I'm not a religious man, but......

[Elmer Fudge]

Are there any religions with the exception of the ones that fall under the banner of christian denominations eg: catholicism,presbyterian,methodist ... and so forth, that believe in the existence and teachings of Jesus Christ?

 

[mikeandronda]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Many do though from A Christians point of veiw there is alot that is twisted and messed up. The muslems, Mormans and jehova witness's all believe in Jesus.....but Im pretty sure he is just a prophet to them.

 

[spratt]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

This is MY OPINION, folks...<br /><br />I know a lot of "Religions" believe that Christ lived, taught, preached, and was crucified as the Bible teaches...but the line drops off here...many do not believe in the resurrection of esus...AND, there are actually "religions" here in the great USA which teach that Jesus was the brother of Lucifer (Satan)...many think of Him as just a good man, nothing more...<br /><br />But to answer the question, no...because the very word / title Christian means Christlike...thus, if they believed in Jesus Christ as the Saviour of the world, they would have to then fall under the "umbrella" of what most people think of as Christian...even though the fact is that a LOT of folks who label themselves, or should I say groups of folks who call themselves, Christian, are far from it in word and deed. Doctrine is what seperates each denomination from one another, and since the Bible really does not teach more than ONE DOCTRINE, the one the Apostles taught and preached throughout the lands, has to be the CORRECT one...that Doctrine has been diluted, changed, and corrupted for centuries now, until it doesn't resemble anything the Apostles were instructed to teach, in many churches today.

 

[NYMINUTE]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Just my OPINION:<br />I have doubts of the existance of any of the teachings I was given as a youngster. I base the opinion on the fact that Church is BIG BUSINESS, priests are molesting kids, and not punished. To further all this doubt is our society today. The harm being done to children by freinds, parents, and strangers is at an epic proportion. If there truly was an almighty God or savior. WHY? has this been allowed to continue? For the sake of my grandchildren I support their beliefs, but privatly, I have serious doubts. They are my doubts and have no intention of passing them on to those that do believe.

 

[spratt]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

NY, at least you're honest about it, and I seriously doubt that you are alone in your doubts. I have been serving God now for over 26 years, and at this point in my walk with Him, I have never been more convinced of the truth of the Bible and His prophecies. The Mid-East is a ticking time bomb, and when it blows, the entire world will be dfferent, more so than you and I can imagine.<br /><br />My wife was converted from Catholicism, and I from the Methodist church. I attend a Non-denominational church, which teaches the birth of the Church, the TRUE church, occurred in the Book of Acts in the Bible. But I digress from the post question, and if I continue, someone will accuse me of trying to force-feed them against their will.<br /><br />NY, I truly hope that the time doesn't come when we have to append all our statements with legalese: "They are my doubts and have no intention of passing them on to those that do believe."

 

[cmyers_uk]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

I like to separate Christianity from the church. Over in the UK we had members of the church caught molesting children and rather than prosecuting them they moved them to different churches , surprise surprise it happened again. I have no respect for the institution of the church. So in answer to your question I study the religion of Chris Myers its the same as C of E without funding the church.

 

[LubeDude]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Interesting discussion, not sure I can interject anything of real value, but I have some things to say anyway.<br /><br />I dont know a lot of history about the Catholic church, I do know that most of the hoopla that is done inside the walls of this demomination are about as biblical as the Masons. However, they do believe in the life of Christ and the person of Jesus about as close as can be. There are some in the Catholic church that are saved and have actually accepted Jesus as there savior, but the majority are there as a show and they just want to belong to something religious.<br /><br />In my humble opinion, the Assemply of God and the Foursquare Churches are about as right on in following the Bible as the Original Apostils would have wanted as any. (Because I beleive in the Babtism of the Holy Spirit), I happen to like the Foursquare better as they are much less formal and dont harp on giving as much as the Assembly does. (Not that it isnt important), I just dont want it to be the thrust of the message two or three times a month.<br /><br />The thrust of difference between many churches is do you beleive in the Filling of the spirit or not. You can still be saved if you dont, but it makes your life a whole lot more powerfull if you do and are filled. As long as the church you attend beleives in Jesus Christ as the savior of all mankind and is the son of God, and died for your sins you are likly in a good place.

 

[Elmer Fudge]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

I guess that what i'm trying to understand is, if all of these religions teaches one to love thy neighbour, treat others as you would like to be treated and to be kind to the differences in the make up of human soceitys, is'nt it unreligion-like for a religion to be intollerant of another?

 

[bayman]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Some religions which are not Christian do have some of the books of the Old Testament. If you believe as I do that Jehovah of the Old Testament is Jesus then some religions do believe in Jesus. That said they may not have a very good understanding of who Jesus is but they still acknowledge him as their supreme being whom they worship.<br /><br />I have talked with some Budhists who think that Jesus was a prophet. I don't know what the official Budhist stand is though. Mormons do acknowledge Jesus as the their God and savior and much more than a prophet. I'm pretty sure that Jehovah's Witnesses also believe Jesus is God. As for Muslim's I don't know for sure but I don't think they acknowledge Jesus though I have heard some regard him as a very good man.<br /><br />There should be one doctrine of course but after all of Jesus' apostles were killed there was much confusion. There continues to be much confusion to this day.<br /><br />NYMinute made a good point about church being big business. In times past it was considered a very evil thing for church to be business. I have to agree with that. There are churches that are non-profit where ministers don't get paid. That seems to be the way that the ancient's did it and I would agree that would be the ideal method to follow. Otherwise church could become a popularity contest and the most entertaining ministers with the best stories (true or not) would make the most money.<br /><br />Well, those are my thoughts anyway, it's nice to hear what others think. I would like to hear what more of you have to say.

 

[bayman]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Elmer Fudge, I like what you have to say about tolerance. The United States was founded upon freedom and that includes freedom of religeon. In many countries people aren't allowed to worship as they please. I think that people should be allowed to worship as they please as long as they don't interfere with the rights of others.<br /><br />In addition to that we should accept others and be kind to them even if they are different. Had we been born into their circumstances we could be just like them. Good thoughts.<br /><br />Jesus did teach that we are all neighbors and that we should show love unto everyone.

 

[spratt]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Originally posted by LubeDude:<br /> Interesting discussion, not sure I can interject anything of real value, but I have some things to say anyway.

I could not disagree more, LubeDude!!! I feel that what ANYONE has to say is interesting and important to a subject. A real debate or conversation takes into consideration the OTHER'S thoughts...and if one were to be PROVEN wrong, there should be a willingness to change.<br /><br /><br />

The thrust of difference between many churches is do you beleive in the Filling of the spirit or not.[/QB]

And once more I must disagree to a point. Jesus said that men would hate Him for his NAME'S sake. The Bible CLEARLY states that all things MUST be done in HIS NAME. Many groups called churches believe in the infilling of the Spirit, in some form or fashion. BUT, how many do you know that BAPTIZE their converts, and pray, in HIS NAME (to clarify, I mean NOT THE TITLES FATHER SON and HOLY GHOST )? That is what actually seperates ALL churches from the true one.<br /><br /><br />

You can still be saved if you dont,[/QB]

Sorry, Lube, but again I have to disagree. The scripture is very adamant that if you have not His Spirit, you are NONE OF HIS...sounds a lot like there isn't much hope for someone without the Spirit, to me at least. The parable of the marriage dinner is what that is all about, incidentally. And that man was cast out into utter darkness, because he did not have the proper wedding GARMENT, or COVERING upon him.<br /><br />

but it makes your life a whole lot more powerfull if you do and are filled. As long as the church you attend beleives in Jesus Christ as the savior of all mankind and is the son of God, and died for your sins you are likly in a good place. [/QB]

Well, I did not intend this to rip into you, LubeDude, I just feel and believe that the true discernment of the Scriptures teach what you said BUT MORE.

 

[kenimpzoom]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Just because you are relgious or a high member of any church does not mean you are perfect.<br /><br />We, as humans, all sin. Some more than others.<br /><br />Catholic priests are sinners, because they are human. The pope is a sinner, because he is human. I am sinner, because I am human.<br /><br />*******************************<br />God gave us freewill, and some choose to sin much more than others and cause harm to good people.<br /><br />God doesnt intervene because he wants us to have free will. As soon as he does something, we no longer have free will. And as you know, freedom and life are the two most precious things on this earth.<br /><br />Isnt it rather arrogant for us humans to question him. Kind of like biting the hand that fed you.<br /><br />Ken

 

[JB]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

M&R.<br /><br />EDIT<br /><br />The correct name of what you call the "Mormans" church is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (LDS). My personal experience with LDS members is that they as a group more consistently practice Christianity as taught by Jesus than any other Christian demonination.<br /><br />EDIT<br /><br />Jehovah's Witnesses are also devout Christians.

 

[spratt]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Originally posted by Elmer Fudge:<br /> I guess that what i'm trying to understand is, if all of these religions teaches one to love thy neighbour, treat others as you would like to be treated and to be kind to the differences in the make up of human soceitys, is'nt it unreligion-like for a religion to be intollerant of another?

This thread is probably going to be locked up before too long, I would argue!<br /><br />Elmer, tolerance is quite the buzzword of this day and age. We are requested to be tolerant of a lot of things, to accept it, just be quiet and let it be, so that those things can just simply be and do whatever they want to do.<br /><br />Jesus was not TOLERANT. He went into the temple and found some of the "religious" people of that day selling lame and crippled sacrifices to the people so they would not have to worry about bringing their own with them. He overthrew their tables, ran them out!!! I suppose He should have just been "tolerant" and let them carry on their crooked business, stealing God's blessings from them (the Law dictated that the sacrifices be PERFECT, no lame, or otherwise defective; those sacrifices were an indication of the PERFECT LAMB which was to be slain for the sins of the world, meaning Jesus himself.<br /><br />I suppose that the call for "World Acceptance and Tolerance" of all "Religious" people is one thing, because the common denominator holds those folks all together anyway. But I believe I have the ear of Jesus when I say that tolerance of false teachers and self-called "Pastors" is unacceptable. Plus, the saying "treat others as you would like to be treated" is not in the Bible. It is actually what is referred to as the "Golden Rule"...I just wanted to set that straight

 

[jtexas]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

spratt, Jesus did not tolerate the merchandising you mentioned, but remember that He did "tolerate" and minister to many groups that the established religions of the day ignored, including but not limited to ladies of ill repute, lepers (wouldn't have been sick if they hadn't commited some grevious offense against God), tax-collectors, etc. If He were here today, there's a good chance He would visit San Francisco (no offense intended to any citizens thereof).<br /><br />Also, let's don't get caught up in terminology & syntax; "spirit-filled" has a particular meaning to some folks, above and beyond the requisite "acceptance" of Christ. And litergy doesn't really define the Church, either (as in "HIS NAME" vs "FATHER SON and HOLY GHOST"), or else we might as well be Linus out in the pumkin patch, waiting for the Great Pumpkin to rise and bring us lots of goodies. "Oh no, I said if he comes, I meant when he comes. One little slip like that might make the Great Pumpkin pass you by...." Belief in the Holy Trinity is one characteristic of "Christian" churches, but it's a tough concept to grasp, for me at least, better to just take it on faith & move on.<br /><br />No offense intended, just my 2¢.

 

[bayman]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Here is my take on Jesus and the temple incident.<br /><br />In this case these people in the temple were trampling on God and on the rights of others. They were clearly breaking the religious law which applied to the temple and as such Jesus had every right to run them out of the temple and overturn their tables. If the people had been in their own homes then Jesus wouldn't have gone in and thrown them out.<br /><br />That's my thoughts on it anyhow, not that I'm any sort of expert on the subject.<br /><br />As for the exact "Golden Rule", true, it is not in the Bible but I think it has been paraphrased from the Bible. This basic premise isin Matthew chapter 7 verse 12: Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

 

[Elmer Fudge]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

In response to spratt, as i previously mentioned,i'm not a religious person,and i would'nt be presumptuous to add anything to the bible,my comments were made only in my trying to seek an understanding of religious behaviour and that's all there is to my questions,there is no other agenda or purpose to my curiousity.

 

[kenimpzoom]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Jesus is tolerant of those that profess that he is their savior. Anyone, even Charles Manson, that truly believes this, will be saved.<br /><br />The high preists Jesus ran out of town, did not do this, so he was not tolerant of them.<br /><br />Lubedude, I do also agree with you about many church goers of all faiths, including catholics (as I am). They are there just for show.<br /><br />To be perfectly honest, I am not the most devout Catholic, but I stick with it in hopes something will change me. Plus it is good for the kids.<br /><br />Ken

 

[Elmer Fudge]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

Posted by JB: Quote "Many non-Christian religions agree that Jesus lived and live by teachings similar to His."<br /><br />What religions are those?

 

[spratt]

Re: I'm not a religious man, but......

jTex, it just wouldn't be fair (nor America, the land of the free and brave) if you could not put your 2 cents in and express what YOU believe!! I do not have a corner on the market of Christianity, and I am always fully capable of being wrong!!! What I state is my beliefs, and I fully believe I am correct as much as anyone else does. I do not become offended when a different viewpoint is offered. I believe that if you do believe something, you had best be as right as you can be, and I believe I am. Perhaps you do, also.<br /><br />You are absolutely right about His tolerance towards certain people!!! However, in the Old Testament, God destroyed two cities competely sin-ridden, adn I don't see any tolerance there. He did tell Abraham that if He had found as few as (I believe) ten righteous in the city, He would spare it. Abraham had done some quick math and was hoping that Lot had held out against sin, and that his daughters had married and were married to men who were righteous, and perhaps there were even some grandchildren there who could put the number above ten at least. Alas, the city was so vile that Lot had not even been able to convert ONE person outside his family and so the city was destroyed for it's gross sin. Remember how vile it was? After the Angel struck all the men outside with blindness, they still "groped" for the door in an attempt to get into the house and defile the Angels with their sinful lust. I believe that there were men adn women in that city who were not homosexual, but they also were not righteous! They were destroyed along with the others. No tolerance there. Now, San Francisco is a pretty vile place. But I believe that there are people there who love God, and might even be called righteous, maybe even before God would call ME righteous. I do the best I can, and I make my very best effort to live as close to the Bible as I possibly can. But I am not about to say that I am saved before the day comes when I actually walk through those big ol' gates into the place He has gone before to prepare for us. Salvation is a free gift to all who will accpet it, but contrary to what some teach, and in this the Bible is clear, we all have the ability to fall short of the Glory of God, and not make it in the end.<br /><br />Whew, I best quit here. Thanks, jTexas, for you input! Please do not be offended at my words, because that is what they are. If I were Christ, and only then, could I tell you that I am not wrong in any point.<br /><br /><br />I am going to tell you WHO the Lord is tolerant of, including sinners...it is the person who displays a heart that is tender enough to allow Him to come in and make the changes needed to become ABLE and CLEAN enough to have the Spirit of God to dwell inside them. Please, correct me if I am wrong...