Vulcarity

[jtexas]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by ZmOz:<br /> <br />It is no more the school's business to define student's morals than it is my business to define your children's morals or your business to define my child's morals.

You can't define another person's morals, but you can control their behavior. In the adult world it's done with fines and late fees and jail time and salaries and bonuses. In school it's done with grades and detention and, in this case, fines.<br /><br />Furthermore, there are times and places where swearing is inappropriate and unacceptable. School is one of those places. You don't have to teach your kids that if you don't want to, but you're just making their lives that much more difficult.<br /><br />If I have my wife & children in a public place and you start using profanity, you're going to get arrested. Or hurt.

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Vulcarity

That's FUC.......KING.....Ridiculous! ..... Whoever came up with that "BRAINCHILD'should be run out of town on a rail.....Just another run at your wallet by the government.....JK

 

[rodbolt]

Re: Vulcarity

I like it JasonJ<br /> I took many a whipping from many a teacher and more than one principle .<br /> was a whale of a lot better than detention and or calling mom.<br /> if ya got detention mom knows, she calls the school and finds out why, now its been an hour or two of detention, an arse whooping by mom, who has already informed dad, and another ares whoopping when dad got home even if he had to get us out of bed to do it.<br /> then I would have to write a two page apology outlining the bad behavoir and the policies I was going to implement to rectify such behavoir. yes I wrote a lot then too <br /> it prepared me for the internet.<br /> I just wish my spelling and keyboarding as well as diction and syntax skills were as good as my technical skills.<br /><br /> but it was rare that we got in trouble at school. that usually ment a loss of fishing and hunting and biking and about any other rights we had. the TV was a non-issue cause we did not have one till I was almost 12 or so.<br /> the creek however was 200 yds away and always full of fish. in grandbay AL it stayed warm enough to fish most the year. man I hated sitting inside when the fish were waiting.<br /> the reason me and most my friends stayed out of trouble at school had nothing to do with school authority and everything to do with the "authority" waiting at home.<br /><br /> I am 44, my mom is 72. to this day I am convinced that if I told her to F*** off the beating would commence instantaneously. <br /> used to be not only did parents demand respect but made it quite painful if the lesson was not learned.<br /> but at 12 telling mom to **** off would have involved a lot of pain, not only from mom but from dad. and for a week everytime dad thought about it.

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by jtexas:<br /> If I have my wife & children in a public place and you start using profanity, you're going to get arrested. Or hurt.

Wrong. Free speach is king in this country. If I want to cuss in public I can and will. Anybody that tries to "hurt" me or even threatens to do so is the one that gets arrested, every time.<br /><br />Whether you guys like it or agree with it, kids have 100% the same rights to free speach that you do, and they always will. There is nothing anyone can do about it...short of amending the constitution.<br /><br />If my parents hit me they would get hit back and then arrested. Violence is no way to teach children or anyone else. We have child services in this country for a very good reason. Anybody see that graph I posted in another thread? The one that shows violent acts among children is lower now than it has been in 30 years? What's changed in 30 years? Parents stopped hitting their children. Just because your parents hit you doesn't make it OK.<br /><br />Some of you are just plain un-american.

 

[QC]

Re: Vulcarity

ZmOz,<br /><br />I appreciate your passion, but I have one question. Do you have kids?<br /><br />Also, they had kids arresting their parents in Nazi Germany too . . .

 

[tommays]

Re: Vulcarity

as i said above and ZmOz is telling you what has become very real you can no longer do much to your children other than talking or yelling<br /><br />my neice is Manic-Depressive and my SIL was closeing her door to stay away from here <br /><br />well her finger was injured and she was taken to the hospital were she has been admitted for her mental problems MANY times<br /><br />now my SIL is on the child services S??? list for trying to protect her self from a child who can kick her *** when she is Manic<br /><br />tommays

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by Quietcat22:<br /> ZmOz,<br /><br />I appreciate your passion, but I have one question. Do you have kids?<br /><br />Also, they had kids arresting their parents in Nazi Germany too . . .

No I do not, but that is irrelivant, because the laws of this fine country are on my side, and would be no different if I had children. There are a thousand groups and activists ready to back me up on a moments notice.<br /><br />Was there also a sharp decrease in violent crime with the Nazi children? <br /><br />We also used to arrest black people for drinking out of the wrong fountain. Should we start doing that again too?

 

[QC]

Re: Vulcarity

Man Z. Chill just a little . . . You're missing my pont. Until you have had children things seem a lot simpler . . . Also, when you have kids turning their parents in for stuff, it is usually not a good thing. There are definitely exceptions.<br /><br />The Nazi kids were turning their parents in for not being good Nazis . . . Not related necessarily to this thread, but I thought it was relevant considering your comments about arresting your parents.<br /><br />What does the activist back-up stuff have to do with anything? I steer clear of most activists as a general rule.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by ZmOz:<br />

Originally posted by jtexas:<br /> If I have my wife & children in a public place and you start using profanity, you're going to get arrested. Or hurt.

Wrong. Free speach is king in this country. If I want to cuss in public I can and will. Anybody that tries to "hurt" me or even threatens to do so is the one that gets arrested, every time.<br /><br />Whether you guys like it or agree with it, kids have 100% the same rights to free speach that you do, and they always will. There is nothing anyone can do about it...short of amending the constitution.<br /><br />If my parents hit me they would get hit back and then arrested. Violence is no way to teach children or anyone else. We have child services in this country for a very good reason. Anybody see that graph I posted in another thread? The one that shows violent acts among children is lower now than it has been in 30 years? What's changed in 30 years? Parents stopped hitting their children. Just because your parents hit you doesn't make it OK.<br /><br />Some of you are just plain un-american.

Who said anything about violence? My plan is to taunt you until you beg for mercy.<br /><br />By the way, the police here in my town don't arrest parents for spanking their children.<br /><br />This is a free country and you have rights - but not unlimited rights. You don't have the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theater. You don't have the right to walk down the street naked. And your right to swing your fist ends where my face begins. <br /><br />Children don't have the same constitutional rights as adults. And with good reason. <br /><br />What's up with the "un-american" comment - resorting to personal insults because you're feeling a little threatened?

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by jtexas:<br />Who said anything about violence?

You did.<br />"you're going to get arrested. Or hurt."<br />As well as many others in this thread who are apparently unhappy that you cannot hit children.<br /><br />

Originally posted by jtexas:<br />You don't have the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theater.

But I do have the right to yell "f*** you!" in a crowded theater, and nobody can arrest me, fine me, or "hurt" me.<br /><br />

Originally posted by jtexas:<br />Children don't have the same constitutional rights as adults.

They do as far as free speach is concerned, and that is what this thread is about. Any child in this country can use any word they wish, unless the parent doesn't want them to. It is then up to the parent to punish as they see fit - not the school.<br /><br />

Originally posted by jtexas:<br />What's up with the "un-american" comment - resorting to personal insults because you're feeling a little threatened?

Anybody who thinks children do not have the right to free speach or who thinks children should be hit is unamerican and doesn't deserve to live in a free country. If that's your attitude, then yes, I was insulting you in particular. Free speach is one of the most important rights we have in this country, and I will fight to the death to keep it.<br /><br />Like I said, whine about it all you want, but the laws are on my side and there is nothing you can do to change it.

 

[AK_Chappy]

Re: Vulcarity

Zmoz,<br />You definitely do NOT understand the difference in between a RIGHT and a PRIVILEGE.<br /><br />You have the RIGHT to go to school. You have the RIGHT to express yourself and your beliefs. You have the PRIVILEGE of using certain words to express yourself.<br /><br />You say the laws are on your side? Maybe in your own world.<br />Perhaps you don't remember this story <br /><br />You are young, I know you have said that before. You do not have kids, you very obviously still have a strong dislike for authority figures. <br />Maybe someday you will grow up. Until then, peace brother, I wish you well. <br /><br />AK Chappy

 

[jtexas]

Re: Vulcarity

Well then you're a big poo-poo head. And you don't even know how to spell. And I bet you're ugly too! So there!<br /><br />I said "My plan is to taunt you until you beg for mercy." What are ya gonna do about that, huh? <br /><br />Actually here's a true story: camping in a state park with my family, late one night the campers in the next campsite were using all forms of profanity. Long story short, within a half hour the Game Warden showed up with a couple state troopers & escorted 'em out of the park.<br /><br />[meant to add this: try yelling "FU" in a crowded theater sometime...people might tolerate it once, maybe twice, but trust me, offend enough people you'll be thrown out. Freedom of Expression simply does not mean what you seem to think it means. No matter how much you whine about it]

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by AK Chappy:<br />You say the laws are on your side? Maybe in your own world.<br />Perhaps you don't remember this story <br />

And how many laws in this country are thrown out because they are found to be unconstitutional? If that guy wanted to press the issue, and take it to the supreme court, the antiquated law would be thrown out.<br /><br />

Originally posted by AK Chappy:<br />you very obviously still have a strong dislike for authority figures.

Yes, I do, and I always will. As long as I follow the rights given to me in the constitution NOBODY has authority over me or any other adult. Maybe you should try reading the constitution.<br /><br />

Originally posted by jtexas:<br />What are ya gonna do about that, huh? <br />

Generally I just ignore adults that behave like children.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Vulcarity

Nothing in the constitution guarantees a child the right to cuss at school. This is not a free speech issue. Maybe a few inner-city schools ignore the problem, but most schools send kids to detention or expel them.<br />Remember all those schools where it is illegal for kids to pray? It's the same as foul language. Exceptable behavior is defined by the school.

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by RubberFrog:<br /> Nothing in the constitution guarantees a child the right to cuss at school.

The school has the right to ask them to not cuss or leave, but they do not have the right to fine or punish anybody...and that's what this thread is about.<br /><br />It would be exactly the same if they tried to fine somebody for praying in school. Everybody knows that could never happen. They can ask you nicely to not pray or leave, but that's the extent of their power.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Vulcarity

That is just not true. Schools can, and do, hand out detention all the time.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Vulcarity

Oh yeah, get over the whole fine issue. Everybody agrees that is rediculous and will never stand a legal challenge.

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Vulcarity

Originally posted by RubberFrog:<br /> That is just not true. Schools can, and do, hand out detention all the time.

They do, but like I said, if the parent says "no, my child is not going to detention" then there is absolutely nothing they can do about it. Usually the parents agree with the detention, so usually the kids go. If the parents do not agree, they do not go, and nobody can make them. The school has no more authority to make someone go to detention than JB does to make me go to detention.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Vulcarity

Actually RubberFrog detention is being removed from the classroom...and after so many detentions ultimately you get expelled.<br /><br />Zmoz, your right to free expression is not as unlimited as you seem to think...you do not have the right to deprive others of their rights...which you are doing if you create a disturbance such as the example you gave (the crowded theater example). Or use profanity in the classroom. Or in a courtroom.<br /><br />Here's an experiment you can try: go into a commercial airport and shout "I've got a bomb" - see if your right to free expression gets the support you think it deserves.

 

[CJY]

Re: Vulcarity

ZmOz, regarding language in school and punishment for it, you are wrong. A school has every right to remove any child with disruptive behavior affecting the rights of other students. Here in my district, students that show such behavior are sent to an "alternative school." By a judge, not a school administrator, whether the parent likes it or not. At this alternative school, there are people that have been given the right by a court to physically enforce its rules when necessary. With your, I can say whatever I want attitude, you may learn of these alternative schools first hand one day. Parents do not and will never run the school as you believe. Perhaps in Oregon, things are a bit different. <br /><br />By the way Zm, are you the same person that said(on another thread) you have dealt with many law officers that were, in your opinion, abusing their power. You then ran to the chief(because you knew him) to tell on these bad, bad policemen. This kind of sheds a whole new light on your story as well as your innocence. <br /><br />With all of your constitutional rights, please explain why you cannot use obsenities here in this forum.