soldiers that refuse to fight

[oddjob]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

War is not a luxury....and niether is the National Guard!<br /><br />If you dont like it, stay out of it, get out of the way and get back to the kitchen.<br /><br />And if you need more equipment right now then take it from the enemy for cying out loud. Dont tell me how you cant do it! tell me how you CAN!.<br /><br />Seabees CAN DO !

 

[Fly Rod]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Hey oddjob!!!<br />These same people complaining about not having enough protection probably wouldn't cut the mustard in the SEA BEES not much protection on them dozers!!!, or any other branch!!!

 

[gaugeguy]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Where is George S. Patton when you need him

 

[Luna Sea]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

I'm glad Kerry has a plan. Hopefully, it will be over soon!

 

[oddjob]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Originally posted by Fly Rod:<br /> Hey oddjob!!!<br />These same people complaining about not having enough protection probably wouldn't cut the mustard in the SEA BEES not much protection on them dozers!!!, or any other branch!!!

The Marines had better equipment when I was in during the early 80's. I sware some of the equipment we had to use was WW2 vintage and still had bullet holes. Everytime we (Battalion of 800) convoyed for exercises at least 4-6 trucks would break down. It was routine and considered part of our training. The Marines would always have a double take and laugh at us when we passed on the road.

 

[12Footer]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Originally posted by POINTER94:<br /> This is a bit disturbing. If a soldier doesn’t have shoelaces it is the presidents fault? But if he does it should be considered a success? I have to put this on the commanders in the field and the fact that $87 billion has been committed and an additional $30+ billion is on it’s way on top of its standard working budget and they think it’s the presidents fault that a jeep wouldn’t run to the specifications of a foot soldier?<br /><br />It is my contention that the president is responsible for the success of a war or a goal. This includes funding and overseeing specific categories of equipment, provide for the best leadership possible and be accountable for the strategy of success. But the fact a jeep needs an oil change doesn’t sound like the prez’s job to me. Patton went to the front in a Willys. Should every soldier have a flame thrower and a bazooka, and carry every weapon in the arsenal?<br /><br />How many of the 125 that went were injured or lost their lives? JB is right, what happened to those on the front waiting? Looking for a reason not to go into battle is the fallout of this action. Soldiers in wartime don’t get to take mental health days when they feel like it.

zacly, Pointer!

 

[bubbakat]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

I don't care who you say is at fault here. The one thing comes to mind. I served two tours in a combat zone and when I didn't have all the great equipment we were suppose to have I did one thing <br />I adapted and over came.<br />I did not and will not disobey orders.

 

[JB]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Refused to fight?<br /><br />As I understand it they refused a support mission to supply the guys who were fighting because they might have to fight, too.<br /><br />Still an open question: Was it a lawful order that they refused?<br /><br />I have pretty strong opinions about following orders in wartime, but I recognize that all we know is what the media has decided to tell us, and I don't trust them to be telling the whole truth.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

JB,<br /><br />What could be unlawful about the order? Not being ex-military my understanding is the order wasn't to committ war crimes and not a suicide mission, therefore not volunteer only. Am I missing something?

 

[JasonJ]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

gspig, the unit commander can overide any deadline as long as the vehicle can function, in a time of war. My impression of this incident is that their refusal was based largely on the helicopter fuel being contaminated with deisel. The fuel used in military vehicles was switched to JP8 years ago, and would not affect the helicopters in any way. That is why it was switched from diesel to JP8 in the first place, in the off chance that a fuel truck that aviation used somehow ended up carrying ground vehicle fuel or vice versa (M1 tanks have turbine engines that ran on diesel and now JP8). All jet fuel is is jumped up diesel fuel anyway. Cross compatability is vital in the military.<br /><br />I have mixed feelings on this, because I know from experience that the helicopters would have been fine, so I feel like they just didn't want to do their job, were too scared to do their job. Yes, they should have better protection, but hey, its the military. You know you could die when you sign on the line and raise your right hand, and if you can't accept that, the you should not be in. <br /><br />Now, an order can be refused is it is just plain outrageous, like if a superior told you to shoot someone that was clearly not a combatant. This particular situation is not like that. You have to get the beans, bullets, and fuel to the troops, period. All else is secondary.

 

[Fly Rod]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

gauageguy!!<br />Patton is probably standing abreast of one of the greatest Marine generals to ever lead his men into battle!!! This man came up from the enlisted ranks to Lt.General He is the only Marine ever to win the Navy Cross five times!!! <br /><br />This man is no other then Lt.General Lewis Burwell Puller "CHESTY PULLER!!!"

 

[Rick Byers]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

As a VETERAN that served from 1966 to 1989. Having been a Mechanic/Motor Maintenance NCO/Chief Warrant officer in charge of insureing the troops had safe vehicles to haul supplies in I am here to tell you no Maintenance Supervisor worth his/her paycheck would ever let anyone load fuel into a truck that was unsafe. That being Said having been a platoon leader in a semi hostile area I say that everyone of the troops that refused to pull that supply route should be dealt with as harshly as the Code of Military Justice allows for refusing an order during combat along with cowardice in the face of the enemy. <br /> Signed CW3 Richard W Byers <br /> U.S.Army Retired<br />MY opinion and belief as an American and Retired Warrant Officer

 

[Fly Rod]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Well said Mr. Byers!!!!

 

[gaugeguy]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Originally posted by Fly Rod:<br /> This man is no other then Lt.General Lewis Burwell Puller "CHESTY PULLER!!!"

OOH-RAH

 

[mellowyellow]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

"should be dealt with as harshly as the Code of Military Justice allows "<br />amen Chief!

 

[KaGee]

Re: soldiers that refuse to fight

Where is General Patton?<br /><br />Prolly turning over in his grave!<br /><br />He would have run through and over Iraq... no matter what. He most likely would have turned Holy sights into holey ones. Smashed any resistance under his boot. And he would have continued on over into Syria to get back the WMD's that were stashed there by the sons of Saddam.<br /><br />And, he prolly would have personally shot these soldiers for refusing to follow orders.