Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

[chiefalen]

We get so many questions as to the use of marine parts VS auto parts, i thought to shed light on the subject and what makes a marine part marine.

1- J1171 is stamped on all electric parts that are marine. No J1171 it's not marine period.

2- Marine carb. no overflow back to the fuel pump, it ain't marine.

3- Fuel hose it ain't marine your in for a big fine, and towed in at your expense if inspected on the water, the law ain't gonna want to hear no excuses.

4- In case something does happen ( and it can to anyone anytime ) and a insurance rep. looks in the bilge and sees a non marine part or hose in there no payoff. That means your widow, and your kids are out the money.

Your not alone out there on the water, and i for one am to close to a boat thats has non marine parts on it, and something does happen, i won't look to kindly upon the situation believe me.

You can and will be sued for burning another boat up with non marine parts installed on your boat believe me, and you will lose the suit.

In short spend the little extra money for the right part, and be safe, better then sorry, there is no excuse, for being careless.

Good luck and safe boating to all !

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

The Chief is correct about the importance of using Marine-rated parts for electrical and fuel components. Insurance claims aside, marine-rated parts help prevent fires, explosions and the injuries that come with them.

There are a lot of non-marine parts that are common between automobiles and sterndrive motors. Some of these are fan belts, bearings, oil pans and timing covers, valve covers, intake manifolds, spark plugs and internal engine components (valves, rods, cranks, pistons) etc.

 

[JustJason]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

1- J1171 is stamped on all electric parts that are marine. No J1171 it's not marine period.

Not always...

Marine carb. no overflow back to the fuel pump, it ain't marine.

Huh??? What it really is, is the bowl inside of the carb in which the fuel sits is vented in a manner that should fuel come out of the vent (bowl overflow) it goes straight down the venturi of the carb, and into the engines intake.

Now marine mechanical fuel pumps are set up so if the diaphram in the pump ruptures fuel is drawn up through a line that connects to the engines intake (usually at the base of the carb in the rear) and taken in the engine and burned, instead of filling the bilge full of fuel.

 

[Bondo]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

2- Marine carb. no overflow back to the fuel pump, it ain't marine.

Ayuh,...

As noted by Capt. Jason,.....

You've got that Backwards....

 

[chiefalen]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

Ok It don't go down it goes up, ether way it don't go in the bilge.

And what part is not stamped J1171 such as a alternator or starter and it's marine. I never saw one, could be.

Got anything positive to add or just gonna nitpick as always. Young man.

Cris added to it, made it a better thread.

Maybe you guys agree that marine parts should be used exclusively??

We agree on that??

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

Ok It don't go down it goes up, ether way it don't go in the bilge.

And what part is not stamped J1171 such as a alternator or starter and it's marine. I never saw one, could be.

Got anything positive to add or just gonna nitpick as always. Young man.

Cris added to it, made it a better thread.

Maybe you guys agree that marine parts should be used exclusively??

We agree on that??

well they are right. poor info is as bad as no info
dont take it personal. its not nit picking to get the facts straight.

 

[SuzukiChopper]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

I'm curious about the fuel line. What constitutes rubber marine line compared to rubber automotive line? Is it the hose itself or the connections used? I would have to say that my chopper and bagger (motorcycles) see a lot more wear, tear and environment then my boat does.

 

[Bondo]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

I'm curious about the fuel line. What constitutes rubber marine line compared to rubber automotive line?

Ayuh,...

I believe you'll find it has to do with Coast Guard Approval, based on Burn-thru times.....

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

when i have bought marine fue lines, they are a lot thicker walled for a given size compaired to auto. i was told this is was due to the fact marine fuel line hose has to withstand burn tests for a time before they fail.

there is a difference in construction. i couldnt tell you if different material is used

 

[CheapboatKev]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

From USCG

http://www.uscgboating.org/recalls/pdfs/bscscan64d.pdf#auto

 

[SuzukiChopper]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

Thanks for the feedback. I have been using auto stuff for the last 4 years and didn't think it was a big deal. I will only have a small run after my modifications are done to my boat and will switch it out. Not sure if the Canadian Coast Guard has the same regs but I'd sooner be safer then sorry especially now that the tank will be 'hidden' from view.

 

[chiefalen]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

Jax of course my apology to all that read the thread, i should never have posted it.

If one guy that was trying to save some money, and reconsidered putting a auto part on the boat, then it would have been worth the time and effort, on my part.

If my fellow posters would have sent me a pm and advised me that i had a brain fart with that one sentence i would have edited it.

I always have called it a overflow hose, i will watch in the future every term closer that i post.

" MY " motivation was to save lives !

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

Howdy,

While I have always supported the concept of advocating the use of marine parts only on marine applications and always citing the USC (US Code of regulations), I have noticed something that doesn't change my opinion of what is the right thing to do, but appears to be interesting none the less...... (And of course, I DO like to stir the pot)

When you read USCG "REGS" you find that every thing there "regulatory" seems to only "apply" to "Boat Builders" or manufacturers.

In Fact, the USCG's own "disclaimer" says @ http://www.uscgboating.org/safety/boatbuilder/index.htm ,

While we encourage recreational boat owners to use the information for their benefit, compliance with the regulations is the responsibility of the boat manufacturers.​

(Emphasis theirs)

I can see where some individuals might decide to "roll their own" and do modifications to their own boat using whatever parts they like....

Case in point, where an iBoats member set up his own EFI in his closed-engine-compartment boat a year ago or so complete with U-tube videos of its operation. He did an absolute wonderful job getting it to work well and is presumably safe.....(well, so far!!)

We don't know if some USCG Aux member or state boat cop has inspected it yet and whether or not it passed etc......

The USCG actually defines "Boat Manufacturer" and we (private boat owners/repairers/modifiers) DO NOT fit the definition. (Hence the USCG disclaimer above)


Now having said all this, it's clear why any good "Marine Mechanic" worth his salt, at a retail shop wouldn't touch a boat with auto parts inside (unless to remove and replace with marine parts) be cause of LIABILITY.

An insurance company would probably deny a claim in a "New York Minute" if they could prove a shop was in any way responsible for either property damage or loss of life for not following "Accepted USCG or ABYC Standard Practice" in a boat that they worked on and subsequently burned/blew up.

While It's unlikely that you're violating USCG law by putting a wrecking yard starter or alternator on your boat, you will probably be in the same courtroom in the ensuing civil case for negligence for killing the neighbor kid when the boat blows up.


So, don't make it any harder for your bloodsucking lawyer to defend you, use the correct parts when you fix your boat!



Cheers,


Rick

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

And what part is not stamped J1171 such as a alternator or starter and it's marine. I never saw one, could be.

J1171 is the SAE standard for testing for protection from external ignition for marine electrical devices, including any device used in a fuel tank space or engine space.

You can infer that any part stamped with it probably complies with ignition protection standards through J1171 testing.

But, saying all true marine parts have the stamp is making an error. There are lots of non electrical parts that won't have it (the testing standard doesn't apply to them) and there are other standards which are equally valid.. the part might be stamped with "UL1500" for example.

Additionally, these sorts of protection tests only apply to a certain class of small boats... larger vessels have other standards for protection of electrical components, since they usually isolate fuel tanks and vent systems from engines and batteries in separate compartments.

So to be completely correct, you could say that if an electrical part is stamped with "UL1500" or "SAE J1171" you can be pretty comfortable that it's ignition protected, and probably safe for use in your boat. But you should still verify the full part number and ask the manufacturer to be safe.

Non electrical components are another can of worms, but generally speaking using components that aren't ignition protected in your boat could shorten your life and the lives of your family and innocent bystanders.

Erik

 

[DJ]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

I'm curious about the fuel line. What constitutes rubber marine line compared to rubber automotive line? Is it the hose itself or the connections used? I would have to say that my chopper and bagger (motorcycles) see a lot more wear, tear and environment then my boat does.

-Your chopper doesn't have a bilge.

-While I completely agree that one should only use marine, people WILL ALWAYS try to rationalize it away by over reading the regulations. The reg's may say that but I would RE-READ your insurance policy.

The buck stops there.

You can do it right, or spend thousands defending your actions later.

 

[SuzukiChopper]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

-Your chopper doesn't have a bilge.

-While I completely agree that one should only use marine, people WILL ALWAYS try to rationalize it away by over reading the regulations. The reg's may say that but I would RE-READ your insurance policy.

The buck stops there.

You can do it right, or spend thousands defending your actions later.

I only asked because I didn't know there was a difference in the fuel lines and if there was a difference, the reasoning behind it. Now that I know and have been educated to the ways of the USCG (I put more value on their regs then the Canadian Coast Guard by which I'm bound), I will definitely be changing out the fuel line in my boat.

Thanks chief for this thread... can't say I remember fuel line being brought up in this type of convo and I'm glad it was. Learned me something new!

 

[chiefalen]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

Chopper: < Then it was worth it to me that one guy learned something he didn't know.

And i should have been more specific concerning " electric parts " It should have been ( starters, alternators ).

I didn't think people would dissect the post to a minutia degree.

I assumed and i know enough not to.

Erick< Thanks for adding that info, i wanted the thread expanded on, more posters to add more info, so people can gleam all they can and use the knowledge to their advantage.

Maybe we can save one life here.

Nuff said.

 

[dan t.]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

well this may ruffel a few feathers,but,a lot of q-jet carbs in a VP aplication have the fuel pump vent hooked to the spark arrestor. so if a automotive carb with no external vents is used with this type of spark arrestor whats the difference. a delco marine alternator has spark arrestor screens an automotive one doesnt. swapping them over takes about 20 min. same alternator at 1/2 the price. any good mechanic can make automotive parts meet marine saftey standards I know many will not agree but this is my story and im stickin to it

 

[Don S]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

1- J1171 is stamped on all electric parts that are marine. No J1171 it's not marine period.

You will very seldom find it stamped on any electrical item

2- Marine carb. no overflow back to the fuel pump, it ain't marine.

marine mechanical fuel pumps are set up so if the diaphram in the pump ruptures fuel is drawn up through a line that connects to the engines intake (usually at the base of the carb in the rear) and taken in the engine and burned,

well this may ruffel a few feathers,but,a lot of q-jet carbs in a VP aplication have the fuel pump vent hooked to the spark arrestor. so if a automotive carb with no external vents is used with this type of spark arrestor whats the difference

Little truth in any of this carb information.
1. The overflowing fuel bowls (Should the neeedle stick open) DO NOTvent to the fuel pump. the pump does vent to the carb. BUT, not directly to the intake, and it's not DRAWN into the intake. The fuel is pumped by the faulty pump into the carb bowl or a tube (as in the Volvo dan mentioned) that allows the fuel to drop into the throttle bores of the carb.
There are also no external ways the fuel can get out of the carb. If the needle and seat sticks open, the fuel is directed into throttle bores of the carb where it will probably flood out the engine and cause it to idle rough, smoke and use a lot of extra fuel. But it is NOT hooked up to the intake manifold below the carb (vacuum side)


Fuel lines, well, there are several kinds. To be used in an IO or inboard, it should be type A1 fuel line, not B1. (which is also marine but different) and used for outboards.

a delco marine alternator has spark arrestor screens an automotive one doesnt. swapping them over takes about 20 min. same alternator at 1/2 the price.

Bull Hockey. That screen only covers the back of the alternator, what about the front, under the fan. That, is going to take more work.

Another unknowing person suggesting something that is completely wrong, because he doesn't really know all the facts.

any good mechanic can make automotive parts meet marine saftey standards

Very few automotive mechanics know there is any difference, let alone how to convert anything to make it safe. They are the ones that normally use the wrong items.

Some of you guys really need to get your facts right before you post things as FACT for someone else to read.

 

[dan t.]

Re: Marine parts VS Automobile parts !

hey Don ,I am well aware of the inside screen behind the fan, 4bolts to split the alternator, 1 nut to remove the rotor, use the screen as a ,pattern to drill the mounting holes , back together in 20 min .I have done this at least 10 times with both my own and customers alternators