88 Bayliner Trophy 1710 - wet foam and ...?

[Teamster]

My 2 cents for what it's worth,...

I would want an inspection plate above the fittings on the tank,....

Sure, You might never need it,..

But,.....

And it's a good idea to check the connections from time to time to avoid other problems,...

 

[alldodge]

Yeah, I thought about that. Really, the only two reasons I could see myself needing access to the tank are dead fuel sender and leaking tank. I bought a new sender, so hopefully that insures against that. The tank will be glassed over with epoxy as mentioned earlier, which should prevent that.

At the end of the day, taking the cap off is not the end of the world, but I think it's unlikely I'll need to do that.

Just to touch on USCG requirements, and I'm no legal beagle, but there is a regulation which requires full access to all fittings. All fittings shall be accessible and have full visibility for maintenance. This is one of the reasons I'm rebuilding my boat due to water intrusion.

 

[Arawak]

Ah, I did not know that. Those regulations don't actually apply to us, and it's arguable as to how accessible they were originally (I know I could never have replaced any hoses) but I think I shall investigate an access panel for the floor as recommended above.

 

[nurseman]

I have to agree with teamster, an inspection cover would be a good idea, the hassle of putting it in will be nothing compared to the hassle of having to cut your deck open if something should break!

 

[Arawak]

Yesterday I spend a couple hours sanding and prepping the stringers and I laid up the starboard side. Three layers of 12oz biaxial staggered, plus one over the top. Took 8 12oz cups of epoxy and 84' of the 8" bixial tape. Love the tape, makes things like this so much neater. Plus, 12oz wets out easier than 17oz, and conforms to the multiangle curves where the stringers meet the transom nicely.

 

[nurseman]

Nice! I debated getting cloth precut into strips like that, but decided not to. Would have saved a lot of time cutting cloth.

 

[Arawak]

Looks like we are due for a cold spell... -20C coming up. Guess that means a pause for me -- the wood stove will not be able to keep the shop warm enough long enough at those temps

 

[alldodge]

I'm on hold till spring because I'm leery using a wood burner in the same area as the resin. MSDS sheet indicates volatility of 3, the next higher is gas

 

[Arawak]

I'm on hold till spring because I'm leery using a wood burner in the same area as the resin. MSDS sheet indicates volatility of 3, the next higher is gas

Yeah, I'd be a bit nervous too. I'm going to hold off any gelcoating until I can do it outside in the spring. This one of the reasons I prefer to work with epoxy.

 

[Woodonglass]

Uhmmm, hundreds of guys have used propane heaters in their garages while using Polyester resins and Gelcoat with NO ISSUES. It would take extreme concentrations and High volumes of vapors to cause any flammable issues and with the limited quantities the basic DIY'er has on hand @ any given time this is not gunna happen. This discussion has been had many times here on the forum with the PRO's and with MFG reps. I understand what the MSDS sheets say and their safety concerns and what they HAVE to say due to liability issues however as long as you keep the garage door cracked open 6" or so and a fan running to create some ventilation, you'll never have an issue. But...It's your boat, your Garage and your project so do as you see fit. And this is just One Old Dumb Okies opininion based on His research and knowledge gained here on the forum and that research.

 

[alldodge]

Thanks WOG I appreciate your wisdom, even from an Okie Us old hillbillies know less and look to ya'll for advise
Figure I have a 30x48x16 high non-insulated barn and using VE resin the fumes will be high. Even with nothing open I need some heat, but open anything and I'm going to need one heck of a heater to warm it to 60 degrees. I would appreciate anything you can say to help me get it done before the weather warms up

 

[Woodonglass]

Like I said the fumes given off by a 5 gallon pail of Poly in barn of that size would be practically NON EXISTANT. I'm bettings it's already pretty well ventilated since it's NOT insulated so the chances of the fumes being able to accumulate to the extent needed for combustion would just not occur. Again this is my opinion based on MY research and knowledge gained. Glassing in the cold Is a challenge but it's NOT impossible. OOPS did it all the time with no problems. the key is to get the substrate and resin up to temp, lay the glass and then keep the temps up for 2-3 hours and then just maintain temps around 32 degrees or higher for the next 24 hours and you're golden. You just have to keep the area being glassed at these temps NOT the entire space. Tenting the area with a tarp and isolating the heat in that area is pretty simple to do with Heat lamps, Propane heat, Halogen lamps etc... The smaller the tented area the easier it is to heat. If you get creative with tarps and 4-6 halogen lamps you can heat a transom area quite nicely in a couple of hours and install a transom when it's 20 degrees outside. No Open flames to combust anything!!!! It can be Done!!! Where there's a Will There's a Way!!! Momma Said!!!

 

[JASinIL2006]

I restored my boat in an unheated garage over a winter. I used propane heaters to warm the garage. I had the same questions about safety, and after much reading, I came to the conclusion that glassing, on the scale of a DIY restoration, poses little risk of generating sufficient fumes to cause flammability problems. (If you were running a chopper gun for 8 hours at a time, it might be a different story.)

The stuff with which I WAS extremely careful: MEKP (poly resin catalyst) and acetone. Anytime I mixed a batch of resin, I poured the MEKP outside and added it to the resin away from open flame. My biggest concern was using acetone, especially to wash surfaces prior to glassing. I always did that without any heaters, and the garage was opened and completely aired out before firing up the heaters. It slowed the process some, but "better slowed up than blowed up"!

 

[Arawak]

Uhmmm, hundreds of guys have used propane heaters in their garages while using Polyester resins and Gelcoat with NO ISSUES.

See: Formal Fallacy. I think this one was called "affirming the consequent".

But lots of people are welcome to do this, and smoke at a gas pump, and any number of things that usually work fine but sometimes do not. Me, I'll just wait until spring to do my polyester work outside without worrying about fires or VOCs

 

[Woodonglass]

See: Formal Fallacy. I think this one was called "affirming the consequent".

But lots of people are welcome to do this, and smoke at a gas pump, and any number of things that usually work fine but sometimes do not. Me, I'll just wait until spring to do my polyester work outside without worrying about fires or VOCs

That's why I always say..."It's your boat and you're free to do as you see fit!" But...I don't think you fully understand the Cold Weather Glassing process. Can be done with NO open flames.

 

[Arawak]

But...I don't think you fully understand the Cold Weather Glassing process. Can be done with NO open flames.

Wood... my dad's workshop is heated by a wood stove full of open flames... that's what I have to work with, and it sounds like AllDodge is in the same boat. When I worked in the boat repair shop we worked with polyester resin, styrene, acetone, you name it all winter long, but that workplace was set up to do that.

You may not appreciate what cold weather is in Canada. Nobody is cracking any doors open when it's -20C and the wind is howling.

 

[Woodonglass]

"You may not appreciate what cold weather is in Canada."

Oh yeah I do!!! Me and OOPS we're pretty good friends. Had a lot of offline conversations. You Need to read some of OOPS old threads.

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=367380

http://forums.iboats.com/forum/boat.../464921-fiberglass-work-in-cold-weather/page1

http://forums.iboats.com/forum/boat...orkspace-involving-cold-weather-fiberglassing


He owned and Operated a Boat Restoration Shop in Canada. He posted a lot of info on Glassin' in the cold weather. He even did it outside in Sub Zero Temps using a Torpedo Heater!!!! Yeah it can be done! Look I'm not sayin it's Optimum, Easy, or advisable to do cold weather glassing and I wouldn't recommend it on a Daily Basis and I truly don't envy you Cannuk's but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. Heat the shop with the flames to get it up to temp, kill the flame( Wood Stove makes it a bit harder but not impossible), tent the area to be glassed, use the lamps or electric heat. It works!!! Plenty of examples to prove it. Everybody has to make their own decision on what's best for their own specific scenario. I'm not saying DO IT just saying it's possible to do if someone want's to give it a go and trying to provide some of the methods for how to get it done.

 

[nurseman]

If I need to glass in the cold, I do just what Wood suggested. I heat the shop to at least 65 deg (prefer 70) and then shut off the heater. Then you do your layup, air the shop for a bit (I crack a window and use an exhaust fan for a few min, until it doesn't smell TOO bad) Then I turn the heat back on and maintain 60 for a few hours. It works very well. And I live in Minnesota, so I understand the cold as well.

 

[tpenfield]

Things that I have done in the past to work in the colder temps . . .

Pre-heat the work space as mentioned, then if possible set an exhaust fan on one side of the space and the heat source on the other side, near a slightly opened window or vent. The air flow across the room will keep the fumes low and the continued heat will keep the temps up a bit. It is also good to plan your work around the warmest of the cold days.

Another thing I have done with an attached garage (attached to the house) is to pre-heat the area, then set an exhaust fan in a garage window and draw warm air from the house. Same idea as the other method, the air flow keeps the fumes down and the temps up. Also keeps fumes from getting into the house.

These things may cost a few $$ in energy, but worth it if it keeps the project moving.

 

[kcassells]

Another quickie I've been doing, nothing new is heat lamps in the area prior to being worked. Just to take the chill off the hull. Then some torpedo heat. I wish I had a garage. I missed the last 2 winters buut not this time and it's working real good for me.