1976 22' Starcraft Islander Rebuild

[jasoutside]

Thanks for you vote of confidence man! (You did see that I forgot to turn the water on again right?)

then pay someone to really fix it.

Yah, after struggling through, this is what I'm afraid will happen ya know. Plus, summer is slipping away and I still have a ton of other projects going on. This Islander really needs to be flyen around on the water rather than waiting for me to figure out what to do with the 1000 teenytiny carb parts sitting on my workbench.

 

[GA_Boater]

I ignored the lack of cooling water because I know you have impeller R&R down. :behindsofa: LOL

Those carbs really don't have that many parts.

This is a Mercarb - I don't know which one you have. A Mercarb kit is more than I said earlier - About $50.

 

[Patfromny]

Waste a can of carb cleaner on it first. 2.99 sounds better than any of your other options. You could also just adjust the carb? Not too hard a job. Turn the idle mix screw in until it almost stalls then turn it out a quarter turn at a time until it runs the best, then a quarter or half out after that and you are good.

 

[lennymu]

rebuilding a carb is real simple. take tons of pictures as you disassemble, get some carb dip and a few cans of carb cleaner. follow directions (if included) for the float and choke settings, set the idle fuel mix by seating the mixture screws lightly and backing out 1-1/2 turns. should put you in the ball park to get it running.

I think i'm 5 hours away from you, i'd hate to see you spend a ton of money on a simple rebuild.

 

[Patfromny]

It might be worth the cost of having it diagnosed too. Buying a carb might be a complete waste of money. I would hate to see you buy a carb and find out it was a bad intake gasket or carb base gasket. Maybe check the carb to manifold bolts to make sure they are tight. Did you do the spark plug check thing?

 

[Zyen]

hey jason.
it really sounds like it's leaning out after a bit of running. initial starting seems to rev up right proper, but after that it uses the fuel in the bowl. the accel pump for the 'kicker' (when you open throttle and it squirts) seems to be fine. i dont think the choke is the problem, as it's open and staying open when running. i agree with pat, you have something clogged from sitting up, but i dont think it's the venturi, as he suggests, simply because you can see fuel coming from them before it leans out in one of those videos. its hard to see with the choke plate moving in and out of the way, but it can be seen. the next thing to check is fuel supply. as it seems to be leaning out, you'll need to check the fuel filter at the carb (and any others you may have inline) and also check the fuel pump, just to be sure.

just to compare, i went back and watched (again) your video of running the engine while on the trailer. it ran great, and you revved it up a couple times, once >2k5 rpm, which tells me *SOMETHING* has changed between then and now. albeit that was almost 3 years ago, which would indicate a clogged *something*.


you show it running to it's "bad point", but nothing after that. if you run it to where it cuts out, then let it idle a bit, will it rev up correctly again? im asking like this as i think it's running the fuel supply out of the bowl, and it's not getting replenished fast enough (by clogged filter or weak pump or whatever), but at an idle, the bowl will begin to fill up again because it's getting more fuel than an idle requires, but not enough for higher revs.

 

[old islander]

Jas,
There are only 3 things that can be causing the symptoms you are having.
1 Your fuel pump diaphragm is weak (old hard rubber) or has a small tear in it.
2 The fuel filter is partially clogged/restricted. You have 2 in the system. 1 at the carb inlet fitting and 1 at the pickup tube in the tank. If you are running a spin on fuel/water canister filter then you have 3 in the system. That in itself could be to much for a weak fuel pump to overcome. Check all three closely. One other thing to think about, do you have any old black rubber lines in the system? They degrade from the inside out (especially if you have ethanol in your fuel) and will leave little bits or rubber in your filters.
3 You have particles of dirt, rubber or what ever in your carb bowl. When you give her the berries, dirt is sucked into and partially clogs the jets. When you let off suction is lessened and the crud floats back down into the bowl, only to be sucked back up again the next time you hit it.

That 2brl. carb of yours is very simple to rebuild with a kit. I live in Wisconsin. If you mail or UPS the carb and kit to me I will rebuild it and get it back in the mail to you the next day, no charge. It would be my pleasure to help out with your project. PM me if you are interested, but check those filters first.

Jeff

 

[Patfromny]

Give her the berries? Now that is funny. I have never heard that one before but you can be sure I'll use it. Thanks for that old islander.

Ke5jro. I couldn't tell if fuel was flowing from them. The whole video remained pixelated a bit and my tablets smaller screen didn't help either. Thanks for ruling that out for Jas.

 

[zeke67]

Hi Jas,

I don't post much on this site but have been following your build for 400+ pages and also your other builds. I do quite a bit of posts over on Team Chevelle under the same handle, and help a lot with ignition and carb problems

Regarding your carb videos, it's hard to tell whats's going on. Can you clarify when you bring open the throttle are you getting two strong streams of fuel, equal in each barrel? I CAN tell from the videos that you are getting some fuel, but I can't see the streams clearly although they may be there. The reason I'm asking this is that it's the accelerator pump circuit and this is needed to transition your engine to WOT. These need to be good strong streams and not little dribbles.

Please answer whether you've put fuel filters in. The reason you are getting these comments is that if your filters are partially plugged, they may allow enough fuel for low RPM operation but not enough above 2000 and you simply run out of fuel. There is sintered or possible small paper filter right at the carb inlet. As someone mentioned already, it's the big nut.

The carb choke blade (the top one) should not be moving closed when you throttle up the engine. All carb tuning needs to be done with the engine FULLY warm and that choke blade needs to stay fully open. On a partially warm engine that choke should actually open open when you rev it. The reason this choke blade is important is at it closely slightly it will actually start over fueling the engine. All our assumptions to this point are that you are running out of fuel. While I doubt the choke blade is your issue here, we need to remove it as a variable and make sure it's not actually adding fuel. If you have to for testing purposes, after the engine is warmed up and that choke is open, wire it open so it can't move and see if the stalling situation improves.

Have you done ignition points, wires, cap, rotor and plugs. The reason I'm asking is that many weak or aging ignition parts will work fine at lower RPM but as engine speed comes up and cylinder pressures rise, these parts have to work harder to make the spark jump the plug gap. That can show up as the RPM stalling you are having.

Also inside the distributor the weights on the advance should be free to move. The reason this is important is that as the engine RPM comes up, the spark needs to occur earlier. The timing advance adjusts this. If the weights are stuck, the timing can't advance. When you have the distributor cap off, with your hand you can twist the advance mechanism and move the weights against their springs.

Finally, I will echo much of the advice you've been given. This carb isn't that hard to rebuild. It's worth a $50 kit and a can of dip. Hey, as pointed out, if it doesn't work then buy your replacement. Disassemble, soak for a couple of hours, spray off with compressed air and reassemble. You don't need to take every last screw out. In fact, I leave the adjustment screws in and often you don't need to touch these when it goes back together, or at least not adjust them very much. At a minimum, with the mechanical skills you demonstrate on this site, you have the ability to pull the carb top (remove the screws around the perimeter) and set float height and replace an accelerator pump.

I am sure this is frustrating but just know that if you get this solved on your own, then there won't be a single thing on the 'Craft that you can't fix.

 

[Patfromny]

I agree with zeke. You have transplanted a new engine, cut a new key hole, chopped several tops off, done some trick wiring and lighting. Figured out the absolute best spot for the batteries in the islander :facepalm: created a hockey rink...with lights. Cut up more glassers than anyone I know. A carb is alot more simplistic than most of these feats. C'Mon bud, rebuild the carb...Everyone is doing it.:lol:

 

[GA_Boater]

Figured out the absolute best spot for the batteries in the islander :facepalm:

Pure supposition. The batteries may have moved again during the Grand Opening. LOL

 

[Patfromny]

Pure supposition. The batteries may have moved again during the Grand Opening. LOL

Grand opening. I like that GA. Bowectomy (sp?) is good but I like that there better. And obviously, easier to spell.

 

[jasoutside]

Hi Fellas!

All right, first up some good news and progress while I was waiting for some parts to make their way to the house....

A while back I saw one of our iboats buddies install a transom mounted trim/tilt switch and knew I needed to have that....

http://forums.iboats.com/forum/engi...rds/552333-remote-transom-mounted-trim-switch

So I got that done, super easy, pretty cheap, and it'll make my life a lot easier than climbing in and out of the boat to bring the drive up/down. I love it already!. I'll get you guys a photo later eh.

I also installed a new cap/rotor/wires. I will say the old wire to the coil was really corroded. The two "ears" on the connection had corroded and broke off when I pulled it out. Hopefully the new set will smooth things out.

My new water pump got here yesterday so I'm about to head out and swap that out.

---------------------------------------------------------------

Now, on to the carb....

I do appreciate the faith you guys have in me in the rebuild of this MerCarb! I think I could do it and I might be game if I was bored. But, at this stage I have a thousand things going on and I fear it would take me a good chunk of time to make it happen. Then if I did it wrong it would be another couple of weeks before I could get back on the water. By then the summer would be spent. I don't think I want to risk it. Maybe if it was winter and I had months before it had to be ready, but as it is, I'm late!! (by a few years really)

OI, thank you for your very generous offer, wow that was really very kind of you! There's no way I'd ask that of ya. Appreciated, thank you very much!

So, lemme see if I can answer a few questions you guys had...

Everything before the fuel pump is new and clean and aok. New fuel lines, new water separating filter (that is full of fuel while operating) the whole bit. To rule all that out I did run direct from a can of fresh gas straight to the fuel pump and had the same results. So, fuel pump or carb would be the issue eh.

I popped off the fuel filter, clean as a whistle, nothing slowing things down there...

When I pump the gas I do see two good streams of fuel shooting into the carb. I know it's hard to see on the vids.

So, I suppose I'm still at a spot where I'm looking at a carb or possibly a fuel pump issue.

I have read a good number of the carb rebuild threads and I see things like...

"You really need to know what you are doing..."

"It's tedious and must be done right...."

"...painful..."

Heck, I think my Kanuck buddy Glen even resorted to picking up a new carb and he's brilliant, and ultra handsome.

So yup, at this juncture, that's where I'm headed too. The old carb is already off, mating surface is all cleaned up ready to go and the new carb is on the way. I got a great price on one and it should be here in just a few days.

You guys who follow along know I'm a big time bottom feeder and very stubborn about saving the budget whenever I can. In this case a rebuild would have probably cost me about $100 (with the extra misc supplies, I don't have an ultrasonic cleaner) with the gamble that I did it right, or not. For an extra couple hundred I now have a new one, less hair tearing out, less headache, way less time, almost 100% certain that it'll work properly, yah, that's worth it to me. I don't mind coughing that up in this case.

Now, if I bolt that on and it's still doing the same thing I think I can turn my attention to the fuel pump.

So, thanks for sticking with me, hang tight till I get the new water pump in and new carb on.

Cheers guys:becky:

 

[budski]

Hope you solve your problem Jason. you gave me an idea, I was thinking the other day that it was a pain in the but having to run back and forth to tilt the motor, so I took your idea and ordered a transom mounted tilt/trim switch.Thanks for the inspiration.

 

[Watermann]

Jeez with the ignition parts being that bad it could cause the stall problem since the advance from the TBIV would all kinds of messed up. Try running her after the tune up and impeller, maybe you'll get lucky (you're about due) and can send the carb back. Oh yeah don't forget to turn the hose on. :lol:

 

[Patfromny]

Point taken. Sometimes we lose sight of the prize. You want to get on the water. For a few bucks more you don't have to spend a few very early mornings trying to figure out a rebuild and hope it works. Got it. Get her on the lake and have fun. We'll give you a pass this time.☺

 

[jasoutside]

AOK guys, time for a quick update:

1. Water pump replaced
2. Wrestled with the outdrive for about 5 hours to get it back on correctly, ended up breaking the lower shift shaft when it fell (or did I throw it). I learned a lot about outdrives that day.
3. Replaced the lower shift shaft
4. Dist. cap, rotor and wires all replaced
5. New carb bolted on
6. Shift cable adjusted so it would actually go into reverse
7. Test run in the drive, success!!!! The stalling out at 2K RPM is gone!

Couple of photos for you guys, here's what an impeller looks like aft about three minutes without water...

Bunch of plastic burned up in the housing...

Lower shift shaft, all be it, in two pieces:facepalm:...

 

[jbcurt00]

Congrats on 2.5steps forward w all the work and only a half step back w shift shaft.

Good luck on an impending run w out the stalling

 

[jasoutside]

Allrighty, so after a successful run in the drive I took the Islander out to the local lake, check it out...

 

[Watermann]

Now that's more like it :thumb: cutting a fine wake there!