72 Thunderbird Formula w/twin 165hp Mercs

[WOEISMEIGOTTA470]

X2, I did the same thing to find out mine. Rotated to TDC, mine was like the Michigan Motorz pic. I'm curious to hear how your engines run when you get to that point, cause my timing gears are quite noisy. I wonder if mine are the straight cut gears. Mark did you ever hear back from your machinist about the exhaust seats? Just curious to hear an outside opinion on the topic.

 

[Mark72233]

After the fact but wanted everyone to see a little better what I was talking about and what Arch's and Woe's solution was to solve the issue and how simple it was I just couldn't see it through the trees or engine parts, however that saying goes :facepalm:
The 2 timing gear covers side by side. Note the location of the timing tabs.

And Arch's and Woe's solution to solve the issue.
I have the right pair of timing gear cover and harmonic balancer for this engine. Thanks again

 

[archbuilder]

now I'm wondering what setup I have.....I haven't timed it yet...just kind of eyeballed it when I put the distributor in. Don't ask me how, it fired right up and ran smoothly. Glad you got it sorted out!

 

[Mark72233]

I have thrown this out there before but did not get any responses. Does anyone who has a boat the same as mine 1972 or close Thunderbird Formula 233 still have their capacity plate or sticker. If yes could they attach a picture for me, cover up your HIN though. I have found some companies that can remake the plate they just need a picture of one. Mine has gotten tossed at sometime during the 12 years it set at my fathers house.

 

[Mark72233]

Well, I AM just an Old Dumb Okie, and sometimes my Elevator don't go all the way to the top!!! But...to my way of thinking, and mind you I ain't an I/O expert by no means, but from what I've learned here on the forum and my research over the years, the things that ARE important for these things is Flatness, and Parallelism all around the keyhole. I ain't never installed one but ifn' that were mine, that wouldn't be flat enuf fer me!!!! I'll give you a call to discuss some methods to correct them dipsy doodles.

Wood, I spoke with you a few weeks ago about this issue and I finally got time to jump on this problem. Woods advise was grind out or dish out around the key all the way around about 5-6" out just deep enough to give the tiger hair something to bit into. I put one layer around the key hole and let it harden, took the grinder and knocked it down a little before taking about 80 grit with the orbital sander working it slowly down. I ended up doing another layer of tiger hair on that one and did the same thing getting the key hole almost perfect all the way around with maybe a 1/16 of an inch here and there. Next I put 2 layers of CSM down over the key hole. The first layer I cut out basically a ring that was about 2 inches wide the shape of the keyhole but it went on about 2 inches away from the key hole opening because there was a slight depression between were the layers of tiger hair went down and the outer layer of the transom. The second layer went over the whole area that I had cleared of gel coat. Here is the first problem, I have never used wax in the resin, should I have used it here to make it a little easier to sand back down. Unlike the tiger hair thicken resin the CSM is not sanding very well, clogging up the paper. Second problem I made my first batch of fairing compound trying to fill in the little nick and issues on the rest of the transom. I have both fairing compound and 3m glass bubbles. They both seem to be the same other than the fairing compound is a light brown color. I used the 3m glass bubbles, cabisol and resin but again I did not use wax. I made the mixture about like a running smooth PB and put it on smooth with a putty knife. After it dried I tried sanding it but its gumming up the paper, should I have used wax on this. What are your recipes for fairing compounds using either glass bubbles or fairing compound. Other than a sanding issue the keyhole looks very good, no adhesion issues and nice and flat now I just cant sand it down. My plan was sand the CSM down a little and then put a fairing compound over it to start smoothing it out in prep for paint.

 

[Woodonglass]

PM sent!!!

 

[Mark72233]

It's been a busy week but doesn't seem like I got much done. I finally got the transon outer skin smooth and pretty flat. Decided to paint the boat with the tractor paint from Tractor Supply. I am only doing the transom right now so I can get the gimbals mounted and move closer to getting the engines back in. I bought a quart each of the sandable primer, blue paint and clear coat. After prepping the transom I opened the primer and noticed the bottom was about an inch of a thick sludge. My inner cautious voice was telling me bad can of primer don't use it, my impatient voice was telling me just stir and shake it real well and let's get something done. Impatient voice won out and after stirring and shaking the primer, no more sludge, so it appeared to be so I put a coat on the transom. The next day after a good 13 hours it looked good so I went to lightly sand it with 220grit. The papers would gum up and the primer would also gum up on the transom. A quick PM to Wood about the problem and he quickly diagnosed it as a can of bad primer. My cautious voice gave a little laugh as this truth sank in. So back to the store for a refund because they only had one can left and it was the same way. I went to a big box store and bought a quart of rustoleum primer after I open it and checked for sludge. Then the next question was what about the coat of primer already on the transom well it of course had to go so after about an hour and half a gallon of acetone the transom was again clean and ready for primer. I will get pics and load them soon.

 

[archbuilder]

That sucks Mark. When I used to work at a body shop in highschool, we painted an entire concrete pump truck with an epoxy.....never got hard, they sent the wrong catalyst! think about 30 or 40 gallons! We had to sandblast all the sludge off! That really sucks having to scrub all that off!

 

[Woodonglass]

I'm gunna jump in here since I kinda feel responsible for Marks misfortune in a way. This is the second time that the Tractor Paint Primer has caused an iBoats member a problem here on the forum. Since I do a lot of recommending this Paint I feel I must also follow up on some cautionary comments. This primer seems to have a limited shelf life. The last time a member had an issue I called and spoke with the factory rep and he told me that the paint should always be shaken at the store and checked to ensure that the solids had not separated from the mix. If they had, they would NOT re-mix and the paint should NOT be use. This is what happened in both cases. I caution everyone that uses the Majic Brand of Primer to check the paint AT THE STORE to ensure that the solids have not settled to the bottom of the can. Make them open it up in the store and check it, before you buy it. If you want you can use the Rustoleum Clean Metal Primer and then use the Tractor Paint. They are compatible. The reducer and Hardener sold at Tractor supply are both compatible with Rustoleum Pro Acrylic Paint sold at Lowe's and Home depot as well. I've not had the Shelf life problem with the Rustoleum primer soooo not sure why the Majic paint has this issue.

 

[Mark72233]

Wood, all is good and part of the DIY game. So far the rustoleum primer looks good frankly I am a little gun shy right now on painting. I have put 2 coats of primer and plan on putting a third since the first one was a little thin and when I sanded it with 220 it took it down to the gel coat in several spots. Does the primer normally dry a little bumpy. I have managed to get better about being able to roll the primer without leaving the little roll lines either side of where the roller was. Once the 3 coats dry should I wet sand with the 400 or dry with the 220 good enough or more like. Dry 320 grit. Anyway I have been working more on the engine right now. I almost have one rebuilt. Rebuilt 2 of the carburators and 2 fuel pumps.

 

[Woodonglass]

2-3 coats of primer and then wet sand with 320 grit. Just enuf to knock of any nubs in the paint and give the first color coat a bit of a surface to Bite into. .Make the first color coat a Light one and check for imperfections. If you see anything you don't like you can sand it out re-prime that area and re-shoot color.

 

[Corjen1]

Mark, I too went down the exact path you did Quote/unquote......Swithched to the rustoleum and TSC hardener as WoG spoke of, no issues since.

Here is my disaster (as I thought of it at the time.....) http://forums.iboats.com/forum/boat-...rebuild/page23 (post 338)

Dont worry tho, it works out.....started over and this is how I ended up...



Point is, live, learn and you will get better each time. You are doing great work!!!! Dont worry...

 

[Mark72233]

Ok this may be a stupid question but I can't find the answer. I put on the first coat of color. I guess it went on ok. How long should I wait before the next coat and do I sand between coats

 

[Corjen1]

The MSDS sheet on your particular paint will tell you... what are you using?

 

[Mark72233]

It's the Majic brand. The can has 5-10 hours. Thanks Cor, I knew it was a stupid question I was looking on iboats and there it was right on the can. Paint fumes. That's what is was. I was confused because of the paint fumes

 

[Corjen1]

It's the Majic brand. The can has 5-10 hours. Thanks Cor, I knew it was a stupid question I was looking on iboats and there it was right on the can. Paint fumes. That's what is was. I was confused because of the paint fumes

No worries Brother....I get lost in the weeds all the time!!!!

 

[ahmincha]

That stinks about the primer but look at how much extra experience your getting sanding.

 

[Mark72233]

Thanks ahmincha, some experiences I could live without. Good thing it was only the transom and I guess it was a good lesson learned.

 

[Woodonglass]

Re-Coating the color coats w/hardener is about 4-5 hours not the 5-10. The hardener speeds things up about double. It won't hurt anything to wait longer but you don't have too. Especially if Temps are higher than 75?

 

[Mark72233]

I haven't done much on the boat this week. I did sand down the first coat of paint and the more I think about it I may try my hand at painting the transom with a spray gun instead of rolling it. I have all the needed equipment I think and I bought new spray guns a few months ago I am just nervous about trying something new. I did work on the engine a little bit and finally got it off the stand and on a make shift wood stand where I was able to turn it over and do a compression test on the cylinders. Starting from number one cylinder I got 175, 155, 165, 150, 145 and 155. I like the numbers just not the difference between the highest and the lowest. I adjusted the lash on the valves without the engine running of course but I think they may need a little more adjusting. I had a ton of pictures that I was going to post but this week my iPhone died with the red then blue screen of death. I had my contacts and calendar backed up to the icloud but not my pictures darn that cloud.