Would you hire an ex-con?

[Bob_VT]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

First I would give him a chance but under conditions....... conditions that if he ever crosses the line....he is history.

Being firm, honest and fair works both ways. Communication will be the key of what kind of worker he will be.

He will only be good as long as he is checked by the book and by the right people. Probation Officer's need to be doing their part as well as you.

Sad to say but prison's suck. Unfortunately, prison rarely (if ever) does anything to reform anyone. That must come from within that individual. Prison's teach criminals how to be better criminals and how to be in a "controlled" place while learning how to circumvent the system. You (Bubba) being the supervisor needs to be a firm leader and in the beginning check everything that young man does...... what is basically micro managing but it is needed. The better things go.... the less micro managing you will have to do until you feel he is up to a standard as a good reliable worker.

The only other advice I would give (if you hire him) is to get involved and casually ask him what he is doing in his "off" time. Encourage involvement in the community (where permitted), education, Church and make sure he knows he is part of a team.

My friend has a firewood business and has recently hired an ex con. My friend was frustrated on how hard it was at first but things are working out. The man he hired works very hard to please people and is extremely polite.

 

[DaNinja]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Well, he was "my partner", for about 3 years in the construction business. I have some fairly expensive tools that are "personal tools". I told him straight out and up front that if he screwed up, I'd turn him in. NO EXCEPTIONS !!!!! He said that he understood. He said that he really wanted to straighten up, (I've heard that before out of others).

And YES, I've made mistakes myself. I've done things that I am NOT necessarily proud of. I've been given a second chance before. I figured that he had paid his debt to society, and that I had NO reason to "judge him until he screwed up". AS I had previously said. He may have been one in a million.

I took a gamble, and as far as I am concerned, I came up a winner !!!! He's been, and still is a good friend !!!! I trust him!!!!

BUT, as I have read here. CHECK HIM OUT !!!!!

Good luck !!!!!

Love the bold italics. I may adopt it.

 

[windshield_time]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Well you asked for opinions. So here it comes. First, in the end it is your decision. You say you live in a small community, I don't know what kind of business you run, but, the question comes, will the community shun you for it. If all goes well you are the hero, if it goes bad, you're the guy who hired the con who did XYZ. Whether that is breaking into someones home, or beating someone up. If your community is small enough man that can be bad for your business. Also depending on what you do, there may be customers who will take their business elsewhere just because you hired a con. Not necessarily a con over so and so who doesn't have a job just a con period. It gets worse if the gossip group in your town knows what he was convicted of.

Understand I am for second chances, but my brother got 3 and he is back in prison again. I hope forever cause he just can't get stay out of trouble. (my brother did some bad things not appropriate for a forum) His boss did alot to help him, rented him an apt. loaned him money, so when he back to prison he lost alot of money too.


If this guy will be somewhat anonymous, IE: a mechanic working on cars that people won't interact with regularly (cause when people interact with your employees that employee is representing you and your business) then maybe a good idea. If you need him to go on service calls, not such a good thing.

Since he will be moving away from the area in which he was convicted this may be good, he won't have the "old gang" to get back together with. This would also be a perfect opportunity for you to implement a drug free policy and mandatory testing for your employees if you don't already do so.

Not a really helpful post, but gives you more stuff to think about.

Good luck.

 

[DaNinja]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Well you asked for opinions. So here it comes. First, in the end it is your decision. You say you live in a small community, I don't know what kind of business you run, but, the question comes, will the community shun you for it. If all goes well you are the hero, if it goes bad, you're the guy who hired the con who did XYZ. Whether that is breaking into someones home, or beating someone up. If your community is small enough man that can be bad for your business. Also depending on what you do, there may be customers who will take their business elsewhere just because you hired a con. Not necessarily a con over so and so who doesn't have a job just a con period. It gets worse if the gossip group in your town knows what he was convicted of.

Understand I am for second chances, but my brother got 3 and he is back in prison again. I hope forever cause he just can't get stay out of trouble. (my brother did some bad things not appropriate for a forum) His boss did alot to help him, rented him an apt. loaned him money, so when he back to prison he lost alot of money too.


If this guy will be somewhat anonymous, IE: a mechanic working on cars that people won't interact with regularly (cause when people interact with your employees that employee is representing you and your business) then maybe a good idea. If you need him to go on service calls, not such a good thing.

Since he will be moving away from the area in which he was convicted this may be good, he won't have the "old gang" to get back together with. This would also be a perfect opportunity for you to implement a drug free policy and mandatory testing for your employees if you don't already do so.

Not a really helpful post, but gives you more stuff to think about.

Good luck.

I think that was very helpful from someone who has lived close to the situation.

 

[Chris-R]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

I would not hire him.

 

[DaNinja]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

I would not hire him.

Why not?

 

[avenger79]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

seems like many here have no dealings with this type of person at all.

the types of jobs he can have are determined by his conviction, not just the fact it's a felony.

he can't transfer parole without a job in his desired state. i'm sure his dad would love to have him home, sure he'd love to be home, and the sheriff would probably like to help them out.

first you need to look at yourself. are you a fair, patient, and trusting person. why? because Bubba you literally hold his future in your hands. all those above that said one slip and he's gone!!! yes i agree BUT if you should jump to a conclsion that the ex con ripped something off. an easy assumption to make, you call his PO as well as the police. he will be immediately taken into custody, his PO will do that. police will conduct a short investigation. like it or not if he's got a record he's guilty until proven innocent. if the police agree he took something his parole can be revoked. he automatically goes back into custody to finish his orig sentence. then gets new sentence for theft.
here comes the patience part, after all of this has started you remember you put those tools in a different truck one day. he didn't take them after all. too bad,once he's revoked, he's probably not getting back out.
guys on parole, for the most part are looking to get right. people make mistakes. use your judgement, and make sure he knows the score up front. don't play dirty harry with him, just let him know you will ask him if you think there's a problem, and you will contact his PO. don't hold it over his head though, you know what i mean.
that said i know a few who got out and got a chance and quickly blew it. one big thing, don't think for a minute the drugs stay in chicago and he can't get them where you are. drugs are everywhere, if he wants to get back on them he can and will.
i would not deny him a chance because of a bad decision but i would deny it if i thought he didn't regret that decision. does he regret doing the crime or does he regret getting caught.

best of luck with your decision. i have a few close friends who have done some months and years in barred hotels. i trust them but i know they want to stay out. i have a couple who enjoy being in there and continue to go back.

 

[eaglejim]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Bubba I hired a ex con in the 80's he was the wheel man for a botched robbery and a murder,he did a couple of years and was released because he did not know about the murder,he never missed a day (except to see his po) a very quite and polite guy eager to learn and to this day even though he does not work for me when I see him he is always grateful

 

[jonesg]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Bubba I hired a ex con in the 80's he was the wheel man for a botched robbery

No comparison with addiction there.
Coke is an very insidious addiction.

Its not an ex-con you'r dealing with,
its an unrecovered ( still insane) addict.
You will learn absolutely nothing, zip, nada from talking to them.
A pathological liar doesn't even know they are lying.
Denial = D.on't E.ven N.otice I. A.m L.ying.

Try one of these meetings, go - listen and talk to them.
http://www.camissouri.org/meetings3.php
The recovered addicts are the experts.

I wouldn't listen to the sherriff, the parole officer or therapists,
they don't know and they aren't the ones putting it on the line.
They just want you to take the risk.
I would listen to his sponsor, if he doesn't have one I'd walk.

 

[Jeep Man]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

This would cover Bubba for what insurance won't, but more importantly, it would demonstrate the commitment of his family to provide support for this guy as well.

 

[Av8nBill]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Not everyone who had a coke problem is an addict. Contrary to popular notion, coke is similar to alcohol in that some people can walk away and some can't. I grew up with several friends and aquaintances who used it to varying degrees and some just quit once the novelty wore off and the consequences became more obvious, some never did. And, yes, some of them sold small quantities to help support their habit (rather than turning to some sort of property or violent crime).

This was also in a small town, one that most outsiders would not think could support any kind of drug traffic. Many of these people are now productive, caring, family-oriented types in large cities where it's really easy to obtain drugs if you want them. They've been clean for decades.

Take everyone's opinion with a grain of salt, listen to your heart, pray about it and make the best decision you can. Nobody can reasonably fault you either way you decide, but some will judge you anyway. That's life. Keep us updated. You are in my prayers for wisdom and peace with your decision.

 

[R Socey]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

It seems like the only victim was himself, and his family - they
paid a price already. Should he have to pay for a youthful indi-
cretion the rest of his life! Do you think it is a productive message to tell someone that for the rest of their life they are never to be trusted or forgiven! How would that affect their
attitude, and decision making process? I think the war on drugs
has hurt this country much more than the drugs. How would you
feel if he was your child? My childhood was mostly miserable be-
cause of alcohol - should we have a war on it? This is my humble oppinion. Talk with him, and see where his heart is at.

 

[Chris-R]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Why not?

Because I am running a business and there are a lot of qualified people out there without criminal records and without drug problems who would be very happy to be hired by my company. Hiring someone is a business decision. All this talk about giving the guy a chance is nonsense from a business perspective. Why should my business pass over some better qualified people without all this guy's problems and hire him? Put yourself in the position of a person who has applied for the job and you find out that a conviced felon/drug addict was hired instead of you. You should be rewarded for doing the right thing, not the convicted felon/drug addict. My business model says NO to drugs, felons, etc. and instead, says YES to qualified law abiding applicants.

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

I have hired a couple recovering addicts who were also on parole both drug related charges, I will tell you that an addict is an addict and a liar, I learned this from these persons sponsors. I had good feelings for both these young men but both fell back into the system unfortunately, niether stole from me or my company but seeing them fall was heart wrenching for me and the employees. At first they started coming in late then not at all, then they missed their drug tests and then they were back in jail.

Our plan was detailed with the cooperation of the sponsors, at the time these men were under state ordered mandatory supervised random drug testing the problem was it took a week or more for the state to inform the employer of the pass fail, so we had the individuals sign a contract for bi weekly supervised drug testing which they both willfully signed prior to employment with the sponsors support.

The first made it a couple months roughly, young guy 22-23 the first month was great hard working always on time then it started, 5 or 10 minutes late, nearly everyday very apologetic but it went down hill quickly his sponsor got involved quickly and he wound up getting picked up with alcohol which was a parole violation, this guys sponsor (a woman) was an absolute dictator with this guy!

The second lasted for nearly a year, unfortunately his demise was similar to the first once the decline began, problem is he had gained the trust of even his sponsor which made it hurt more then the first, he had the same deal as the first on the drug testing and after 8 or 9 months he missed a couple appointments but called in to tell us he had an issue and couldn't make the appointment but was on his way now to get it done, well he had figured out when the male supervisor at the testing facility was gone and therefore he wouldn't be able to be supervised but they tested him unsuper. Then the late arrivals to work started and again he was picked up on alcohol and thats the end of the story.

Things have changed since those days, they now have businesses that do testing differently but we have changed the direction of the company and now do not have the ability to hire felons, we random test all of our employees every quarter just to be in compliance with federal guidelines.

I feel for you Bubba I want to help too but nothing you and I can do for those that need help can fix the fact that these people have to want to help themselves first.

I hope things work out for this youngman

 

[eastont]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

My wife works in corrections and deals with both drug offenders and mentally ill inmates. On an average when a drug offender gets released after his sentence is up, 94% will re-offend and of the mentally ill ones, there average is about 20% as long as they stay on their meds. The big difference is the meds...........drug offenders can't get a med to cure their problem but the "drug" that has proven to keep them from re-offending, is an honest source of income. If they can't earn an honest buck, then they know how easy it is to sell drugs to make a buck.

 

[paultjohnson]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Tough call.... I believe some cities/states even offer incentives [ like income tax deductions ] for employers that employ or help people become contributing members of society. because it saves tax money if they stay out of prison, off welfare etc.
Sure there are risk in hiring a felon. But not hiring him doesn't totally wash your hands of the issue. If he cant make an honest $ he might have no choice but to make a dishonest $. YOU pay taxes that pay for arrest., prosecution, incarceration etc. And who knows what kind of grudge he or his fam might hold
Also I believe that there is some truth in the saying that : it takes the whole village to raise a child : [I know he is an adult ]
I'm not saying to do it [hire him ] Just throwing out some thoughts.. Best of luck to you with whatever decision you settle on..

 

[aspeck]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Question: how many on this forum have used drugs? Answer: We don't know.

Question: Does using drugs make you an addict? His arrest wasn't because he was an addict, but because he was using and selling. (anyone ever done that and not gotten caught? If so, what is the difference?)

BTW, I have a zero tolerance for drug use/abuse.

I only say that to say that we don't know the extent of this young man's addiction. I think that is a very important part of the equation. Also, does HE want the help, or it is just the father and the sheriff, who happens to be friends of the family?

If the kid wants help, I would probably give him a chance (have given others a chance and been burned, and been the hero ... but either way I did my part in trying to help). BUT I WOULD ONLY HELP IF THE KID WAS THE AGGRESSOR IN GETTING A JOB AND SHOWED EFFORT THAT HE REALLY WANTED HELP, not just a way out.

 

[puddle jumper]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Aspect make a good point. Define addict. In my opinion an addict is some one who has to have there substance in order to survive. A person who smokes cigarettes is an drug addict. A person who smokes a cigarette every once in a wile but can leave it or take it at any time is a recreational user. Big difference between those two users.

Another question I think needs to be asked is can a person like the person we are talking about be trusted and be honest. We cant judge on this one as we don't know the person involved. He was selling drug's to support his habit. As long as he was not stealing he was being honest drug dealer.

From a business point of view can your business take the hit if your customers find out that you have employed this person and don't take well to it. I saw this happen to a shop that had a person who was charged with child molesting working for him. Even the facts showed that the guy charged had not done nothing wrong and was cleared beyond a doubt.This shop ended up closing down from the backlash of the association connected with this person.

Just some food for thought.

 

[jonesg]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

Because I am running a business and there are a lot of qualified people out there without criminal records and without drug problems who would be very happy to be hired by my company. Hiring someone is a business decision. All this talk about giving the guy a chance is nonsense from a business perspective. Why should my business pass over some better qualified people without all this guy's problems and hire him? Put yourself in the position of a person who has applied for the job and you find out that a conviced felon/drug addict was hired instead of you. You should be rewarded for doing the right thing, not the convicted felon/drug addict. My business model says NO to drugs, felons, etc. and instead, says YES to qualified law abiding applicants.

I am a recovered alcoholic/addict and I agree completely with you, business is not the place to play savior.
There are plenty of dishwashing jobs for a questionable addict to show the quality of their recovery and gain some valuable humility.
What addicts lack is humility, not self esteem. Addicts have more esteem for self than any human ought to, they think they are God.

Thats what people don't grasp, they see a miserable addict ,drooped head, depressed and think they just need to build up and have pride again.
Thats oil on the fire.

 

[jonesg]

Re: Would you hire an ex-con?

this guys sponsor (a woman) was an absolute dictator with this guy!

Thats not a sponsor.
A good sponsor doesn't direct anyone, they don't play God.
They DO say what they did and guide the newcomer through the steps.
And generally the gals don't sponsor guys.