I'm sick of propaganda

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Propaganda that is giving out without true facts should be stopped. It is missleading and gets people on a band wagon to get things stopped that they don't like due to bad information.<br /><br />I'm talking about second hand smoke. If so many die from it, how come there is not a coroners report stating it on anyones death certificate?<br /><br />If you can find me one, I'll shut up about the matter. I doubt if you will. A death cert with that on it would mean they were killed. Now this would generate a big investigation on who's smoke actually killed them. So please find me a coroner that has declared somebody dead from second hand smoke.

 

[Reel Poor]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

Bulls#!t makes the world go around.<br /><br />While propaganda tries to stop it.

 

[JB]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

It has become politically correct to rant and exaggerate the hazards of tobacco. . . first hand and second hand. In a recent post in another thread a member claimed to be made nauseous if a person in the car in front of him in a gridlock lit up. <br /><br />I think it is clear that smoking (how much??) increases the smoker's risk of various afflictions, but little more than that. There is evidence suggesting that other factors present in typical smokers have more influence on disease than the smoking does. Also, of course, lots of never-smokers die of the afflictions that tobacco is supposed to "cause".<br /><br />Example: "Smoking will kill you!" Nonsense. My dad smoked a pack of Philip Morris a day for 70 years; died at 84 of the effects of Alsheimers(sp?).<br /><br />IMO, the greatest health risk to smokers is caused by the stress of being bombarded with anti smoking harrassment.<br /><br />Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

 

[CJY]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

SS,<br />You are not denying the facts of smoking and its health risks are you?<br /><br />You are right, they do not list the cause of death as "smoking". They call it suffocation due to emphysema, or lung cancer, or throat cancer or any of the other heath issues caused by smoking or 2nd hand smoke.<br /><br />If smoking is bad for the person sucking that crap from a cigarette, what makes it safe when they exhale it back into the air?<br /><br /> If smoking won't kill you, then it is playing one heck of a trick on my dad right now as he lies in bed with just weeks left to live. They won't list the cause of his death as "smoking", it will only say "lung cancer". It is much more pleasant that way. <br /><br />SS, he also lived his entire life in denial, 63 1/2 years worth. Unfortunately he will not see his 64th and reality is kicking him in the butt right now.<br /><br />One last point, do the manufacturers of cigarettes maintain smoking or second hand smoke is safe? The answer is, they do not.<br /><br />I am going to let this one go now because we could discuss this for hours and hours and get nowhere.<br /><br />Smoke em if you got em,<br /><br />John

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

First off sorry to hear about your Dad John, thats gotta be rough. <br /><br /><br />To back up JB's comments- I'm 31 and started smoking at 15. I have quit off and on several times, each ranging from 2-3 weeks to the last time at almost 2 years. You would think that at 2 years I was over it. You couldn't be further from the truth. I take a blood pressure pill so I monitor it pretty close. After I started back smoking my pressure dropped about 12 points top and bottom. I was so worked up over wanting a smoke it was literally killing me. As a side note I had always smoked 2 packs a day, always. Since starting back this time (almost 2 years ago) I only smoke 5-6 a day. On the rare occasion that I am drinking I'll burn about 10 in that days period.

 

[CJY]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

Kenneth,<br /><br />I would not doubt one bit what you are saying. I would wager that your symptoms are due to your mind and the effects of the additives placed into the cig to make you feel that way. Remember, Phillip Morris, in closed documents(since been found) stated in the 60's putting in those things to cause people to keep coming back. My dad tried many many many times to quit, he was never successful for long. He said he began taking cigs when he was 6 or 7 yrs old from his mom. Just occasionally though. By the time he was 10, he was going to the local gas station to buy them weekly. One year ago he was smoking 2-3 packs per day. I have no doubt about their addictive affects. I also have no doubt that they will soon take his life prematurely.<br /><br />Anybody I know that has died, many of my father's friends, lived pretty good lives for a long period of time with the belief that these things will not affect them. Unfortunately, when the cigarette begins to affect a persons health, their health quickly deteriorates.<br /><br />How many cigs is too many, is the big question. I guess it depends on the person and their tolerance and immunity. I just view them in a way that any smoke getting sucked into my lungs or my families lungs is too much. The cost is not worth the risk in my opinion.<br /><br />I hope you never feel the ill affects,<br /><br />John<br /><br />By the way, I like your screen pic. Did you make it??

 

[Drowned Rat]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

Please keep on smoking. I call it Job Security! If it weren't for all the smoking, drinking, crazy driving, pot smoking, drug taking, twinkie eating, people out there, I'd be out of a job. <br /><br />Thanks, and smoke 'em if ya got 'em!<br /><br />BTW, if you really believe that smoking is not seriously detrimental to your health, you either lead a sheltered life or you're delusional.

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

My wife depends on people to keep smoking too DR.<br /><br /><br />John- Wish I could claim that fame but I stole that bad boy from www.texastrailertrash.com

 

[Perfidiajoe]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

I have often said, "If second hand smoke were a more reliable killer, I'd take up Smoking"!

 

[JasonJ]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

I am largely indifferent to smokers. I don't care about second hand smoke, it can't be any worse than the pesticides I am exposed to, the fuel vapors when I gas up, the petrolium on my hands when I work on anything with an engine, the preservatives and lord knows what else in the food I eat, and the x amount of polution in the air I breath. <br /><br />I look at smokers as people who have made the choice to participate in an activity that could possibly shorten their lives, but they are no worse than someone who eats fast food every day, or someone who chooses to remain relatvely inactive, thus staying out of shape. They aren't any worse than the career drunk who slowly destroys their liver. <br /><br />Which of course brings the question: Why is alcohol still acceptable, even though it kills dramatically more people than smoking, yet smokers catch all the heat? How may people hopped up on cigarettes have mowed down families in their car while Driving Under the Influence of tobacco?<br /><br />My mother quit smoking back in the mid 80s, after having smoked her entire life. It was hard, and it took years, but she did it. It was enough to make me never want to smoke, watching her go through all that. I was a teenager then, and all my friends smoked. All I had to do was go home and see what my mom was going through, none of that for me please.

 

[txswinner]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

Kenneth Brown, Nice avatar except it is propaganda, Bush would never have the balls to do the fighting himself.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

I can't say that denying the youth of america cigarettes is a bad thing but what these zealots are doing is just a sham. If they are so bad make them illegal. But its all about the money. And weaning a politician from tax dollars is far harder than quiting smoking. Instead we pretend to be protecting the population. Just another lever to infringe the rights of citizens. These sanctimonious do-gooders who run around and tell us how we are killing people with second hand smoke never point to a study or the fact that the un funded study found exposure to smoke made children less succeptable to alergies, and asthma. Ever hear about than one. Wonder why. Lets just tell bar owners how they are to run the busness. <br /><br />I think smoking sucks and I am a smoker. But what these commercials are about has nothing to do with smoking and everything to do with politics and power. Puke!!!!!

 

[CJY]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

I agree, it is all about money for both tobacco and alcohol. Alcohol, if you remember was illegal at one time, but they could not stop its sale. The Gov. then decided to get in on the big profit that was available. The problem is that the US cannot stop it if made illegal. So the bottom line is no tax dollors for the US even though the products are still available. <br /><br />If you can't beat em, join em,<br /><br />John

 

[POINTER94]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

John, that is the old two wrongs make a right and that doesn't wash. If made illegal then they could prevent the availability of the product, prevent addiction, have a real legal ground for eliminating smoking in public. Also cigs do not alter ones state of mind. Not everyone who drinks is an alcoholic but almost everyone who smokes is addicted. Giving the government a pass by drawing a parallel between alcohol and smoking is comparing apples and oranges. Social engineering is not part of the governments charge. Enforcing the public good is. Profiteering is not in the constitution.<br /><br />Remember you drink before sex, smoke after. Which would you give up?

 

[crab bait]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

delaware's a smoke free state.. <br /><br />sure is nice to go to a eatery or tavern an not have a smoke bank at head level.. <br /><br />most people who smoke even like this now.. altho,, it was almost a shootin'war the first year of the ban..

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

I will agree with ya crabby. I always sit at the nonsmoking section and get nonsmoking rooms in hotels. I HATE the smell all the time. Kinda playing both sides huh?

 

[CJY]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

I agree pointer to an extent. They could try to prevent all you have pointed out, and they may limit its availability. However, they will not eliminate it. This next question is not rhetorical. I truly do not know the answer; Why was it legalized(alcohol) after they made it illegal. I thought it was because they could not eliminate it, they could only regulate it.<br /><br />If cigs are addictive, they must alter one's mind - correct?<br /><br />What is it called when the Gov. makes money from alcohol sales by way of taxes? Lot of money there.<br /><br />John

 

[achris]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

The woman in question hasn't died yet, but she has terminal lung cancer. She is a non-smoker and worked in a bar in Sydney. When she was diagnosed with the cancer she successfully sued the bar owners for negligence. <br /><br />When she dies, it will be from 'second-hand smoke'. <br /><br />Will you shut-up about it now?

 

[kenimpzoom]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

I knew a guy in his 40s that died of lung cancer, never smoked a day in his life and didnt hang around smokers.<br /><br />Ken

 

[achris]

Re: I'm sick of propaganda

Originally posted by JB:<br /> It has become politically correct to rant and exaggerate the hazards of tobacco. . . first hand and second hand. In a recent post in another thread a member claimed to be made nauseous if a person in the car in front of him in a gridlock lit up. <br />

JB,<br /><br />I find your comments quite distaseful and disrespectful. <br /><br />I HAVE THE RIGHT TO BREATH AIR NOT POLLUTED BY CIGARETTE SMOKE!!!<br /><br />You are a smoker and don't understand the effect of smoking on other people. <br /><br />My father died of smoking realted illness (heart disease) at 60 years old. Those evil things stole about 15+ years of his life from him, my mother, my brother, his grandkids and myself. <br /><br />I agree with others here that alcohol also causes health and other problems, but I think the main issue, for me, <br />is that I can stand next to a person drinking, and I don't get drunk. If I am forced to be in the same room as a smoker I HAVE NO CHOICE, I am smoking, regardless of what you or anybody else says!