Loss of power, won't plane

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Beakster

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Put my thermostats in. I'm a bit confused by these cork gaskets I have put them between the engine and thermostat as indicated by this diagram (gaskets are number 8) but I've seen other people put the gasket behind the stats (between the stat the and plastic block).

Did I get it right?
 

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Beakster

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Just finishes all my painting so getting out board back together. I need some help with putting things back on as I lost all the photos I took before I took it apart. Doing the best I can with the diagrams in the repair manual but I'm a bit stuck on the hose routing.
It seems each of the 4 bypass covers on the block have 2 hose nipples. I believe 1 of these by pass covers nipples goes to 1 of the 4 nipples on the inlet manifold. I assume to the corresponding cylinder for fuel by pass?

What is the purpose of fuel bypass?

What is the other nipple on each by pass cover for? Does any one have any photos or diagrams?

Thanks
 

racerone

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One of the nipples on each bypass comes from the electric primer valve.----The others come from those check valves.-----But I do not believe you can assume that #1 crankcase goes to the #1 bypass cover.----The factory manual shows the routing.----I do not have it handy at this time !
 

Beakster

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Thanks, will try to find manual.

What is the purpose of fuel bypass?
 

Beakster

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Progress is being made.. I can't find the torque values for the bolts that mount the outboard unit to the tilt and trim. Pointed at in the below pics. Can anyone advise? Didn't see them listed in the powerhead or gearcase section of manual.

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Beakster

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Can someone please share some photos of the engine with the flywheel removed? Not sure how to route the wires or what goes where. It's like doing a jigsaw without the picture. Parts diagram isn't very helpful as it doesn't show what goes where.

I had taken photos of everything on the dismantle stage but that was 2 years ago and the phone with those pics was stolen.
 

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Beakster

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Bingo!. My thoughts too.
Too late now. Advice on this forum was get all four cylinders rebored, wsm rebuild kit, water pump and t-stat kit, so that's what I did. Hindsight is 20 20, would have been cheaper to scrap it but I dont have a time machine so here we are.

I'm trying to make the best of it. This is my first ever boat and I've learnt a lot, including that the boat should be scrapped too. So I'll try to get the engine back running, use the boat for the rest of the season, scrap the boat and keep the engine and one day buy a new boat without engine.

Now I just need some help to figure out where everything goes in the reassembly. Today I'm working on going through any YouTube videos I can find about the V4 and taking screenshots to see where to attach wires.

If anyone else on this forum has a V4 johnson I'd really appreciate some photos. Of the side covers, top with flywheel removed, and hose routing.

Thanks
 

1985 Century Mustang

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Too late now. Advice on this forum was get all four cylinders rebored, wsm rebuild kit, water pump and t-stat kit, so that's what I did. Hindsight is 20 20, would have been cheaper to scrap it but I dont have a time machine so here we are.

I'm trying to make the best of it. This is my first ever boat and I've learnt a lot, including that the boat should be scrapped too. So I'll try to get the engine back running, use the boat for the rest of the season, scrap the boat and keep the engine and one day buy a new boat without engine.

Now I just need some help to figure out where everything goes in the reassembly. Today I'm working on going through any YouTube videos I can find about the V4 and taking screenshots to see where to attach wires.

If anyone else on this forum has a V4 johnson I'd really appreciate some photos. Of the side covers, top with flywheel removed, and hose routing.

Thanks
Good luck with that project.
Yeah I got involved in a free boat a few months back, the boat was sitting in a driveway half covered for 12 years unused. I think I'm finally done, and licking my wounds at around $1400. It's not too bad for a real nice running engine, a decent outdrive and a really nice load rite trailer. A lot of work, but heck I'm retired. I'm gonna try and mount the outdrive today, weather permitting. 🤞😁🤞20230605_145949.jpg20230607_203640.jpg20230608_123550.jpg
 
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Beakster

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Just finishes all my painting so getting out board back together. I need some help with putting things back on as I lost all the photos I took before I took it apart. Doing the best I can with the diagrams in the repair manual but I'm a bit stuck on the hose routing.
It seems each of the 4 bypass covers on the block have 2 hose nipples. I believe 1 of these by pass covers nipples goes to 1 of the 4 nipples on the inlet manifold. I assume to the corresponding cylinder for fuel by pass?

What is the purpose of fuel bypass?

What is the other nipple on each by pass cover for? Does any one have any photos or diagrams?

Thanks
Going to answer my own question here incase someone finds it in future...

The purpose of the bypass is because the 2 stroke oil collects in the crank case and puddles in various places. The recirculation circuit is to suck that oil out of the inlet and into the bypass covers where it will enter the cylinders directly on the inlet stroke and burn it up.

This means these little check valves allow air/fuel/oil out of the inlet, but not in. It appears from the very hard to follow diagram in one of the manuals that it is routed as follows:

Each bypass cover has 2 nipples, one is for the primer solenoid, and one is for recirc (I don't think it matters which nipple you use on the cover). Cylinders and numbered from top to bottom 1 (Starboard), 2 (port), 3 (Starboard), 4 (Port). I'll also number the recirc check valves on the inlet from top to bottom, 1, 2, 3, 4. It appears they connect as follows:

Cyl 1 bypass cover to Check Valve 3
Cyl 2 bypass cover to Check Valve 4
Cyl 3 bypass cover to Check Valve 1
Cyl 4 bypass cover to Check Valve 2.

For the primer solenoid there is one inlet and 2 outlets. Each outlet goes to a T-piece (1 per bank), and from the T-pieces to the bypass cover nipple.

The nipple of one of the check valves was snapped. It seems the plastic ones have been replaced by metal ones now which aren't cheap. I just epoxied by host onto the remainder of the check valve and it seems fine. For any check value you should check correct operation. Stick the nipple in your mouth and suck, you should feel air pass. Blow and the air should not pass. If it's stuck you could soak it overnight in vinegar to try to dissolve any crud and free it up.

Screenshot_20230628_103834_Drive.jpg

I think this diagram is very poor. Its very hard to follow where each recirc hose goes. Also it shows each bypass cover as only having one nipple and the primer hoses going to between the carb barrels. On mine each bypass cover has 2 nipples and it one of these is where the fuel from primer goes.

Other updates on previous questions...

Slight bend in shift rod didn't matter too much, even when it was in and it was pushing against the back, once the throttle lever was connected it held it place and appears to shift just fine.

For wiring things pretty much fit where they fit. The most important thing is when connecting up the coils, each powerpack has an Orange and an Orange/Blue wire. I believe the Orange/Blue wire goes to top (Cyl 1 and 2) coils and the Orange to lower (Cyl 3 and 4) coils. Some wiring diagrams contradict this and some have obvious errors, but this seems to be the consensus.

For videos showing the engine and where things go I used these videos:

One thing I learnt the hard way is the shift lever should be inserted in the inlet before you install the powerhead. There is a bracing on the lower cowling cover which will prevent it being inserted after. I had to remove the inlet manifold after the powerhead was on, so I could insert it (I had thought about cutting the cowling, but removing the inlet is fairly easy provided you have a spare gasket).

Very close to trying to start this engine now. Slowed down by a snapped nipple on fuel pump which I've bodged with epoxy and a metal tube until new one arrives.
 
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Beakster

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Ok, I got the engine started tonight and it ran 😁.

Ran it at idle with the muffs for around at minute while I ran around checking for leaks, then realised the pee tube wasn't peeing.

I've put a new water pump and thermostats in here. Before the piston ring blew it was peeing so I'm guessing I did something wrong with water pump or thermostat... Any ideas where I should start to figure out what's wrong? I took a lot of care with them so I can't think what would be wrong. Also put dish soap on the copper tube to help it engage and was very careful about it.
 

Beakster

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Ok, I got the engine started tonight and it ran 😁.

Ran it at idle with the muffs for around at minute while I ran around checking for leaks, then realised the pee tube wasn't peeing.

I've put a new water pump and thermostats in here. Before the piston ring blew it was peeing so I'm guessing I did something wrong with water pump or thermostat... Any ideas where I should start to figure out what's wrong? I took a lot of care with them so I can't think what would be wrong. Also put dish soap on the copper tube to help it engage and was very careful about it.
I think tomorrow I'll try it in a bin full of water rather than muffs.

Also been retracing my steps, I think when I was trying to figure out the shift rod I may have turned the drive shaft anti clock wise. I remember thinking it felt like it had less friction on it so maybe the impeller key fell out.
 

Beakster

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Could running the powerhead without water for a minute have damaged it?
 

Beakster

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Just dropped the lower unit to check if everything was ok with the water pump. And it seems that it is. Everything was in the correct place and impeller turns with shaft.

I put the lower unit on the muffs to try to understand what's happening. The hole in the silver plate is where I assume the water should come from. With muffs on no water comes out of this hole. When I spray water from the top into the hole it does come out of the entry holes on the side, so why isn't it making its way up?

I used these muffs and hose before with this engine and did have water from tell tale.

I can see traces of dish soap in the impeller housing so I assume even with the engine running it wasn't picking up water. The impeller and housing dont seem damaged though, maybe because of the dish soap.

20230629_113143.jpg

You can see from this photo that muffs are on and water flowing but noting coming out of hole in base of impeller. I tried pushing the muffs against the sides hard but still water isnt coming up.
 
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Beakster

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It was the bastarding muffs. I went and bought a new pair and I get loads of water out of the hole now. The new ones are cheaper but have a strong spring and make a better seal because they are round instead of rectangular. Maybe the old ones had become less flexible too.

I just really hope that running the motor for a minute without water hasn't buggered it up, after spending all that money on new rebuild kit and rebore.

New ones pictured here in the LU and old ones disconnected. If anyone is getting muffs for a Johnson get the round ones.

20230629_135127.jpg
 

tphoyt

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The motor should be fine if it was only a minute. The impeller should be replaced. Even though it was lubed up it could have burned and hardened the tips. You come to far to take that chance.
 
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