Voids found after new transom install

[Lectro88]

I understand your concern about voids, nobody likes or wants that.
You had epoxy between layers, right? its coated or protected, even if water gets in, It has to get in first, and if it does its in a pocket of epoxy void, you obviously painted or smeared it and it developed pockets.
So if water ever got in are you sure it would find unprotected dry unepoxied wood.
If it were me. and just m.h.opinion. IF I did or felt it was that big of a deal, you got to find it first and know you can fill each void to the top actually hitting the highest point of the void. thats a long shot. so you may only fill it 1/2-3/4 full. and thats same for all of them. so you still end up with voids.
I don't know if I would tear it out, your still better than it was at at tear out for repair.
you learned a lesson, keep an eye on it.
You know.... its reasonably difficult to laminate plywood and get 100% 0-voids.
Then you have to set that sometimes against a fiberglass skin be it inner or outer, then again not have any voids, and that again is difficult at best for 1st. timers.
You are not the only person that has had voids in a laminate.
Most never knew it or gave it a second thought. let alone consider tearing it back out.
Your choice. hope I was helpful, or gave a viable different angle of view.
best luck.

 

[Lectro88]

Edit;
I'm not opposed to trying to improve it or fix it. (injection)thats prob most I would do. but you're now drilling holes to definitely let water in if you don't get it sealed. Its the fact or chance of getting it 100%
Injection.. whether or not if it will crack, well milled fibers should curb that.
Dont figure you would ever exert enough stress or flex make to crack. your're after filling the void and keeping the space filled to keep water out. You've got it held in place, its not going anywhere without a lot of work.
Maybe I said all I meant to that time.

 

[KesselRunner]

Another thought.....would a stud finder for walls in a house be any good finding voids in a transom?

That's actually a really interesting thought. Now that I now where the voids are I would like to know what that looks like on the scanner. It would probably be hard to interpret if one does not have some reference points. Have a friend with a 700$ model that I can borrow in a few weeks.

 

[KesselRunner]

I understand your concern about voids, nobody likes or wants that.
You had epoxy between layers, right? its coated or protected, even if water gets in, It has to get in first, and if it does its in a pocket of epoxy void, you obviously painted or smeared it and it developed pockets.
So if water ever got in are you sure it would find unprotected dry unepoxied wood.
If it were me. and just m.h.opinion. IF I did or felt it was that big of a deal, you got to find it first and know you can fill each void to the top actually hitting the highest point of the void. thats a long shot. so you may only fill it 1/2-3/4 full. and thats same for all of them. so you still end up with voids.
I don't know if I would tear it out, your still better than it was at at tear out for repair.
you learned a lesson, keep an eye on it.
You know.... its reasonably difficult to laminate plywood and get 100% 0-voids.
Then you have to set that sometimes against a fiberglass skin be it inner or outer, then again not have any voids, and that again is difficult at best for 1st. timers.
You are not the only person that has had voids in a laminate.
Most never knew it or gave it a second thought. let alone consider tearing it back out.
Your choice. hope I was helpful, or gave a viable different angle of view.
best luck.

Thanks for the thorough reply. I plan on opening up the voids fully so I can be sure it's filled in top to bottom with milled fibers and chopped strand mat.

I agree on that most people just probably do not know. I've seen plenty of youtube repairs with equal amounts of resin that I used and less coverage in clamping spots.

 

[las]

How should moisture or water get into the voids in the first place? And what should stop moisture from getting in behind the rest of the wood core?

Did you add stringers and reinforcements from the inside when building the new transom?

If so I would not consider it a big problem. I think the major strength of the transom should come from the attachment inside via stringers and strengthening to the sides and bottom of the hull when doing these types of repair works. Yes the outer skin ads structural integrity as well. But do you know how good of a bond you have over the rest of the wood core?
And how many people are actually aware of the rotted out cores they are sailing around with!

I would use it as is! Watch for stress cracks in the corners of the hull/transom, if they start to form you don't have enough strength and then it's a do-over.

I did my transom from the inside and made plenty of stringers and thickness so that I couldn't really care less if the outer skin fell off, it would still be plenty strong.

And if you repair it later on, remember to use epoxy again, as polyester might not stick/adhere good enough on the epoxy you used.
I use polyester personally, even though it's not waterproof. But it's cheap and have proven it's worth over many years.

 

[Lectro88]

Thanks for the thorough reply. I plan on opening up the voids fully so I can be sure it's filled in top to bottom with milled fibers and chopped strand mat.

I agree on that most people just probably do not know. I've seen plenty of youtube repairs with equal amounts of resin that I used and less coverage in clamping spots.

I must admire you desire for almost perfection. I'm guilty of the same thing a lot.
Other than self gratitude or your own peace of mind.
I think your efforts will waay outweigh the benefits.
As I and others have said, its already protected or sealed off.
its going to be difficult for water to get in to begin with.
And if it does, its just going to be laying against epoxy.
Unless this problem is way worse than you describe.
Its your project, do as you see fit. whatever makes you happy.
Hats of for the desire of quality, that is a little uncommon now days.

 

[Lectro88]

Just out of curiosity.
How are you planning "opening up"?
Are you considering cutting through the outside skin or Hull to gain access to these voids.
If that is the case, or cutting a hole in your new plywood?
if so.. You are creating a bigger problem than you have.
Unless I'm missing something major.

 

[zool]

You don't need to chase this problem, your transom is already superior to the original. If you can slightly thicken some resin to settle into the voids, its fine.

The main force is around the motor clamps, the side tabbing holds it all in place. voids in the other areas are a non issue.

 

[KesselRunner]

How should moisture or water get into the voids in the first place? And what should stop moisture from getting in behind the rest of the wood core?

Did you add stringers and reinforcements from the inside when building the new transom?

If so I would not consider it a big problem. I think the major strength of the transom should come from the attachment inside via stringers and strengthening to the sides and bottom of the hull when doing these types of repair works. Yes the outer skin ads structural integrity as well. But do you know how good of a bond you have over the rest of the wood core?
And how many people are actually aware of the rotted out cores they are sailing around with!

I would use it as is! Watch for stress cracks in the corners of the hull/transom, if they start to form you don't have enough strength and then it's a do-over.

I did my transom from the inside and made plenty of stringers and thickness so that I couldn't really care less if the outer skin fell off, it would still be plenty strong.

And if you repair it later on, remember to use epoxy again, as polyester might not stick/adhere good enough on the epoxy you used.
I use polyester personally, even though it's not waterproof. But it's cheap and have proven it's worth over many years.

There is no obvious entry point for water I guess my worry about that is that it would accumulate over the years and the freezing temperatures (gets to about -25°C / -13°F at the coldest each winter).

I realize I have kind off lost perspective on the actual points where the transom gets it structural integrity. Indeed I will be installing transom knees that attach to the stringers (after seeing your picture I will also be adding knees to the sides, liked the idea of support that far up!).

I guess just filling the voids should be enough and solve all potential problems, I will contemplate while inspecting it some more.

 

[KesselRunner]

I must admire you desire for almost perfection. I'm guilty of the same thing a lot.
Other than self gratitude or your own peace of mind.
I think your efforts will waay outweigh the benefits.
As I and others have said, its already protected or sealed off.
its going to be difficult for water to get in to begin with.
And if it does, its just going to be laying against epoxy.
Unless this problem is way worse than you describe.
Its your project, do as you see fit. whatever makes you happy.
Hats of for the desire of quality, that is a little uncommon now days.

Thank you for your words of reason, outside perspective like that is what I need.

 

[KesselRunner]

You don't need to chase this problem, your transom is already superior to the original. If you can slightly thicken some resin to settle into the voids, its fine.

The main force is around the motor clamps, the side tabbing holds it all in place. voids in the other areas are a non issue.

Thank you for the words of reason. Will probably do just as you say to make sure nothing can accumulate in there.

 

[kcassells]

I have to say I have changed my opinion and agree. Move on to the next challenge.

 

[las]

There is no obvious entry point for water I guess my worry about that is that it would accumulate over the years and the freezing temperatures (gets to about -25°C / -13°F at the coldest each winter).

I realize I have kind off lost perspective on the actual points where the transom gets it structural integrity. Indeed I will be installing transom knees that attach to the stringers (after seeing your picture I will also be adding knees to the sides, liked the idea of support that far up!).

I guess just filling the voids should be enough and solve all potential problems, I will contemplate while inspecting it some more.

When you wrote " have lost perspective" I knew exactly what you meant and if nobody stops you, it spirals out of control. That's me
My boat was a cheap junk 13" and all things done so far is way over the top.

 

[Lectro88]

When you wrote " have lost perspective" I knew exactly what you meant and if nobody stops you, it spirals out of control. That's me
My boat was a cheap junk 13" and all things done so far is way over the top.

There is nothing wrong with over the top, I do that too. Alot...

Forgive me for my long replies, I will explain why I try to be so detailed. now...
Not everyone reads between the lines the same, I.E. what you know when your typing, you take for granted that others Just know what you meant. even the little things you left out. Well I myself have not perfected reading others minds either.

So I will say this and try to leave it alone.
If you open... I think I counted 7 locations you highlighted.
A few things on that..
You are opening up 7 places for water to get in. AS IN that is the original skin/fiberglass, and you are now making holes in it.
And its going to look like it was shot, with a shotgun,, while its open.
Now you have to repair all that.
Even if you just drilled holes big enough for a syrenge needle. you still created an opening that has to be fixed. in the original surface.
IF you cut big holes, your patch will never be as strong as the original skin or fiberglass that you just cut open.. You just made it Weaker..
Remember this is your exterior protection. Factory. and its not so easy to duplicate or beat that. (for water intrusion and strength) it "was" 1 Solid piece.
If it were me, I would ensure the bonding seams along the entire parameter or outside edges of transom install, where you glued it to the hull,, is sure to turn water. (Sealed and strong)heck run another layer or 2 of tabbing in the corners, if you want to do something to keep water out.
When you mount or drill for motor, epoxy or sleeve and epoxy those penetrations, so follow wake and splashing can't get to wood transom around bolts. (its called potting the holes)

Lastly... Just a wild guess...
The transom you just installed "should" last 10-15 years easy. And that's the low numbers.
If you take care of it, it could last longer than the original.

Truth be known I had a few places/voids in my transom too.
And I was at the same place as you.. I get it.!
I know how I built my transom, Could pull a D6 dozer on it.
I know my Tabbing was 3-4 layers. with big honking knee braces.
It's not going anywhere anytime soon.
And holly he((.. I would hate to have to tear it out NOW. (I pity if anyone tries to replace it in 50-100 yrs..) lol again.
It would take 3 weeks to cut and grind out what I did.. LOL.

Best of luck.

 

[JASinIL2006]

I'm glad you're not going to cut open your transom just to fill some voids. Your transom will be plenty strong as is. Most likely, even the voids wouldn't cause problems if you left them alone, but I also would want to fill them just to eliminate the possibility of water collecting there.

People here are extremely safety-conscious, so if this was a dangerous path to follow, pretty much all of us would be telling you to 'fix it right.' In this case, though, the less destructive route of repair should be just fine.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

 

[kcassells]

The ole' turkey baster method...yea, yea. That could work. Personally I would like to see the whole void so I can repair properly and never doubt myself. I was going for inside just to save the exterior transom skin repair, patch, paint.
Scott is usually 99.9% on the money.

Jas my apologies... your info was great for some reason I mistook you for Scott.
KR I'm glad everyone plowed thru this dilemma and came up with some good solutions. I over dink alot too.

 

[racerone]

Use ---west system --6-10-----Epoxy mixes as it comes out of the tube.-----Not expensive and is injected with caulking gun.