Another Maine Starchief

[dpotter]

I like the idea of the new 4 stroke. That should be a fantastic motor on that boat. The only reason i have 115 is it was on the back when I drug it home. I've gotten to the age that the speed isn't important. I prefer to cruise an a moderate speed as long as I'm on a plane. The granddaughter is not quite as happy, she likes to go fast. Worries me since she's only 6.

 

[dpotter]

Did you remove the braces and try any riveting? Did you do hull stiffeners? Is there a lot of benefit. Mine doesn't seem to have any leaks so i hate to introduct the possibility even though I plan on a thorough Gluvit job. I just pulled mine under cover yesterday and put a cover over it with a space heater going. It had nearly an inch of ice when I pulled it in. Most of that's gone now, but I'll dry it out a couple more hours.

 

[Watermann]

I do have a 23p black diamond prop and the 4.3L motor and outdrive weighs in at 850 Lbs but I also have a 35 gal belly tank mid ship.

I did add the hull stiffeners to my Chief thinking it was best to make sure that the spray rail doesn't ever crack open on me like can and has happened on some of these older SCs. I would imagine they also help with the flexing of the bottom near the rib ends. I used 5200 on all the rivets I replaced or added below the waterline.

 

[oldhaven]

Did you remove the braces and try any riveting? Did you do hull stiffeners? Is there a lot of benefit. Mine doesn't seem to have any leaks so i hate to introduct the possibility even though I plan on a thorough Gluvit job. I just pulled mine under cover yesterday and put a cover over it with a space heater going. It had nearly an inch of ice when I pulled it in. Most of that's gone now, but I'll dry it out a couple more hours.

I'm afraid I am on the steep part of the learning curve too, so I will be doing all of that as a new experience. Still, I have followed along on so many previous builds that I know pretty much what I have to do. That is the value of this resource. We should have fun in the next few months, though winter will slow things down for me at least.

Ron

 

[dpotter]

I'm afraid I am on the steep part of the learning curve too, so I will be doing all of that as a new experience. Still, I have followed along on so many previous builds that I know pretty much what I have to do. That is the value of this resource. We should have fun in the next few months, though winter will slow things down for me at least.

Ron

Thanks Ron, I did a google search and found some solid rivet training on an aircraft video. What did we do without the internet?

Watermann, I like the idea. I'll give that some thought. I've seen on this site cracks in that area. I think the worst was on grandads thread. He did an amazing job of repairing it.

 

[oldhaven]

I do have a 23p black diamond prop and the 4.3L motor and outdrive weighs in at 850 Lbs but I also have a 35 gal belly tank mid ship.

I did add the hull stiffeners to my Chief thinking it was best to make sure that the spray rail doesn't ever crack open on me like can and has happened on some of these older SCs. I would imagine they also help with the flexing of the bottom near the rib ends. I used 5200 on all the rivets I replaced or added below the waterline.

It will be interesting to compare the final weights of our similar hulls when I am done. I am going light as possible, but it may turn out that this makes the boat less comfortable in a chop or bigger waves as it gets tossed around more. At some point when I was fooling around with the Mercury prop selector I got a 54 MPH figure for your boat and engine combination with some ridiculously high pitch prop.

I may go with the hull stiffener plates after I get over my initial reluctance about putting more below waterline holes in the hull. It also makes for a longer project time, but I hope to never see that below deck part of the boat again, so now is the time to do it. I also plan on extending the side panels up to the gunwales with storage access holes. And I will need to put full length longitudinal riser strips connecting the rib ends to compensate for the stringers being moved outboard for the belly tank. All of these additions should add some rigidity to the hull.

 

[oldhaven]

I took advantage of the 50 degree day to get some outside work done. I picked up the 3/4 Coosa board and cut out the two pieces for the transom. Went through two sabre saw blades doing it due to the fiberglass content, but all in all it cuts nicely, and no itching since I took precautions. I weighed the two pieces and they total 22 pounds. The old transom, which is pretty dry from storage after I removed it, weighs 33.5 pounds. These outboard transoms are not all that big to begin with. Not a great savings in weight, but about what is predicted at ~30% lighter than plywood. I will also be laminating and coating the Coosa with epoxy and paint so will pick up a bit there. The real advantage is that it will never rot or weigh more from water absorption, and it is a permanent fix, at least in my remaining years. It is also dead straight and has no warpage to deal with. The Coosa is about 1/3 again as expensive as the 18mm Okoume Marine Ply at the same supplier, and about 1/3 less in weight. I ended up with quite a few decent sized leftover pieces I will use around the boat. The board is exactly 3/4" so I will have to be careful about lamination and coating so it doesn't get too thick for the cap and brackets. I also scored a low bid win on a new Laser II 13.25 x 21P prop off of Ebay for 1/3 the retail cost at the dealer. I'm not sure why the seller offered it so low but she had no other marine items listed, and I had little bidding competition, so I guess it was just a lucky casual sale for me. We are expecting this warm weather all next week, but there is talk of a Nor'easter next weekend, so it's coming.

Ron

 

[laurentide]

Great info on the coosa. I'm definitely intrigued. The weather has been a pleasant surprise. I went fishing today in a fleece. I'll take it!

 

[oldhaven]

Great info on the coosa. I'm definitely intrigued. The weather has been a pleasant surprise. I went fishing today in a fleece. I'll take it!

It is kind of hard to rationalize the cost, but if you consider that the price difference between Coosa and ply for the transom is about what some boats with big tank of fuel burn in a couple of long days, it makes it easier to justify in the long term.

Ron

 

[oldhaven]

I have a question for those of you who have put new decks into an 18 foot outboard Starchief or Chieftain. When I took out the doubled decking the original deck was made of three pieces. There was a short piece , maybe 18", right behind the cabin bulkhead, then a 4 foot piece, then another piece back to the transom with a bilge and knee cutout. All around 5' 4" side to side. Is there a reason it was done this way? I would like to do two 4 foot pieces and end up with just a small piece back under the big transom behind the sliding doors. If I include a removable portion for the belly tank, suitable supported on the stringersd, I might even be able to make the rear area out of 3 pices and get it all out of two 4 x 8 panels since I will be able to use the 2' 8" waste parts of the first two panels. Anyway any clue as to why Starcraft did things in this odd way?

Ron

 

[Watermann]

The plywood is laid in cross ways for strengthening the hull as one solid piece 4' wide goes from side to side rather than 2 pieces with a seam in the middle which will allow more flexing of the hull.

 

[64osby]

If the flooring provides structure for the hull one large solid piece near the transom would be of more benefit then several small pieces. Just my .02.

H20man beat me to it.

 

[laurentide]

It took me a bit to figure it out when I was doing it, but, like watermann and 64 said, you're creating a series of box structures to add rigidity to the thin metal hull. Stringers to deck, deck to rib ends and side panels, side panels to shelf and gunwale. Likewise on the stern you've got transom brackets to transom, transom to splashwell, splashwell header to each gunwale. Each interconnected piece makes part of a rigid box structure, so you want the wood grain to do its job in each application. Hopefully that makes sense. The wood is very structural in these boats. In our Chieftains the cabin bulkheads provide rigidity for the whole cabin. All the metal is super thin on the boat and we all have seen how rotten or missing wood leads to metal fatigue and cracking, especially on the outboard splashwell.

As long as the plywood is structurally tied to the adjacent sheet, you can arrange it how you want provided that the grain runs port to starboard (you're using two factory 4' pieces and one smaller piece). On mine the smaller piece is over the bilge cutout, but I have it riveted with a connector to the middle 4' piece. But now that I think about it a larger piece would be a little better back there so part of it could connect to the side panel. I used angle to connect the panels and I didn't want to have two visible seams.

I just used 1" angle all around to connect the deck, side panels, and bulkheads:

Sorry for all the words :blah:

 

[oldhaven]

Thanks all for the structure advice, and Andy, your picture and blah (not) are worth 2000 words. The reinforcement the wood contributes makes a lot of sense, since when it is out things are sort of flimsy. I had seen your deck pictures on my most recent of multiple rereads of your whole project log, but the dimensions were not mentioned. I will be doing it just the way you did, though I will have a small square cutout for the tank fill and gauges just inside the sliding doors. Now I know I can get by with two 4 x 8's and some waste from fabrication.elsewhere. Amazing what a reread picks up now that I am in the thick of it and know what I need to look for.

I still do not understand the way Starcraft did mine originally, but again, it probably had to do with production cutting economies,not structural engineering..

Ron

 

[oldhaven]

I see you are adding pictures. The one with he doors helps. I could tie that short deck piece into the transom or the transom brackets. BTW, I am going to use a similar type of seating so I can fold it out of the way. I like to drive a boat while standing with a grab rail nearby in any kind of seas. It is a lot less tiring and safer.

Ron

 

[laurentide]

I put a lot of thought and time into figuring out the fold-down seats, but I've folded them down exactly once right after building them. The driver's helm seat position makes a perfect leaning post with plenty of space to stand. And now I've got a cooler and 4 stroke fuel tank secured under each seat. BUT, I like the setup and would do it again. Maybe someday I'll use that function. If you're building a supported platform type seat base, it doesn't take much more effort to add hinges. And maybe you would use the feature. YMMV!

 

[laurentide]

...and while you've got the whole winter to dream and scheme, maybe track down and talk to a reputable canvas person...there must be tons of them in Maine. The enclosure is the best non-essential addition I've made. I'm still using the boat in December, I may even get out Christmas weekend. I use a radiant propane heater on top of a 20# tank in a milk crate between the bunks. Even with the open back it's comfortable if the temperature is above freezing. Disclaimer: I'm aware of the dangers of propane inside boats...not necessarily a recommendation .

 

[oldhaven]

Good advice and that is in the plan. If you go to the first pictures on page one you will see that the boat has a enclosure of sorts. Not in great shape but it came with what you see and side and back zip on enclosures. The brochures from the 60's have an occasional picture of a camper top that encloses the whole rear of the boat. Mostly on open boats like Holidays, but the idea is a good one. I would rather sleep in the back of the boat on a cot than in the cabin on a hot summer night. As you suspected, there is a marine canvas shop about two miles from here. I like the clear panels you did so may copy that idea. I am afraid that that will have to happen at about the time it did for you, after I get the hull wet again and spend some time with sea trials. If all goes well that will be next fall. I think it is fantastic that you are still out on the big lake at Christmas time. Happy sea smoke!

Ron

 

[laurentide]

Happy new year, Ron! You may have already seen this, but I instantly thought of you when I started watching it. It's a great story and video log.

 

[oldhaven]

Hi Andy,I

I did not see your reply until today,and found out that I guess I need to subscribe to my own topic. Thanks for the link and it brought back good memories. I used to do a loop out of Lincolnville and around Islesboro and Deer Isle as a volunteer island monitor. I would visit several Maine Island Trail islands and check them for any problems and do some cleanup. It was done in a Lund S-18 with a 25 Mariner like the one in one of the opening slides, and was about a 70 mile trip, done in one long day, plus the drive to and from Linclnville from near Brunswick. I did it with paper charts and a hand held compass, no smartphone or vhf, often in 2-4 foot seas, and a few times in fog. I had to be careful on falling tides not to get stranded when I went ashore, and on rising tides to make sure the boat was still there and reachable when I got back from checking campsites. It was great fun. Now I wonder how I did it and will be equipped with GPS if I get out there again.

Speaking of that I got a Lowrance HDS 7 and a Mercmonitor for Christmas, turning my Land Rover sale into Starcraft gear. I will still carry paper charts and a hand held compass.

Happy New Year to all.

Ron