1979 Glastron Carlson CV-23 restoration

[kcassells]

Hey @docmirror that post from me was for someone else. Sorry about the confusion.

 

[docmirror]

Hey Admiral, ok-fine, no worries.
Today the glass man found termites. They are not in the upper part of the wood but down where he's working. He's going to visquene seal the deck, and bug bomb it today. Hopefully that will kill them all. Needs to stay sealed and bombed for 24 hours. Yeah - more weird stuff. I guess should have expected, once we dug in. Funny that I didn't discover them, maybe I wasn't looking close enough as I hauled 200Lbs of crap out of there.

 

[docmirror]

Bad to worse news. While cutting out the rear crossbrace we've found the front of the engine stringers are compromised. I checked the transom very well before buying it, but there was no way for me to check the engine stringers under the exh stacks. They look great from the outside with the 24Oz roving material but the wood inside is history.

We have a relatively easy solution. I'm going to cut long steel plates about 3" x 16" and we will sandwich the existing formed FG. They he is going to lay several layers of new roving on the steel and I will set the engine mount on the new steel with new bolts. This will transfer most of the weight down to the hull along side the engine stringer. The new FG is supposed to keep it all locked in place.

I'm going down to pull the engine on Wed, and I'll cut the steel then too. Let him have at the stringers without obstruction and glass in the steel plates.

 

[QBhoy]

Following this. Great to see. I’ve got a very rare cvx16 RC UK made model. Seriously quick machine.

 

[Baylinerchuck]

Bad to worse news. While cutting out the rear crossbrace we've found the front of the engine stringers are compromised. I checked the transom very well before buying it, but there was no way for me to check the engine stringers under the exh stacks. They look great from the outside with the 24Oz roving material but the wood inside is history.

We have a relatively easy solution. I'm going to cut long steel plates about 3" x 16" and we will sandwich the existing formed FG. They he is going to lay several layers of new roving on the steel and I will set the engine mount on the new steel with new bolts. This will transfer most of the weight down to the hull along side the engine stringer. The new FG is supposed to keep it all locked in place.

I'm going down to pull the engine on Wed, and I'll cut the steel then too. Let him have at the stringers without obstruction and glass in the steel plates.

I can’t picture this in my head…..so the wood core is rotted and gone and your sandwiching steel plates to the stringer? Then glassing it all together with the rotted core inside? Maybe I misunderstood…….

 

[briangcc]

You realize that by leaving rotting wood in your stringers its only going to rot further right? I don't see how the plate is helping things, only masking an issue. Might be better off fixing what's rotted.

Have you checked the rest of the stringers as you may have rot further back? Might be a good time to give a better once over of that transom too.

 

[todhunter]

Oof, time to bite the bullet and do a full gut of the wood structure instead of trying to apply band-aids.

 

[Wildey]

Oof, time to bite the bullet and do a full gut of the wood structure instead of trying to apply band-aids.

One thing worse than a band-aid .... is a scab.

 

[docmirror]

FG guy will be back late today. He says the FG around the rear stringers is very heavy and will hold the engine if reinforced. It was his recommendation to just add some 24Oz roving layers and then make a steel plate to transfer the weight of the engine to the top rail of the stringer. We will still have vertical plates to use bolts into the side, but the majority of the weight will be borne by the horizontal plate welded in an inverted L shape.

I think it will make sense when I get it welded up and take a pic. I will ask him about cutting off the top of the stringer and replacing the core. See what he thinks of that. I'm off on another project right now. I have a couple rental homes that need some repair so I will get back on boat project on Mon or Tue.

 

[docmirror]

Sweating like a pig(BTW, pigs don't have sweat glands), out there still. Disconnected all the bellhousing stuff, and still couldn't move the engine. I had to take the snorkel clamp off the front of the jet pump drive and pull the whole thing out as one. There was one small bolt down at the lower starter port that was holding things together but I couldn't really see it until it was up in the air. Now I have the bellhousing separated, and the engine is about 3 inches too tall to go over the transom rail in back.

I will remove the starter ring, and the oil pan and I can scrape by and get it out of there. I already have the nose jacked up as much as I can. I might just rebuild the engine while it's out. Been looking at some specs for 470HP stroker 514Cu-In engine I can make from my block. With that HP I could swap to a steeper pitch impeller called a "B" curve. For my hull with not too much weight that would get about 70MPH at full throttle 5400RPM. Plenty fast for me. See in pic 3 how close I am when I ran out of lift on the cherry picker. I have the boom nearly at the end, so I"ll have the scrape it over with some help and a old blanket over the rail.

 

[Baylinerchuck]

Sweating like a pig(BTW, pigs don't have sweat glands), out there still. Disconnected all the bellhousing stuff, and still couldn't move the engine. I had to take the snorkel clamp off the front of the jet pump drive and pull the whole thing out as one. There was one small bolt down at the lower starter port that was holding things together but I couldn't really see it until it was up in the air. Now I have the bellhousing separated, and the engine is about 3 inches too tall to go over the transom rail in back.

I will remove the starter ring, and the oil pan and I can scrape by and get it out of there. I already have the nose jacked up as much as I can. I might just rebuild the engine while it's out. Been looking at some specs for 470HP stroker 514Cu-In engine I can make from my block. With that HP I could swap to a steeper pitch impeller called a "B" curve. For my hull with not too much weight that would get about 70MPH at full throttle 5400RPM. Plenty fast for me. See in pic 3 how close I am when I ran out of lift on the cherry picker. I have the boom nearly at the end, so I"ll have the scrape it over with some help and a old blanket over the rail.

I’ve seen others cut the tops off the stringers, dig out the core then fill the center with SeaCast. Once filled, cap with glass. I showed my buddy this method when his motor fell through one of the rotted mounts on his Rinker. It worked extremely well.

 

[docmirror]

I’ve seen others cut the tops off the stringers, dig out the core then fill the center with SeaCast. Once filled, cap with glass. I showed my buddy this method when his motor fell through one of the rotted mounts on his Rinker. It worked extremely well.

Y'all have convinced me, and more important the FG man! Well done. He's going to chop the top, gut the crud out of there and put in some Walnut or Maple then re-glass over, and he's putting in the holes for the bolts with some kind of bolt cylinder that can be sealed around. I didn't get all the details, but the whole engine support will be redone. All I need are the 1/4 in plate stiffeners and I have 2 of 4 cut already to go in. The pan and oil pump was pulled off today, and I got the engine over the transom. Which brings up the next subject...

 

[docmirror]

ENGINE DILEMMA!
As noted back a way, the engine sat for many years, and I had one valve open, and water got in. I was able to sand out much of the rust, but some remains and that jug was just going to live with the problem until rebuild. Well, rebuild time is now, as I've given up on getting it in the water this summer. Tomorrow is Sept 1, and even if I rush, and do crap work, and leave some projects unfinished I might only get 2-4 runs on the lake this summer before I'm done and then the engine comes BACK out for rebuild.

Option A: Simple rebuild, with 30 over bore, new pistons, rings and main bearings. I'm quite sure the cam bearings are perfect condition. Check line bore, deck the block, put my heads back on and away we go. With a 750 carb and the intake I have, I can squeek out about 360HP with a wide band cam and lifters. With that engine, and the A impeller, top speed would be about 55 or a bit over. I had this boat up to 50 with camp gear and the family on Lake Powell which is at 3700' elevation. At lower elevation it would do near 55 back then, and cleaned up right would do about the same or a bit more. Cost would be nominal, maybe $1500-$2000 incl machine shop labor, and I would assemble and install.

Option B: The Big Kahuna. same bore as above, hyperutectic pistons. Forged stroker crank out to 514CI H beam rods, drill and tap for four bolt main caps, Hyd roller cam with more lift and duration, swap in the 850DP carb, Pertronix ignition with super coil. Match weighed recip, internally balanced crankshaft and get rid of the harmonic bal. This beast will put out about 470-480HP. Cost would be around $6000 incl machining. I would assemble and install. Added costs would be change to a B cut impeller, and add a Place Diverter for both hole shots and roosters in cruise. SS B impeller is $1300 and Diverter is $1400. With the big engine, and the B pump and Diverter top speed around 80-85, if I take off the intake grate will do about 90. Will not really suck more gas, as the B pump will keep the revs lower at the same economy cruise speed.

I'm looking at $9000 to go big. I'm looking at maybe $1800 to $2000 to just do it right and leave it fairly stock. The stroker job is the big money, but it's the only way to get big HP out of the machine. I could swap over to a crate BBC like a 502 with tall heads and do the same, but that crate engine is also around $6000 so no diff in money, and I'd have to change exh and bellhousings too.

I'm leaning to leave it stock, and reliable. Hoping there is some way to get the HP needed for a B pump, but I just don't see any other course. What say the assembled team?

 

[JASinIL2006]

Y'all have convinced me, and more important the FG man! Well done. He's going to chop the top, gut the crud out of there and put in some Walnut or Maple then re-glass over, and he's putting in the holes for the bolts with some kind of bolt cylinder that can be sealed around. I didn't get all the details, but the whole engine support will be redone. All I need are the 1/4 in plate stiffeners and I have 2 of 4 cut already to go in. The pan and oil pump was pulled off today, and I got the engine over the transom. Which brings up the next subject...

I would not use maple; it has poor rot resistance. Black walnut would be much better.

 

[briangcc]

It's really not all that much more work since you're replacing the stringers already forward of the engine bay, Do it all at once - ACX plywood cut to size. One and done.

I wouldn't do it one way in front and another in back - seems like a recipe for problems.

 

[todhunter]

For your cherry picker dilemma - if you haven't already, take the wheels off the trailer and set the axle on 4x4 or 4x6 wood blocks - should gain you a good bit of clearance. In my case, that still wasn't enough, so I hoisted the engine, blocked it up in the bilge, then re-rigged my cherry picker (I could then hook directly to the intake manifold lift plate with no chain) and pulled it the rest of the way out. A little sketchy, but it's worked twice for me.

Engine dilemma - I'd probably stick with the stock-ish rebuild too. While the big kahuna sounds fun, there's likely some "gotchas" in there that will either further delay the build or increase the cost beyond budget.

 

[briangcc]

Ohh where's your sense of adventure?

Loose the sunpad, toss a massive supercharger up through there along with a bunch of exhaust pipes. Let the other boaters know you don't give a darn about their tree hugging by announcing your presence on the lake with loads of V8 goodness

 

[docmirror]

The caps are off the engine stringers, and he's getting ready to do his wood work now. plenty of pieces to make. I told him to only cut wood outside the hangar try to keep the sawdust to a min. He's going to start cutting now, and will be doing forming tomorrow. I don't know what wood he's putting in the engine stringers but it's not going to be plywood. He'll have some hardwood to stuff in there.

On the engine front, my rebuilder doesn't see the return on investment for going to a 514 stroker engine if it only gains me 25-30MPH, plus the very few times I'm going to be running it that hard. Most likely, I will already have the fastest boat on our lake without the big engine. I might go ahead and put the place diverter on for hole shot and roosters! I can take my current impeller out and polish the heck out of it. Get a new wear ring and remove the intake grate. It'll be fine, and no huge checks to write.

 

[88 Capri (2022 SOTY)]

Ohh where's your sense of adventure?

Loose the sunpad, toss a massive supercharger up through there along with a bunch of exhaust pipes. Let the other boaters know you don't give a darn about their tree hugging by announcing your presence on the lake with loads of V8 goodness

Lol

 

[briangcc]

What??? No Suck My Wake fans? Geesh....tough crowd.