New CC, take 2

[ezmobee]

Re: New CC, take 2

You don't want a 60's motor.

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

You don't want a 60's motor.

Are they not as good EZ? I know very little about engines, I'm learning, but I'm still very green. I have a 67 merc and had another 60's merc a few years ago, but combined I probably have only put 30 hrs on them so not enough to form much of an opinion. I was thinking an 80's or newer would be nice, but I'm not sure if the new oil injected ones might just be more complicated without much benefit. There is a nice 1982 Johnson 140... but I'm not sure about over powering by 15hp

 

[ezmobee]

Re: New CC, take 2

For small motors you can go way back and they're still reliable. 60's big motors are more temperamental and parts support is not nearly as good. Here's a small example, my '81 Evinrude I think is the first year they used the primer as opposed to the choke. Cold starts are WAY WAY faster than my '73 Johnson was. I don't know much about the oil injection systems and their reliability. I would hang that 140 on your boat without even thinking about it. My 18' is rated for 150. Go figure.

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

Thanks EZ! That 140 has new seals on the lower end, ss prop, power tnt.. the works. On a donor glasser and trailer for $1800. I really wanted it but was wavering since this is rated for 125... but I guess I don't have to go full bore with it and I can't imagine its much heavier then an old ToP

 

[ezmobee]

Re: New CC, take 2

Weight will be around the same. Weight is also the same as the 125 motor it's rated for. I realize there is much more to HP ratings than just weight, but the way I look at it is you may as well go with whatever the largest motor in that "class" since you're so close. If it was rated for 90 or something forget it, but 125? Yeah I'd go for the 140. (conversely, my boat is rated for a 150 which is a V6 but the smallest one. I wouldn't go with one of those because why add the extra weight and the complexity of and additional carb or two just for 10 more HP)

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2



Wow, the extra space in this boat compared to the Jet, a second pair of hands, and a chain hoist made this job a breeze compared to the last time! In 4 hours I've gotten the console out as well as the transom!

On engines, the 140 sold but I've got a line on a nice 120hp Johnson I'm going to go look at hopefully early next week, and have found 2 Merc 140's... those might be a bit big.

 

[64osby]

Re: New CC, take 2

Better not tell they guy you bought it from how easy that was.

Nice progress.

Is that big tank going' to work with the Horrocrafts CC?

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

64, I've measured the MC console and I could make it work. It has a forward seat with storage underneath, I would have to cut the wall between that area and where the driver's feet would be and slide the tank in. It would take up about 9" of the foot room, but I think that the console is long enough where that would not matter much. The bigger issue is the height of the tank, primarily the fill cap/vent as it sticks up about 2" above the tank. If I had this faceing aft (under the console by my feet) it would fit fine with no modifications however to fill it I would have to slide it all the way out each time. I'm not sure how I would keep it in place and yet remove it to fill. The second option is to raise the console up by right about 1.5" (I'm thinking 2x6 cut to fit including a protrusion to hold fishing pole ends) all the way around which would allow me to put the fill cap on the forward side thus allowing me to fill it simply by removing the seat cushion.

A second option would be a permenant tank under the splashwell. There are 2 sold by Iboats that would work, a 17 gal and a 19 gal that would require no modifications except to install a fill tube. This maximizes storage space as I do not loose the console area, but puts the weight at the stern which some knowledgeable folks say with dampen hole shot. It would also be more of a pain when I have to mix the oil and gas, as I would not know how much gas is left in the tank.

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: New CC, take 2

Chief, got a pic of the tank? What I've seen on CCs is a fill on the side of the console, so no moving the tank or pulling cushions to fill her up. How big is the tank?

On the pre-mix, just add a whole number of gallons and add the right amount of oil. It's all mixed by the time you get to the ramp. Don't try to guess how much gas to fill and dump oil first. You're gonna miscalculate some time and mess up the ratio. Hopefully on the fat side, but the other way can be fatal.

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2



Here is a picture of the tank. Its a 28 gallon tank made by Tempo. Basically I can either put the fill cap and exit hose facing forward or aft if I put it under the console. I'm sure I wont need 28 gallons for what I'm currently planning, but its better to have more then not enough!

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: New CC, take 2

OK. I was thinking it was a metal or plastic permanent mount. 28 gal. at about 200 lbs full is tough to be sliding around. The console raise idea with the fill under the cushion might be the way to go.

Is it about 30" long? Is the console 30" or more wide?

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

Its about 29" and the console is 32" so there should not be any issues there. I'll get to looking at it more tomorrow, today's goal was the transom.

Speaking of which, its now gluing together! I'm super excited that its gone so smoothly- old one disconnected, removed, new one cut, fitted, trimmed, and glued in one day!! Sa-weeeeeeeeeeeeeet!!

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: New CC, take 2

I forgot to mention - Man you didn't waste any time yankin' that bad boy out. You're gonna have the transom back together tomorrow. All the metal look good, no corrosion?

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

All metal is in great shape except for the keel foot?.. not sure on the proper term. Has 6 bolts that hold it to the transom right about amidships. The aluminum was cracked at the top two bolts so where the bolt touch it (the flange) came off with the top two bolts. I can either use it with 4 bolts or jb weld a new piece of angle aluminum on and drill 6 new holes. The transom was in decent shape, at least compared with the mulch I pulled out of the Jet. It was waterlogged and starting to rot, but only the two upper corner pieces were completely shot. I probably could have gotten another year out of it, but I'm much more comfortable just replacing it. I'm kinda waiting for the other shoe to drop it went so smoothly...

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: New CC, take 2

The knee brace under the transom is cracked? Usually happens when the transom wood is weak and all the forces from the motor are absorbed by the brace. Sometimes the splashwell develops cracks too. JB Weld won't fix the brace. Guys have used some heavy AL angle and the through bolts to take care of that. Put the cracked off pieces in to get the thickness right. Gives a good squeeze and holds the brace. I don't remember who all has done that.

Gonna do the floors or are they in good shape. At least you know what's under them structure-wise, unlike the MC.

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

Knee brace was the word I was looking for. My thought on the JB was to hold the new angle piece in and the cracked pieces in place and then bolt it down like you suggest, using the bolts to hold it together. I looked the splashwell over and did not see any cracks there, I'm wondering if perhaps those two bolts were REALLY cranked down and the over tightness developed into the cracked corners. I dont think it will be to hard to repair.

The floor is quite solid, some PO did a very nice job on it so I'll just use it as it is. It sure is nice KNOWNING it has all the proper structural pieces!

 

[64osby]

Re: New CC, take 2

You might check dozers 18SS thread (think that's the right one). Pretty sure he riveted on new angle to the brace and it worked good.

On the tank, it would be cool to find an extension tube that would fit the threads on the fill hole. Don't know if such a thing exists or if one could be made. Then put a fill cap on the console like GA mentioned. A vent would also be needed.

Great progress, splash should be what, about March 1st.

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

I would love to splash it March first if the ice will cooperate!

I got to trying the console out in the boat today and looking at tank location options. For the 28 gallon one I have, I have 3 options, each with positives and negatives of course! My main goal with this boat is to maximize the available deck space and to allow for easy moving around the boat.

1. Under the console it self after raising the console about 2"This fits, but decreases my foot room by a bit. Comfortable to sit, but I cannot stretch my legs out at all. This also allows for not having the seat forward of the console, thus freeing up almost a foot of deck space. Should be fairly simple to install, running the hose back would be the hardest part I think.

2. Half under the console, half under the forward seat. This would require cutting the bottom front side of the console off, and require the seat to be in place. How useful is the seat? I'm thinking a person there would block the helmsman's view and I do not want to loose that much deck space.

3. Under the splash well, either with this tank or a 17/19 gallon tanks from iboats. This woud take up little to no deck space at all, nor get in the way of moving about. I'm a bit puzzled about the performace issues with the tank here that some folks have mentioned. As far as I can tell, Starcraft installed a 18 gallon tank there for the 21' Mariners and SS's and that was the location everyone puts the 6 gallon metal tanks in the smaller Jets/Novas/16' Mariners. If the weight decreases hole shot signficantly, why is it so commonly done? Also, this is the same spot an I/O's engine would be, and that is far more weight then even the 28 gallon tank- thus I/O's should have terrible hole shot. At roughly 6 pounds/ gallon, we are talking of between 105-170 lbs fully loaded. Thats far less then a person would be should they be sitting back there. If I used the 28 gallon tank, I would build a nice wood box to cover it and allow for a seat or gear to be placed on it. I guess what I'm wondering is how much that weight would affect the performance. Plus, a 115-140 HP on this small of a hull should dang near fly!

 

[64osby]

Re: New CC, take 2

Our front console seat gets used a lot. With 3 or 4 kids they always go to the front, one will always sit on the console seat, pretty sure you won't have young teens for a while. If we go out with another couple 3 adults upfront relaxing and driver at the helm. I've never had a problem with vision over someone sitting there, but I'm also tall.

The other nice thing about the front console seat is storage. That is one thing that is always needed on any boat. The console seat has the large anchor, extra line, flares, spotlight bumpers and a few other things in it.

I have a second battery under the console, plus tools and a bin for stuff. The battery runs the stereo, one fish finder, 12V accessory plus. It's not charged by the motor but with the limited draw it has never been discharged. Also nice to have a spare battery on board.

I would think a box or bench seat housing the tank at the rear would be a great fit. Don't know if you could do a Jason type fold down to create a 1/2 deck type thing. It would possibly allow more storage. I think the "added" weight issue that has been discussed is of little or no concern. If at any point you think the weight is too far back in the boat ask one or two to move forward. If you were putting in a 40 or 50 gallon tank, yea move it mid ships. my .02

 

[1973Chieftain]

Re: New CC, take 2

Heres what I came up with. Its made from 3/4" plywood and 2x6's so its solid enough to sit on. It fits nicely, I'm thinking I'll give this a try and if I find the weight to be an issue I can always put it under the console later. Its not much to look at yet, but I'll cover it with marine carpet and it should blend in nicely.