Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

[Fleetwin]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

The OP did, he just called it "tow rating" instead of "transmission warranty rating". They are exactly the same thing.



True. It is also not used in most states and has nothing to do with automotive liability insurance.
Contributory Negligence | LII / Legal Information Institute

Your legal tow capacity is determined by the registration rules of your state, it has nothing to do with the "tow rating" assigned by the manufacturer. If you are talking about privately owned trailers under 10,000lbs it is generally very simple. The rules vary slightly from state to state but the gist of it is if you want to tow more, you MAY have to pay a higher registration fee. The number assigned by the manufacturer is simply a "transmission warranty rating", which in the OPs case is meaningless.

I disagree. Any Plaintiff Attorney, worth his salt, is going to use MFG stat's to determine if overtaxing the vehicle may have caused an incident. The words "may have" are all that is needed to sway a jury/judge.

I've been down this road in the truck industry.

Many of us have overtaxed a vehicle, at one point or another. That was then, this is now.

This issue is not solved by an insurance company opinion. It is solved in a courtroom-unfortunately. I hope it never comes to that but if it does, you're sunk if you knowingly exceeded your vehicles capabilities. Don't think, for one minute, that a good attorney won't find this discussion.

It doesn't matter what you did to it. All that matters is how it was originally built and what was the rating.

If you can get a third party "body modifier" to sign off on a new GCWR rating, then you are in a much better position.

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

The OP did, he just called it "tow rating" instead of "transmission warranty rating". They are exactly the same thing.

no it isn't..... not even close...... you are just flat out wrong here

True. It is also not used in most states and has nothing to do with automotive liability insurance.
Contributory Negligence | LII / Legal Information Institute

Your legal tow capacity is determined by the registration rules of your state, it has nothing to do with the "tow rating" assigned by the manufacturer. If you are talking about privately owned trailers under 10,000lbs it is generally very simple. The rules vary slightly from state to state but the gist of it is if you want to tow more, you MAY have to pay a higher registration fee. The number assigned by the manufacturer is simply a "transmission warranty rating", which in the OPs case is meaningless.

legal in regard to registration has nothing to do with negligence....... If it makes you feel better strike the word contributory and just call it negligence..... Just because I have legal plates on a vehicle doesn't protect me from liability IF I do something that endangers other people

Why don't you bring us a verifiable statement from any automobile manufacturer stating that the tow capacity is only about the transmission.....

you do that and I'll eat my hat....

 

[Fleetwin]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

no it isn't..... not even close...... you are just flat out wrong here





Why don't you bring us a verifiable statement from any automobile manufacturer stating that the tow capacity is only about the transmission.....

you do that and I'll eat my hat....

Save your hat, that WON'T happen.

 

[lrak]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

I disagree. Any Plaintiff Attorney, worth his salt, is going to use MFG stat's to determine if overtaxing the vehicle may have caused an incident. The words "may have" are all that is needed to sway a jury/judge.

That is why you buy liability insurance. Exceeding the posted speed limit by 3mph may have caused an incident. Adjusting the volume on your radio may have caused an incident. Looking at your GPS may have caused an incident. Talking to your passenger may have caused an incident. Swerving around a deer may have caused an incident.

Your liability insurance is not suddenly invalid because you tow more than the vehicle manufacturer warrantys the vehicle to tow. The insurance company will either pay out or get their lawyers to argue that since the same vehicle with a different drivetrain is rated to tow that amount there was no negligence.

 

[Fleetwin]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

That is why you buy liability insurance. Exceeding the posted speed limit by 3mph may have caused an incident. Adjusting the volume on your radio may have caused an incident. Looking at your GPS may have caused an incident. Talking to your passenger may have caused an incident. Swerving around a deer may have caused an incident.

Your liability insurance is not suddenly invalid because you tow more than the vehicle manufacturer warrantys the vehicle to tow. The insurance company will either pay out or get their lawyers to argue that since the same vehicle with a different drivetrain is rated to tow that amount there was no negligence.

MFG tow ratings are not guesses. They actually TEST to those parameters.

Internet sources may show the only difference as a transmission, e.g.

There may be a bolt here, a nut there that MAY make all the difference. That stuff is guarded and doesn't show up on an internet search.

The poster already knows that he is taxing the vehicle. It wasn't designed to tow that weight.

He THINKS he knows the differences. Does he?

Wrong vehicle. Look elsewhere.

I understand that replacing a vehicle is not easy or cheap. But, overtaxing a vehicle is not a recipe for continued success.

I recently "moved up" in boat fully knowing that I am probably going to have to buy a truck. My current vehicle is just fine but since I trade every year, the next one may not be.

I will NOT tow with a vehicle I know was not designed to handle the load..........

Opinions of capability have no protection or validity.

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

lets try to meet in the middle here.... tow capacity is the product of the gcwr minus the wet vehicle weight.... it isn't a guess or a "transmission warranty" limit but rather is is a GUIDELINE... Yes you CAN exceed it without instant catastrophe but it IS the number stated by the manufacturer....
Everything in this world is a tradeoff.... my jeep wrangler isn't safe to tow 3000 lbs at highway speeds or in the mountains but I can move 10,000 lbs at 10 mph on flat ground very safely all day long..... If I bump a parked car at 10 mph towing that 10,000 lbs at 10 mph on flat ground my ins will cover it and all will be fine..... If I manage to start down Jellico mountain at 60 mph with that same setup, lose control, kill a car load of kids and survive the accident I would stand a fair chance of doing prison time.

Also in that scenario I can't say for certain that my ins agency wouldn't have some way of bailing on me.... I think they would pay but I don't know that they would. ..... No way in heck am I gonna try to read all the fine print that they give me every year.

 

[Outsider]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

Liability insurance may only be voided for reasons listed under 'EXCLUSIONS'. And it doesn't matter if the tow rating and transmission warranty rating (where ever that might be found) are the same number. Jeez, it's semantics with little relevance to the issue ... :facepalm:

 

[jbetzelb]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

I think the key words were slow speed on back roads. I know a person that hooks his F150 to a 14K water wagon and tows it between farms all the time. He is 4K over his tow rating. He doesn't get above 30 MPH. He is much less risk than any of us towing at 65 MPH down a traffic filled interstate. All the hype on here about insurance not covering is bull. I asked my insurance guy a while back because of all the posts on this forum. He said I was covered for any case of stupid 1 time. Then he said remember insurance is tough to get after a big case of stupid.

 

[jumpjets]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

MFG tow ratings are not guesses. They actually TEST to those parameters.

Internet sources may show the only difference as a transmission, e.g.

There may be a bolt here, a nut there that MAY make all the difference. That stuff is guarded and doesn't show up on an internet search.

The poster already knows that he is taxing the vehicle. It wasn't designed to tow that weight.

He THINKS he knows the differences. Does he?

Wrong vehicle. Look elsewhere.

I understand that replacing a vehicle is not easy or cheap. But, overtaxing a vehicle is not a recipe for continued success.

I recently "moved up" in boat fully knowing that I am probably going to have to buy a truck. My current vehicle is just fine but since I trade every year, the next one may not be.

I will NOT tow with a vehicle I know was not designed to handle the load..........

Opinions of capability have no protection or validity.

This post kinda drives the point home for me. I think that I've been lucky so far. I would like to venture out and not stick to the local river ramp close to my house.

I don't know every single change between the stripper v6 exploder and the V8 tow package exploder. I think I'll start looking for another truck before the next season starts.

 

[phillyg]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

..............The V8 explorers with the tow package were rated to tow 7200lbs and had a GCWR of 10400lbs. They had the same brakes that I have stock, and the same transmission that I have stock. They came stock with a 2" receiver, and they came with 3.73 gears. I have 3.55 gears...............

If your statement above is accurate your stopping ability and hitch rating is the same as the V8 version so you should be okay, safety wise. I don't believe the 3.55 gears are a safety-related issue but might explain why you've had to replace the transmission already. If you're willing to over-stress the engine/transmission to continue pulling this boat, that's up to you.

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

This post kinda drives the point home for me. I think that I've been lucky so far. I would like to venture out and not stick to the local river ramp close to my house.

I think you have been CAREFUL so far and it sounds like you intend to continue being careful... I applaud your choice to upgrade before venturing onto faster roads...

KUDOS!

some folks get militant and believe they have a RIGHT to tow anything with anything and others think you need a Freightliner to haul a canoe..... the truth is somewhere in the middle of the two and you sound like you have a firm grip on it..... When it comes to towing safety, just enough isn't quite enough because $h!t DOES indeed happen... having a margin for error saves lives and makes for better less stressful boating trips.

 

[BRICH1260]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

I currently am and have been in the auto insurance business for 28 years. Where you are possibly exposed to financial trouble would be in a catastrophic incident where your trailering negligence caused damages in excess of your policy`s liability limits. In this situtation your personal assets would be exposed to siezure by the damaged party(s). If it could be illustrated that you knowlingly exceeded your vehicles capacity and that it`s excess was a contributing cause to the plaintiff`s damages, then their damage award could/would be greater than if you had been towing within your vehicles listed ability (gross negligence). Your company would pay the policys limit and you personally would have to make up the difference of the judgement. You would minimize your personal asset exposure by towing within your vehicles capacity and increasing your policys liability limit.

 

[jumpjets]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

I pitched the new truck idea to my wife tonight. She was not too pleased. She doesn't really get the max towing capacity concept. A truck is a truck to her. When I tried to explain it to her, her response was quite simple and direct. She said: "well, just don't crash!".

This is gonna take some work.

 

[NYBo]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

If this thread is any indication, it gonna be a LONG winter!

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

I pitched the new truck idea to my wife tonight. She was not too pleased. She doesn't really get the max towing capacity concept. A truck is a truck to her. When I tried to explain it to her, her response was quite simple and direct. She said: "well, just don't crash!".

This is gonna take some work.

instead of "new truck" try "bigger truck" Explain to her that the "bigger truck" doesn't need to cost any more than the exploder sells for...... maybe even less leaving a lil sumthin extra for her

If that doesn't work just do it anyway and blame it on me..... I don't mind LOL

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

If this thread is any indication, it gonna be a LONG winter!

Winter? It's STILL winter???? Well CRAP I'm going back to sleep!


LOL

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

Earlier this week I was making a tow from Concord NC over to New port news VA. Moving a daughter. While cruising along at 60 some idiot with a cell phone stuck in his ear came flying down a on ramp and never even looked, I had to bomb the brakes as he pulled right into the lane. I was able to miss him. I was very glad I had a truck that will tow 10 k pulling a 4 k load, it slowed down instantly with no problems, trailer had serge brakes. but that's the thing it can happen in the blink of a eye and you had better have the right equipment.

 

[chris.j.marshall]

Re: Modifying truck to increase tow performance?

The lim factor of your vehicle is that V-6 Explorers without tow packages came with a class II hitch. Towing package included the 3.73 and and class III increased tow capacity to 5900lbs with the V-6. While it's still a substantial load for your vehicle, it's designed to tow that much with proper equipment.