1993 Chaparral Gemini 190: Chronicles of a New Boat Owner (Deck Rebuild) [SPLASHED June 2018]

[bpounds1991]

No Title

Starting the stockpile, this’ll be a good bit of time away but our order of Seadek arrives sometime this week. They had 50% off stock prices for Black Friday so we ended up getting enough to cover the boat for 200$.

 

[bpounds1991]

One thing I haven?t thought about yet, will the OB need to be removed in order to redo the deck? Might sound like a dumb question but most if not all of the repairs I?ve seen have all been I/O?s.

 

[bpounds1991]

I?ve also been doing some pricing so I know about what I’m looking out for the overall cost of this build. I stumbled upon this today and wanted to see what everyone’s thoughts were on different brands of polyester resin? https://compositeenvisions.com/gener...mekp-1630.html

If we’re looking at around 10 gallons to do this my blood pressure just dropped after checking that page out lol. Of course I know there will be some hidden costs and buying more tools here and there, but once I get a better grasp on the fiberglass mat I’ll be able to start the rest of my purchases.

Polyester Resin: 200-250$
Marine Grade Plywood: 350-450$
2x’s for deck screw in support: 50$
Screws, screw glue (3M), clamps: 50$
Jigsaw: 40$
Fiberglass Mat: 200$
1/4” Chopped Strand: 40$
RedGard (waterproofing the 2x’s): 50$

 

[Baylinerchuck]

Hello there bpounds, and welcome to iBoats. :welcome:

You definitely came to the right place for advice on this rebuild. To answer your question about motor removal, yes, unfortunately you should remove the O/B engine. You will most likely find that the transom is also wet/ soft/ or completely rotted. You'll want to test drill a few holes into the wood low on the transom from the inside to test the wood. As most will tell you in this forum, if the deck is rotted, so are the stringers and transom.

Be careful when buying resins. You need to ask the seller of this stuff if it's suitable for marine layups. I really don't like hoe they call it general purpose. Secondly does is contain wax? Thirdly, how old is it? Most polyester resins have a shelf life of around 3 months. Based on the fact there is very little description of what this is, and the cost, I would steer clear. Most everyone here buys their resin from US Composites. I bought mine from Fiber glass site because they were within two hours drive from my house. The hazardous shipping charges from UPS on resins are a killer.

Save yourself some money by using exterior grade plywood instead of marine grade. ACX, or BCX plywood at Homedepot or Lowes will save you a small fortune. You will be coating all surfaces of the plywood with fiberglass, called encapsulation. Properly cared for encapsulated BCX plywood will last decades. Forget about using 2x4 lumber. Use plywood for stringers and cross members. Plywood is much stronger than dimensional lumber. I'm not sure what redguard is, use fiberglass and polyester resin for all waterproofing. Do not use any treated lumber in your boat.

Good luck in this endeavor. I'll be tagging along to offer any advice I can, as I'm sure others will.

 

[bpounds1991]

Thank you very much Baylinerchuck !

After I posted that last list I came upon the checklist PDF for the deck repair, and now that you mentioned about the BCX that brings me to another couple of questions. Does the BCX come in 8? sheets? The reason I ask is because I?ve seen people use anywhere from 1/2? to 3/4? plywood to do the stringers, but that being said is the stringer a continuous piece or is it segmented at each bulkhead? I know these are very ?noobish? questions and I apologize, but this is already helping tremendously and I can?t thank all of you enough.

To answer your question Chuck, the RedGard was a wood waterproofing sealant that I had seen friscoboater use on his 2x2s when he screwed and glued them into the stringers (in order to provide a place to screw the deck into without splitting the stringers).

 

[Baylinerchuck]

No Title

Thank you very much Baylinerchuck !

After I posted that last list I came upon the checklist PDF for the deck repair, and now that you mentioned about the BCX that brings me to another couple of questions. Does the BCX come in 8’ sheets? The reason I ask is because I’ve seen people use anywhere from 1/2” to 3/4” plywood to do the stringers, but that being said is the stringer a continuous piece or is it segmented at each bulkhead? I know these are very “noobish” questions and I apologize, but this is already helping tremendously and I can’t thank all of you enough.

To answer your question Chuck, the RedGard was a wood waterproofing sealant that I had seen friscoboater use on his 2x2s when he screwed and glued them into the stringers (in order to provide a place to screw the deck into without splitting the stringers).

Oh, ok, your talking about the wood cleats attached to the stringers, got it. If I remember that red stuff was a rubbery membrane Frisco coated all his cavities with prior to pouring foam. In my opinion this is a bit of overkill and not necessary. Do what you want there, but I believe this stuff was fairly expensive. I?m a fan of water proofing everything below deck with polyester resin and glass. The goal is to ensure water cannot ever get below the deck. Proper detail oriented glassing and care makes this so.

BCX comes in 4x8 sheets. My stringers were longer, so I knotched and sistered two pieces together to get the length I needed. There?s a few ways to do this, but you can see how I did it in my restore. All of my cross members are knotched to receive the stringers. I like how rigid this makes the entire structure. I made sure that my sistering of the stringers occurred at a cross member intersection. This makes an extremely strong joint.

 

[Baylinerchuck]

Also, my Chap used 1/2 plywood pretty much everywhere, doubling the thickness in the area of the fuel tank. I used 1/2? for my stringers, and used 3/4? for the cross members and transom. I added an additional cross member due to moving my fuel tank 20? forward.

 

[bpounds1991]

Yes sorry I was referring to the cleats, sorry I’m getting my terminology down lol . So for those cleats I could use 2x2 untreated, sand and once they’re glued/screwed polyester/glass over them as well? (Just making sure). I’ll be going over to your thread once I get home from work, have lots of reading and planning to do tonight. Looking into building an O/B stand and ways on how to remove that without spending hundreds on just that single component, wife may have me sleeping in the boat if I did that lol.

More irritated than anything that I got burned on this deal, inexperience definitely wasn?t a strong asset to have when I pulled the trigger on it. Good news is the motor is in phenomenal shape, and if I can keep the overall cost around 5,000$ (boat purchase included), I’ll feel a little better about it and so will my wife lol. I knew going into the purchase of an older boat might yield some circumstances like this, but the way I look at it is, so long as I can do it right, I’ll be walking away with a boat I can enjoy for years to come. That’s what keeps me on board with the project (no pun intended) and not just looking to try and sell it, recoup my losses, and try again at a newer boat.

 

[bpounds1991]

Baylinerchuck is another option with the stringers and bulkheads to have the bulkheads be one simultaneous piece while making the stringers segmented for each bulkhead?

 

[bpounds1991]

And, to anyone who has seen the second video on the demo, I?d love some insight on the bow and aft sections!

 

[oldrem]

Oh, ok, your talking about the wood cleats attached to the stringers, got it. If I remember that red stuff was a rubbery membrane Frisco coated all his cavities with prior to pouring foam. In my opinion this is a bit of overkill and not necessary. Do what you want there, but I believe this stuff was fairly expensive. I’m a fan of water proofing everything below deck with polyester resin and glass. The goal is to ensure water cannot ever get below the deck. Proper detail oriented glassing and care makes this so.

BCX comes in 4x8 sheets. My stringers were longer, so I knotched and sistered two pieces together to get the length I needed. There’s a few ways to do this, but you can see how I did it in my restore. All of my cross members are knotched to receive the stringers. I like how rigid this makes the entire structure. I made sure that my sistering of the stringers occurred at a cross member intersection. This makes an extremely strong joint.

It was probably Redguard, used primarily to protect wood in wet areas for tiling like this: http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=33222&highlight=oldrem&page=6

 

[bpounds1991]

Yes oldrem I had seen FriscoBoater use it over the 2x2s after attaching them to the stringers.

 

[JASinIL2006]

I think the red stuff is overkill. Listen to Baylinerchuck. Dude did a fine restoration and should be a good resource for you.

 

[kcassells]

Yea it's overkill. Frisco even decided later on in his other vids not to use it. Also ACX/BCX is a perfect wood to go with like Bayliner said.
If you need to go longer than 8' then do a butt joint. Stagger it if possible but the strength is all there. Do both sides.

 

[bpounds1991]

Yeah I went ahead and abandoned that idea JASinIL2006 and kcassells, figured I might as well ask about it though lol. So our Lowe's has the ACX Plywood for 27$/sheet. I think my blood pressure just dropped about 40 points.

 

[kcassells]

Ahhhh don't sweat it. Budgets with boat repairs never end up being a bean counter ending. Kinda like.... now I want this and then I want that and now I want this....etc..
Nice score on the ACX my home deblow doesn't carry any acx. BCX for me.

 

[bpounds1991]

Haha yes kcassells , I went by our Home Depot today and they do have BCX 1/2" for 28$ a sheet, all warped none straight though. Our local Home Depot has a HORRIBLE selection, they even had CCX and ...well we just won't go there lol. This is what I stumbled upon with Lowe's https://www.lowes.com/pd/AraucoPly-...anded-Plywood-Application-as-4-x-8/1000168303

My wife is onboard with most everything I'm doing and understands my frustrations (as soon as she got over her own lol), and wants me to build this sooner rather than later so we can store the O/B in the garage. https://jiminmontana.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/outboardstanddwg1.jpg?w=585 I won't be having a lift to get the motor out, and had seen where a guy had rigged a floor jack to lift the motor up, slide the mount under it, and use two guys to carefully guide it on. A little risky, but my wife's family has some decent sized and well-abled bodies to help assist. I can lift 500 lbs no problem, but a barbell is certainly different than carrying it

Not too much going on today, I have the morning off tomorrow so I'll be getting out some of the foam and seeing how bad the water intrusion truly was. Spoke with a colleague yesterday, he's under the impression the previous owner took one look at the boat once he found the problem, fixed it up a little, and after deciding it was too much work sold it for a profit. Either way, what's done is done but my only concern is the couple of questions I have starting at 1:00 of the Deck Demo video before continuing.

 

[oldrem]

Any Menards near you?? https://www.menards.com/main/buildi...4-x-8-premium-acx-plywood/p-1444424214851.htm

 

[bpounds1991]

I was just looking at that earlier oldrem, I'm in Georgia so unfortunately not.

 

[JASinIL2006]

I used the Arauco plywood in my restoration. I?ve read that radiata pine isn?t the most rot-resistant species, but I don?t really think there is that much difference. Far more important, I think, is how adequatelythe wood is encapsulated and how well the boat is cared for.

The nice thing about the Arauco is that it has more plies and fewer voids than standard ACX. It?s good stuff, IMO.