throw in the towel on this one.

yup more than likely I will, hopefully one not so rotted and abused, and with parts availability for the mechanicals :lol:

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

Well, towel thrown.. Put up a for sale add for parts/whole friday night... Sold the seats and a few other pieces to a guy yesterday, and the outdrive to another later last night. So I pulled a few more things off, that I might make a few more bucks from, and changed the for sale add to FREE, take her away. :lol: A guy is on his way, and if he doesn't take her, 3 more people are in line. re-(re)-named her, temporarily, as well.. (i dont know what the name on it meant anyway, was gibberish to me..) Turns out I've re-coped about 75% of what I had into it, possibly get closer to 90% by the time I off some other bits and pieces, and the guys that got the seats are local; so I may even get to sit on them this summer, installed on a boat. :laugh:

 

[banshee owner]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

bigdirty so sorry to hear that. i hope you recover as close to the cost you have in it. you were doing a great job onward and upward to better things

 

[zool]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

Sounds like you came full circle....theres a bright side, now you get to boat shop!

 

[bigdirty]

Re: 87 bayliner refurb/restoration project... "The Big Dirty"

Sounds like you came full circle....theres a bright side, now you get to boat shop!

yah...ahem.. "Now"? ...I've been looking around since last week.. :laugh: Going to look VERY closely at anything else I pick up though, structural and rot issues, or signs of massive trauma or abuse... and no more OMC stuff for me either. (dont know why I didnt learn THAT lesson with my stringer drive Chriscraft...) Maybe, just maybe, i can break into something in the 90's.. with merc power/drive..

and thanks banshee owner, dont worry, i'll definitely be doing some more boat seats/cabin refit next winter, whatever i end up with.. :lol: seams to be 'what I do'

It's kinda funny, I'm getting almost non stop emails and texts for the old girl.. seams the word 'free' just gets people excited.. I tell everyone 'its free for a reason, or 5', give them the rundown, and they still want it... I've told all its first come, first take. The guy that was to take her today just called me and was in a panic, hes broken down on the highway with a flat on his trailer, 2 hour wait to get fixed, and it will be late/dark by the time he would make it here.. so he's offered me $50 and a case of beer, and promises me he will be here tomorrow for 5pm.. what the heck right? ha.. ok.