President Bush and the illegal aliens

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crab bait

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

this really is a total outrage..<br /><br />what the heck..??..!!<br /><br />the government tried all it can but can't seam to keep'em out...try as we may..<br /><br />we haven't a clue how they are gettin' in here.. an where they are,, when they are here to be sent back... nothin' we can do. <br /><br />give me a break..!!<br /><br />face it ..the mexicans won.. USA wimped down... concided ..why..???<br /><br />it's perfect... bush wants a cheap labor force in this country for his rich supporters ,buddies an backers.. <br /> that's already workin' in their bussneses, already..<br /><br /> except can't you do somethin' mr prez.. it don't look good,havin' all these illegals here ..<br /><br />for you an for me..<br /><br /> see,,, it just ain't 'american'..can't you do somethin' about it..?? <br /><br />it's here ,fellas... he's messin' with labor laws. screwin' with overtime... <br />an wants to squash all unions givin' the chance..relaxin' standards an pollution laws..<br /><br />economy's bad ,, and it ain't gettin' better.. <br /><br />an gettin' the latino vote is a good thing ,too boot... two birds with one stone..an if' it boomerangs off a mexicans head an wings a third bird ,,all the better..<br /><br />just like the war on drugs... damnit.. if your gonna declare war.. then damnit,, go to war...but it's always been a joke... <br /><br />why....???? <br /><br /> because there's to much money in it... <br />but that's another story..
 
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Ralph 123

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

H - I'd love to hook up I may not come back to Boston though :D <br /><br />
an gettin' the latino vote is a good thing ,too boot... two birds with one stone..an if' it boomerangs off a mexicans head an wings a third bird ,,all the better..<br /><br />because there's to much money in it... <br />but that's another story..<br />
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I have to admit you are right CB. The President and I part company big time in these areas. The only issue is that the Dems would be even worse and they would not fight the terrorists either. And, they would soak average Americans even more to subsidize the whole thing.<br /><br />We need a better choice in America. We need a true leader to stand up and do the tough things that need to be done. Unfortunately we need a big crisis to bring the whole thing to a head. At times I thought Bush was that man but I was clearly dead wrong!
 
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Homerr

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

Yes, Ralph...<br /><br />I'm thinking the same thing has to happen in Oregon... A big crisis indeed will have to happen before they wake up.<br />The idiots in the state are already asking "how'd this happen?"<br />Well, duh? You tax things so high that the companies and people are leaving. You uncover scandal after scandal, waste after waste... Figure it our dummy!<br /><br />If Bush gets this through... That may be the crisis. Who knows.<br />I've always thought that my state (and country) will have to hit rock bottom before they will wake up and realize what they have done.<br /><br />That private lake in the middle of the Alaska wilderness is looking better by the day...<br />Then again, I hear real-estate in Iraq is cheap?<br /><br />H.
 
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mellowyellow

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

as in most situations, the answer is somewhere<br />in the middle here...
 
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oddjob

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

Wow, Ralph I cant believe what your saying...Bush is now out of your favor over this one issue? So who will you be voting for? :rolleyes:
 
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Ralph 123

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

I have no choice because we agree on the key issue of today - terrorism. I rather see him stand up for the American worker and enforce our laws and the overwhelming will of the people.
 
JasonJ

JasonJ

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

I am still not sure how to feel about the plan. I do know according to his plan, the US employers have to make a documented effort to hire Americans, and if they are unsuccessful in finding Amercans to fill the positions, then they can seek alternate employees. I feel that it is true that a good percentage of the jobs that are at stake are ones Americans done't want to do. I don't want to do those jobs, and my job isn't exactly a cruise through Trump Tower. It just seems that since the 90s and the easy dotcom money that no one wants to do the dirty jobs. You do not see a lot of kids telling their daddys that they want to shovel shyte for a living. We all want the American Dream, but someone needs to do the dirty work. I do dirty work, and I actually make an okay living at it, but you won't see me working at McDonalds anytime soon. I do think we as Americans could maybe take a little responsibility for where we are right now. If we don't want immigrants flooding us, then we need to step up and do the shyte jobs. Otherwise, let 'em at it.
 
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Ralph 123

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

Jason,<br /><br />Let's assume you are correct and there are jobs Americans don't want to do. Now, in order to get people to do those jobs the employers have to make them attractive by raising the wage paid to do the job. Then all of a sudden a lot of people want that job. The issue is today they can exploit the fact that most illegals have no choice. So they do a sh!tty job for sh!t money.<br /><br />Around here (Northeast) most of the fast foods jobs are filled with American kids and retirees and they pay decent wages. Maybe we pay more for our burgers but it is worth it.
 
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boatingfool

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

The reason illegals are taking the jobs "Americans" dont want is because they cant get a real job because they are illegal.<br /><br />Once they are no longer illegal they can apply for the "Real" jobs Americans want.<br />Then we will most definately loose jobs that Americans want because they are willing to work for less.<br /><br />Am I the only one seeing this coming?? :confused:
 
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Homerr

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

You hit it right on the head Boatingfool!<br /><br />H.
 
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SCO

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

Good points Boatingfool, Ralph. It's all about incentive. Look at the maximums...do we under a "fairnes" principle, allow anyone that wants to, immigrate here? Do we have to draw a line somewhere? What will become with this new wave and those to follow. Do you want them to have your job? In a way thats good (competition keeping prices down) except the draw is social services. We are providing incentives for them and all others in the world I suppose to come here. Consider that Europe has a problem, a muslim problem, because that has been a great palace to immigrate to. It's the new way to conquer a nation. Heck, I think we should incorporate Mexico into the USA, then the border wil be in Central America. Maybe that is what is really happening here??? Was a democrat pres doing this, I'd understand the idealistic fairness notion being the motivation, and reject it out of hand as a stupid reason to enact policy. Since this is a republican Pres, Sign me, Perplexed in S. Texas
 
JasonJ

JasonJ

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

I absolutely agree with the wage issue. Its all about the dollar. Why pay us x amount when they can pay someone else much less. I have the feeling that isn't going to change anytime soon so where does that leave us? We don't want to do jobs that suck and pay horrible, and we complain when corporations get people who will work for slave wages. I guess we have to just live with it, unless someone has an idea that will fix it.
 
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Skinnywater

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

Ralph said:<br />
We need a better choice in America. We need a true leader to stand up and do the tough things that need to be done. Unfortunately we need a big crisis to bring the whole thing to a head. At times I thought Bush was that man but I was clearly dead wrong!
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Hmmm. Where have I heard this before. <br /><br />Many bring up the arguement that the illegal takes the job an American doesn't want.<br />If there wasn't the illegals here. There would be Americans in those jobs! The jobs wouldn't go unfilled!<br />The price of lettuce would stay the same too. Since we have to compete with Mexican produce anyhow.<br />Here's another fact for you. The going rate for undocumented ranch and orchard work in this area is $11-12 dollars an hour CASH.....and the cost of living here is average with you guys.<br />I know a whole crew of 14 undocumented workers that can throw up a entire complex of self storage metal buildings faster then union metal workers. These guys are at $24 an hour CASH.....<br />Yep, lets ask him to sign up for documentation so he can get taxes taken out.<br />Well, I know a lot of Mexican Nationals. I like them too. Most are real fun while downing cervesa and goat. They are far from stupid and really like the status quo. They won't sign up and if they get deported they'll be right back.....no changes here, just ask them.<br /><br />So the Government is doing what it does best. Ignore the simple cure, grow another agency, throw massive amounts of money at it and call it fixed........or compassionate conservatism. :p
 
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Ralph 123

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

Awesome post Skinnywater and excellent first hand points.
 
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SCO

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

I can second that Skinnywater. The tradesmen want cash and if you want to pay with a check they want it blank in the "to whom" row, and many dont have bank accounts. They will also want you to write their payment checks to some other service provider like their landlord. That hasn't bothered me because I've thought at least they aren't on the dole, but now, I can see it would be hard to get a handle on this. Once on social services, if we get them signed up, they may continue the cash based income lifestyle. They are expert at flying under the radar.
 
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crab bait

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

this topic had a good run.. in is now in a dead spiral to the bottom.. so i'll keep it alive alittle longer..<br /><br />keep reading here an there on here about how the democrats wouldn't have fought the terroists.. you's really believe that.. GORE wouldn't of done anything.. who/what president wouldn't.. the voters would of demanded it anyway..<br /><br />DEMS, probably wouldn't of invaded IRAQ... no real reason,too .. <br /><br />an also somethin' about DEMS an payin' more for war or taxing more for war, or somethin'.. <br /><br />holey moley.. what..??..!! <br /><br />bush took over with ZERO deffecit.. what's it now..!!<br /><br />a tax cut ,, for who.. an why.. ??
 
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SCO

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

Taking the emotion out of it, and the false idea that there is a fixed amount of money that is taken from the poor if the rich get richer, there is some magic point of taxation that maximizes the revenues to the government and doesn't slowly bleed the tax payers to death. Something like sailing too high into the wind, then falling off to gain speed, pinching up again. Bush fell off and let the sail out some.
 
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Skinnywater

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

:D Crabby, a knife in the back still bleeds weather it's thrown from a Dem or Republicrat.<br /><br />Same target, same blood, just the knife is a rusty one if it's thrown by a Democrat. :p
 
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ebbtide176

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Re: President Bush and the illegal aliens

You know, I learned alot about politics here. Some may ridicule this notion, so what.<br /><br />I still don't know half as much as some here do, on this subject. (or many others :) ), but...<br /><br />I am willing to bet my life on my current prez, and I feel confidant that he will continue to do good things for us. <br /><br />If that is too generalized, then I can only say that I listen to great users here, like skinny, ralph, sco and others. Maybe they're not always giving the benefit of what our prez has available. i hope, and feel, that this man JB has seen work for so long, will listen and learn, and make the best decisions for us. that's basically it folks. <br /><br />When I get to a post that really tends to worry me, I pray. And that's all. we have had great minds second guess our leaders, now, just as always. we can only hope for the best. - i think that is what really works, and it affects our actions, you know :)
 
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