Water in bilge has returned in 1995 Four Winns 190 Horizon

[ggundersen3]

Water in bilge was solved last summer with replacement of the water pump in the lower unit by a reliable local marine dealer. No more water appeared in the bilge, Now this summer I'm now getting about a 1 to 1-1/2 gallon of water finding its way into the bilge after about 3-4 hours on the lake. 2 questions here.
1- Would it be smart to put the boat on the trailer and with the drain plug in and bilge pump shut off, put the garden hose directly in bilge, let a few gallons of water gather and see if water drips, or seeps out anywhere indicating a leak?
2- The boat has an original equipment depth finder, I can see the through the hull transducer in bottom of the engine compartment. I can also see it on the exterior/bottom underside of the hull.(see attached pic) Is that ever known to eventually leak? Could that be how water is getting in bilge?
I greatly appreciate advice/help/opinions.
Thanks

 

[JASinIL2006]

I never advocate filling your boat with water. You are unlikely to get enough water in there to find the leak and you run the risk of introducing water to all sorts of places that would be better off dry. Putting a camera on a selfie stick and trying to see where water comes in while you are afloat is a much better way.

Also, how exactly did changing the water pump in the lower leg prevent water from leaking int the bilge?

Might not hurt to post some info about your boat, motor, drive, etc.

 

[ggundersen3]

I never advocate filling your boat with water. You are unlikely to get enough water in there to find the leak and you run the risk of introducing water to all sorts of places that would be better off dry. Putting a camera on a selfie stick and trying to see where water comes in while you are afloat is a much better way.

Also, how exactly did changing the water pump in the lower leg prevent water from leaking int the bilge?

Might not hurt to post some info about your boat, motor, drive, etc.

Its an OMC 5.0 with a Volvo-Penta Cobra SX drive

 

[Lou C]

That model has the raw water pump on the engine not in the drive. You should pull the drive to check the drive shaft bellows for water.

 

[Scott Danforth]

to put enough water in the bilge to get to most leak spots is to put in close to 500-1000 gallons of water

the weight of the water alone will damage your boat

you will also get water into areas that were never designed to get water into.

dont do it.

with a dry bilge, back the boat in on the ramp. get a bright flash light and look

 

[Lou C]

I would to further investigate:
Start with a totally dry bilge, put your cell phone on a selfie stick and have someone slowly back the boat into the water and watch & listen.
One problem and it is a significant one, is that I/Os by nature of their design have a lot of places to leak water at the transom mount:
1) driveshaft bellows (this should be checked every fall at the end of the season when the boat is winterized)
2) seal around transom mount (can't really check this, requires engine pull and dis-assembly)
3) exhaust Y pipe where it bolts to transom inner surface (requires engine pull)
4) steering arm (requires engine pull)
5) hoses that go from transom mount to P/S cooler then up to the impeller (this you can usually get at)
6) rotted & soft transom, causing transom mount to flex and transom mount seal to leak (requires engine pull and major reconstruction).

Let's say you'll be lucky, if it is #1, or #5. Any of the others, and you're into a lot of cash unless you can pull the engine yourself.
Those bellows under ideal conditions last as long as 10 years but should really be checked every year and changed as soon as you see small cracks starting in the folds. That is a sign the rubber is getting stiff and will fail soon. Just like old trailer tires.
For this and other reasons, I would never buy another I/O boat. While I have not had a lot of these problems, I just don't want to deal with the maintenance headaches any longer. Outboards are very expensive but far less maintenance and safer.

 

[ggundersen3]

to put enough water in the bilge to get to most leak spots is to put in close to 500-1000 gallons of water

the weight of the water alone will damage your boat

you will also get water into areas that were never designed to get water into.

don't do it.

with a dry bilge, back the boat in on the ramp. get a bright flash light and look

Thanks everyone. So I looked up the invoices from the work that was done. In August 2021 the sea(raw) water pump was replaced, so I stand corrected Lou as it wasn't the water pump in lower unit, so that would make sense as a solution to stop water in bilge problem at that time. Also, when putting the boat away for winter in October and having dealer winterize it, I had them replace gimbel bearing, u joint, both bellows, fix broken skeg and repair/refurbish the prop and re-align the engine/drive. So i will follow your advice Scott and back boat into lake at boat ramp and start looking with a bright flashlight in the bilge.
Regarding my question about the factory original depth finder and the trough the hull transducer. These Four Winns Horizons all have that. Is that transducer mounted actually "through the hull", meaning there's a hole in the bottom/hull and the transducer is fitted in there? Or is it done differently? Take a look at the pic I attached in my earlier post of how it looks from the exterior of bottom of hull.
Thanks

 

[SavinRaven]

Hold the phone. 1 gallon after 3-4 hours of boating depending on how many times I plane off and come to a stop? This can be normal... Mine gets about that in about the same duration... I know nothing is leaking on my engine or any of the hoses from drive... or my hull. So I watched carefully and the water in my boat comes in from the blower vents when coming off plane... Bad manufacturing design by stingray being down lower on the swim platform. May just want to check there... A little bit of water in the bilge is normal in any boat...

 

[Lou C]

On my 88 Horizon 200 the OE transducer is glued to the inside of the hull but is not a thru hull unit; these shoot the signal thru the fiberglass. So unless they did something different on the later ones I don’t think that’s the problem. That never worked on mine I installed a transom mount transducer years ago.

 

[Lou C]

Thanks everyone. So I looked up the invoices from the work that was done. In August 2021 the sea(raw) water pump was replaced, so I stand corrected Lou as it wasn't the water pump in lower unit, so that would make sense as a solution to stop water in bilge problem at that time. Also, when putting the boat away for winter in October and having dealer winterize it, I had them replace gimbel bearing, u joint, both bellows, fix broken skeg and repair/refurbish the prop and re-align the engine/drive. So i will follow your advice Scott and back boat into lake at boat ramp and start looking with a bright flashlight in the bilge.
Regarding my question about the factory original depth finder and the trough the hull transducer. These Four Winns Horizons all have that. Is that transducer mounted actually "through the hull", meaning there's a hole in the bottom/hull and the transducer is fitted in there? Or is it done differently? Take a look at the pic I attached in my earlier post of how it looks from the exterior of bottom of hull.
Thanks

It’s possible something went wrong with the bellows install, I’d test it but pull the drive & look. It’s not a hard job but there are things you need to make sure are right.

 

[briangcc]

Water in a boat after running is not normal. I had that very issue with my FourWinns when I first took delivery. After an hour on the water I'd pull the boat and the bilge pump would be spitting water up the launch ramp.

Turns out the selling marina were idiots - and that's being polite. Took it to a different marina and had them fix it. Pretty sure it was bellows that weren't tight.

So what I'd suggest is dunk the boat and while its on a trailer, check like Scott suggested. Then, lower the outdrive and start the motor. Now recheck for water. Bet you find it this way.

 

[JASinIL2006]

Hold the phone. 1 gallon after 3-4 hours of boating depending on how many times I plane off and come to a stop? This can be normal... Mine gets about that in about the same duration... I know nothing is leaking on my engine or any of the hoses from drive... or my hull. So I watched carefully and the water in my boat comes in from the blower vents when coming off plane... Bad manufacturing design by stingray being down lower on the swim platform. May just want to check there... A little bit of water in the bilge is normal in any boat...

I don’t agree. Water is normal if you have swimmers/skiers getting in and out of the boat, or if you take water over the bow or transom (or thru the vents, but that doesn’t sound right, either…). Under normal operating, though, there is no reason to find water in the bilge of an I/O unless something is leaking.

 

[SavinRaven]

I don’t agree. Water is normal if you have swimmers/skiers getting in and out of the boat, or if you take water over the bow or transom (or thru the vents, but that doesn’t sound right, either…). Under normal operating, though, there is no reason to find water in the bilge of an I/O unless something is leaking.

you just named 4 ways that water would be normal in a bilge then proceed to say you don't agree... A little bit of water is not going to ruin the boat. pump it out and keep boating.. if you are keeping it in a slip and you have water where your automatic bilge isn't able to keep up its an issue..

 

[briangcc]

OP's location states Wisconsin. I highly doubt there's lots of swimming going on over 3-4 hours to bring in a couple gallons of water. Water temps have gotta be darn near frigid. If you are...God bless ya.

You have a problem if you're getting that much water in the boat in that short period of time. It isn't normal. Find the leak and get it corrected.

 

[Toyelectroman]

To help find my leak I purchased a cheap endoscope off of Amazon

 

[JASinIL2006]

you just named 4 ways that water would be normal in a bilge then proceed to say you don't agree... A little bit of water is not going to ruin the boat. pump it out and keep boating.. if you are keeping it in a slip and you have water where your automatic bilge isn't able to keep up its an issue..

If water is coming in from any of those, the presence of the water is normal. If you're just floating or driving around and you have water collecting in the bilge, you have a leak and need to fix it.

 

[SavinRaven]

Again one Gallon in 3-4 hours and a proper bilge pump is nothing to worry about...unless you are seeing any other mechanical issues run it as is.

 

[Horigan]

Again one Gallon in 3-4 hours and a proper bilge pump is nothing to worry about...unless you are seeing any other mechanical issues run it as is.

Sorry. Totally disagree also. My bilge is dry as a bone, no matter how many hours I'm out. The OP has a leak he needs to address.

 

[briangcc]

Again one Gallon in 3-4 hours and a proper bilge pump is nothing to worry about...unless you are seeing an

Gotta disagree. Sitting a week docked, covered when not used, when pulled out my boat is absolutely bone dry.

Water ingress is not normal and requires attention. You never know when your bilge pump or battery are going to give up the ghost...then what?

 

[nola mike]

Again one Gallon in 3-4 hours and a proper bilge pump is nothing to worry about...unless you are seeing any other mechanical issues run it as is.

Relying on a bilge pump to keep up with a leak of unknown origin is not a smart or safe way to boat. Absolutely terrible advice.