1985 Bayliner 2450 Ciera Sunbridge Restoration underway!

[kcassells]

add tpenfield

 

[zool]

All I can tell you is how mine was built from the factory.Every cavity below deck had limber holes eventually leading the the bilge. The sides drained to the keel, and the entire keel area drained to the bilge, from just behind the anchor locker (which drained overboard), to the transom. There was one plug mid ship to seal off the below deck cabin area from water flowing forward from the bilge. It had an access panel to open it in an emergency.

The tank was raised with neoprene on both sides of the keel.

Personally, Id rather have any fuel leak escape the coffin area, then build up in there while not knowing I had a leak.....but thats just me.

 

[oldrem]

Any kind of a fuel leak without a safe was for it to exit and you have one nasty bomb waiting to go off imho

 

[tpenfield]

Make it so that water can flow under the fuel tank bay, but not into the fuel tank bay. It seems like the keel board that was under the tank was for that purpose, as long as it went from bulkhead to bulkhead.

The fuel bay on my boat has tubing that runs underneath the tank that allows water to flow from the cabin area to the bilge, so water does not come in contact with the tank.

 

[Ciera2450]

Guys I really appreciate it! It looks like I will replace the fuel tank deck as it was which will allow the keel drain to flow under it to the bilge. This also allows any fuel that may leak to flow out of the area as well. There are really two views you could take on this... sealed coffin or not. Both have there merits and negative aspects. I thank all of you for the advice!

I will get to grinding the area and replace it as it was. Only better. 1/2” deck with a layer of glass this time on the bottom and a full layer across the entire coffin area and up the stringers a bit. Once that is all in, test fit fuel tank and try to sort how to secure it and support the aft berth floor I cut out to remove the tank.

Been taking 3-4 showers a day! Grind for a while... shower... grind some more... shower...repeat. It will be over soon! Then to the fun part of putting it all back.

 

[tpenfield]

Only the small bow riders and cuddles have a fully sealed fuel tank bay, mostly for space reasons. Larger boats typically have the fuel tank exposed at the top, as yours was.

 

[mickyryan]

mine was built same way top was open to allow for fuel fill and such , i duplicated it when reinstalling, if it lasted 30 years that way i wasn't going to mess with success! my wellcraft wasn't sealed inside a vault either it was exposed to bilge as well .

 

[Ciera2450]

Didn’t feel like grinding tonight after cutting out the fuel tank deck earlier so I spent some time cleaning up tools and organizing the pile of boat parts to go back in. I have most of the engine tins, brackets, etc painted and ready to go. Still have to prep and paint the Volvo transom shield and y-pipe. The trim tab pump needs a once over as well. The little plastic tab retaining the reservoir is broken. I’ve been using a zip tie for years but will fix it while it’s out and give it a cleaning and paint.
The fresh water tank needs cleaned up and sterilized while it’s out too. After it’s all back together, i will attempt to build a swim platform. The old plastic bay liner one I attempted to repair years ago is shot. The plastic is just old and keeps cracking in more and more places. Plan is to extend the new one 6” or so for more room. This is part of the reason I’m doubling the transom core in a much wider area than factory. The new platform lower supports and actual platform will bolt here. Speaking of that... I need to start shopping around for SS brackets/supports. Any suggestions where to look for things like that?

 

[Ciera2450]

One more thing.... went down into the cabin today for something and even though I vacuumed up the dust from my previous mistake with the plastic blocking off the cabin and redid it double layered and sealed with duct tape all around... everything in the cabin has a nice layer of fiberglass dust. :lol:
I have shop vac right on grinder two fans going trying to direct the dust and filters on the fans. Imagine if I didn’t! That stuff just gets everywhere...now I itch thinking about it. Lol

 

[Ciera2450]

I lied.. one more thing. I’m ordering glass supplies VERY soon. Was doing an excel sheet cost comparison of poly vs. epoxy from USC. Disclaimer: not wanting start a debate on he two.
Im wondering how much less resin epoxy would use compare to poly??? I’m not sure how significant the reduction in resin is as Ive never used epoxy.
Wondering if I could get away with 6.6 gallons of epoxy to do my repairs. Transom, engine stringers, and fuel deck. Does that seem remotely feasible? I originally planned to order 10gallons of poly thinking 5 wouldn’t be enough. poly would cost more with haz mat fees if I needed 10gallons of it and I’ve never used epoxy which might be cool. Also the 17oz biax cloth is almost a buck cheaper per yard than 1708, so there’s savings there too.
I know I can’t gel coat if epoxy but it’s an engine bay... I can paint it.

 

[tpenfield]

You really have 3 options when it comes to resin . . .

Poly about $30-35/gallon

VE about $45/gallon

Epoxy about $60/gallon

So, poly is the least expensive, not epoxy.

Epoxy is going to have much longer cure times, Poly will be about 15-20 minutes . . . I have found VE gives you about 45 minutes of working time.

USC is located in West Palm Beach, FL . . . not too far from you, but factor in shipping costs . . . maybe see if there is a local supplier.

6+ gallons of resin seems a bit high . . . I was thinking more around 4-5 gallons, but it depends on how much glass you are planning to use. There are fiberglass/resin calculators available online to check/verify what you will need.

 

[kcassells]

Without any science to it just opions I understand that although more expensive EEEppppoooxxxyyy covers more square feet, also no add'l freight for hazard.
I use EEEpppooxxxyyy all the time. It is my weapon of choice.

 

[mickyryan]

also have to worry about allergic reaction to epoxy and if you use epoxy you miss out on poly smell and errybody loves fresh polyester resin fiberglass

 

[chevymaher]

also have to worry about allergic reaction to epoxy and if you use epoxy you miss out on poly smell and errybody loves fresh polyester resin fiberglass

And don't forget that extra twist in your DNA from using it.

 

[kcassells]

Oh yea forgot.....it doesn't explode like poly if you are using a heater. Ask nine finger Mick!:lol:

 

[zool]

One of the major benefits to using epoxy is its alot more forgiving, with regard to prep.....that means less meticulous grinding, and less delamination issues down the road.

 

[kcassells]

One of the major benefits to using epoxy is its alot more forgiving, with regard to prep.....that means less meticulous grinding, and less delamination issues down the road.

What zool is saying is that even KFC can doit! lol! Thanks Larry:joyous:
Did ya get that leaky roof fixed yet?

 

[zool]

What zool is saying is that even KFC can doit! lol! Thanks Larry:joyous:
Did ya get that leaky roof fixed yet?

If u mean strategically placing empty spackle buckets around, yep!

 

[gm280]

I know I used well over 23 gallons of polyester resin on my little boat. And funny, if you buy it in five gallon containers, you have to pay Haz Mas fees. But if you buy it in one gallon cans, you don't. And all of mine came from US Composites as well.

Ciera2450, if you do go the five gallon bucket way, you need to come by and pick up my bucket pourer. It makes pouring either resin or epoxy a freeze. Let me know. I am finished using it for a while.

 

[Ciera2450]

Thanks guys! Trying to plan everything out for rebuild. There used to be a boat maker in a little country town not far from here that was making smaller boats out of molds they got somehow. I got stuff from them 10 years ago... may try to see if they are still around for local supplies.

I know poly is cheaper vs epoxy. However the 6.6 gallon kit of epoxy is $290, 10 gallons of poly is $250 plus the $58 hazmat... I may just start off with 5 gallons of poly and see if that completes the job. I do like the smell of poly! I was thinking I’d use more but it’ll be a start. The glass over the engine stringers was almost 1/2” thick so that’s gonna be 5-6 layers of 1708 for those. (Or more)
The transom is 49” wide by 44” tall 2-3 layers there with tabbing and PB to bed and fillet.
the fuel tank deck is 36”x60” and will get one layer. Also have to account for soaking all the wood.

I hadnt considered the longer cure cure time of epoxy. I knew it did take longer but didn’t throw that into consideration. That might be a pain if I want to have a day of glassing things. I could in theory do all the glasswork in a day with poly. That won’t likely happen, but it could.

Todays focus is finding all the wood I need. Hopefully at the local lumber yard. The mill is directly across the street. And then grinding the fuel tank area. Hoping to be mostly done grinding today and start templates and cutting wood for all the parts this weekend. Trying to move quick as it will soon be boating weather here!