Honda bf50 spark and carb issues

[Sea Rider]

If the leaking takes place after priming the fuel bulb till firm there's 3 possible issues to check : The bowl's gasket is shot, dried, doesn't seal well, the float's needle it's not sufficiently sharp pointy to seal well against the needle's valve, the needle's valve is severely gunked as has never been cleaned before or a tri combo of those 3 scenarios...

Happy Boating​

 

[ahicks]

What are you calling the "exhaust port"? If it's the vent on the back side of the mid section, there's nothing unusual about no water coming from there when on muffs. It's just an optional place for the exhaust to vent when idling out of gear in the water. It prevents exhaust back pressure, which allows the engine to run smoother at a lower rpm than without it.

You WILL see steam coming from there if the motor is REALLY hot...... -Al

 

[MattFL]

Just to clarify my earlier post and add to what ahicks said; there will always be some water coming out with the exhaust at the center of the prop, more when the thermostat opens. I've never seen liquid water come out of the above-water exhaust on any Honda 50HP. I have seen a little bit of steam but only first thing in the morning (when you can see your own breath) or just a little bit if you really get it hot.

 

[Newbie sailor]

I tried to ratchet the bolt before I used an impact, heated, and use pb blaster before the bolt broke. It was inevitable, I could tell it was gonna break as soon as I put a wrench in it (just that gut feeling of, this b***** is stuck). But I got the bolt out slowly with drilling a center hole and slowly removing pieces.
The float problem has been fixed so far. It only leaked when the motor was running, not during the priming stage. Took 3 really good cleaning sessions and after moving the float around to a different carb, the issue is gone.

The exhaust port I was talking about was in the mid section. Thanks for clearing that up and the info regarding the water flow to that area. I don’t use muffs I use the water hose adapter that connects at the foot.

How I came about the water flow issue was that after I got it running I wanted to check the thermostat and make sure it looked alright. After removing it, and looking down the port, it was dry. Like super dry and no water seemed to have made it to the thermostat. I then ran the motor for a moment with no thermostat or housing, water hooked up, still peeing, to see if water would make it to the thermostat area. Nothing, no steam, dry.

 

[Newbie sailor]

I also want to note that I put my finger over the pisser to try and force water to the thermostat stat area.

 

[Newbie sailor]

My friend who has been helping me, said that water wasn’t really coming out of the prop. New info to me lol

 

[MattFL]

Use the muffs instead of the flush adapter and see if that works better. The muffs, with a good hose, allow the pump to pump as much as it can, and I suspect that might be more than what the flush adapter gives you. Disclaimer; I've been using muffs on my 1999 since I bought it new and have never tried the flush adapter. As long as the muffs deliver enough water that it's pouring out of the vent over the prop then you're good, no need to cover it with tape as the manual suggests.

 

[Sea Rider]

If you're using the lower leg's flushing port with an adapter to flush the motor need to tape what's mentioned, assume are the side lower water intakes or any other one or the flushing will loose top water pressure. Prefer muffs, it's faster to attach and won't screw the threads located at the flushing port due to constant screwing-unscrewing said threaded adapter.

Happy Boating​

 

[Newbie sailor]

Okay so this one is possibly my fault. When I started repairing this motor one of the first things I did was replace the impeller. It was pissing fine after that.

I’ve been using the lower leg flush port adapter since. I read on another forum that it was better then muffs. But I’ll go back to muffs according to you guys.

Since I noticed that water wasn’t getting to the thermostat:
1. I removed the small pisser fitting on the motor and used a 3/8 inch barb to help flush larger contaminants and large tubing to drain on floor (I noticed the smaller pisser kept clogging)
2. Removed the foot and using a spray nozzles I pushed pressured water into the inlet tube Till I saw water come out the pisser.
3. Removed thermostat and housing, plugged pisser with finger, again pushed water up the inlet tube till water came out the thermostat area on the motor block.
4. Pushed water in both ports of the thermostat
5. Pushed water in thru the 3/8 barb and large tubing on the pisser
6. Put it all back together.
7. At this point i was testing at a different location with different hose (not sure if it matters) but ran tests using the wash adapter and now it was NOT PISSING.
8. Took the foot back apart and checked impeller and water pump. Noticed some small pebbles. Cleaned out and reinstalled everything.
9. Again no pissing, So now I used the flush adapter and muffs with water running to both and still no pissing. UNLESS I applied pressure to the muffs it would start pissing.
10. last test I did I used a larger hose and just the adapter fitting and believe at that point I burned up my new impeller.

I ended up just purchasing a whole new water pump. New Water pump housing, impeller housing, gaskets and o-rings, inlet tube seal, all of it.

 

[ahicks]

I believe the flush port is to flush only (motor not running), and from what you say (no water to t-stat area?) even that seems doubtful. Honestly, I've never used that flush port, so no experience with it.

On muffs, you need the capacity for a LOT of water volume from your hose. If you have questionable water pressure, muffs are a bad plan. Why? Look right above the prop. There's a second water intake. With good water pressure on muffs, you can overcome that secondary intake, as long as the engine is idling. Take the rpm's up much higher than that, and you're going to smoke the impeller every time - no if's to it - due to air sucked in through that port. I work on a lot of these 40's & 50's, and that happens frequently, completely mystifying the owners. I even made a block I can install in place of that little intake grate to block it off.

You may be further ahead using a cut down trash can to run the motor in. It'll need to be deep enough to keep a couple inches of water above the cavitation plate at minimum. That'll let enough water in in all the right places for sure....

 

[Sea Rider]

Some issues :

That's a 15 year oldie used in fresh or salt water ? Does the motor counts with a flushing port installed on the powerhead, usually on the exhaust cover ? if so connect the adapter and a water hose there, remove the thermo, install back its cover and flush the motor while OFF. If the motor only counts with the lower leg's flushing adapter, perform same, but will need to fully tape what's mentioned in the Ownwer's Manual or risk losing full water pressure out hose.

Your last bullet, as stated previously, connect a pressure washing machine hose set at min pressure and pray and hope to clean free whatever is clogging the entire water passages. If still with no avail, the whole water passages are way compromised, highly obstructed, which it's typical on any outboard after long years of usage whether in fresh water which has its own contaminants or heavily salted depending on boating location...

Happy Boating​

 

[MattFL]

If you want to remove all doubt as to whether it's your flushing adapter/muffs causing the problem, just put it in a garbage can or other big bin filled with water. You should be getting a strong stream, even at idle.

 

[Newbie sailor]

Alright thanks. When I get it back together I’ll take the advice of just putting the motor in a large trash can and count hose water pressure out of the equation.

Sea Rider: it was used in both fresh and salt water. What do you mean by “count”? I’ll check to see if there is a port on the power head

 

[MattFL]

I think that was a typo and he was asking "did it come with" a flus port on the powerhead. Some motors have a flush port up by the powerhead, sometimes in the middle of a hose that you unscrew to attach the garden hose. These little Honda's have it down on the lower unit.

 

[Newbie sailor]

Ah okay thanks MattFL

 

[Sea Rider]

Sea Rider: it was used in both fresh and salt water. What do you mean by “count”? I’ll check to see if there is a port on the power head ?

Yep should have said if had a built in flushing port on the powerhead, which could have been fantastic to flush direct. Don't want to spoil the party, but testing/flushing in a barrel will render the same results as with muffs or lower leg's water port, what's already clogged will remain so, the best flushing alternative will be the pressure washing machine method.​

These pics will give an overall idea of how much salt a motor can collect in just 4 constant years of use : Can you believe this motor was flushed with fresh water for 10 minutes every time returning to terra firme, as you see salt water kills well dead...

Happy Boating​

 

[ahicks]

Sea Rider, in this case, our OP seems to be struggling getting water to circulate through his motor, which may be due to his inexperience. This opinion made clear by the fact he's smoked a new water pump impellor. The EASIEST way to eliminate any type of issue that may be starving the pump, is to stick the motor into a trash can full of water......

 

[Newbie sailor]

I am inexperienced with boat motors. This it my first one but I am mechanically inclined in most aspects of cars and motorcycles. I did my due diligence of research before even attempting to start this motor. But information is vast and opinions vary on forums about how people usually maintain their boats. I try to follow what seems to be experience boaters advice but you can never really tell how experienced they are over the Internet.

that said I do appreciate the advice that help lead me to fixing my boat problems.

thank you sea rider for the informative photos.

 

[MattFL]

The main difference between outboard boat motors and all the other motors is the raw water cooling system and associated corrosion and calcium build up issues. The rest is like any other motor. Corrosion is like cancer, an ounce of prevention is worth more than a pound of cure. Rinse like crazy after use in salt, keep your anodes in good condition and when you put things back together be liberal with good marine grease on the bolts and anything that might corrode.

 

[Sea Rider]

Hope the OP pictures the overall idea. Is an outboard a car, a sophisticated motorcycle or a snowmobile ? nope, the difference is the latter operates and cools with the green krptonite in a closed water cooling system, an outboard doesn't. Relies on fresh, river or salt water to cool itself which passes constantly in-out the entire crankcase. Although motors are basically the same, outboards develops issues with time and use while other motors cooled with the green stuff doesn’t.

If the OP has already flushed his motor with the flushing adapter without the thermo installed and if the house water hose delivered a good pressurized water flow and there's wasn't water passing through the thermo housing or exiting by the peeing port with a nice continuous flow, the entire water cooling system it's highly obstructed.





These pics corresponds to an outboard motor with same issues which runs with clean water in a lake, check all the debris that has collected through the years of constant On-Off cooling cycles which are way less than yours.

Installing a new water pump, water pipe grommets included, even testing with lower leg sitting deep in a pool will render Nada. The bad news nobody wants to hear is that if you would like to have your motor cooling and peeing same when out of the box will need to remove the crankcase from the pan, remove the cylinder head, the exhaust covers and manually scrape clean all the salt already built on their respective water passages and small orifices as well. I’m the only one here constantly tearing crankcases to perform preventive internal maintenance from time to time and second what I post with pics that speak for themselves. This particular thorny topic is well misunderstood by most boater if not all. This clean up process isn't mentioned nowhere on any Owners or Service Manuals, was left to each boater to find that out by themselves or with the help of others who has been through the same pandemonium, that's what's happening in a real boating world...

Happy Boating​