Trashed Carb'd 5.7 Swap to 5.0L EFI

[mr300z87]

So here is my situation, I have a 1989 Invader V210 cuddy cabin that is in near perfect condition. It has been in dry dock for the last 2.5 seasons because of a trashed 5.7L and a running Sea Ray Sundancer 250. See link for back story
https://forums.iboats.com/forum/eng...-cylinders-1-and-3-after-overheat-need-advice
In a perfect world I would have the correct vintage 5.7L built or purchase a reman long block, swap all the hardware and drop it in. Knowing the boat has little value not running and maybe $3 to $4K running I want to be in this for as little as possible both monetarily and in time. I have found affordable 5.0L EFI Engine complete drop in that I am going to look at tomorrow night. My plan is to do a compression test and possible fire it. Since I know this boat was offered with everything from a 3.0L to a 5,7L and performed well with a tired 5.7L I am not concerned about the 20 less HP the 5.0L has.

First off I an not really a big fan of the GM 5.0L engine, that aside, my concerns are will the EFI motor be plug and play to my boats bullet connector? Also this boat is equipped with a Bravo drive and will need a raw water pump added. What parts will be need to add this, Pump body looks the same, bracket is different, pulley is different, different belt and some hoses, am I missing anything? This alone could drive the cost up to much. Will the ECU work ok with the 1.5 ratio Bravo drive? Re prop needed maybe?

Last question how do I go about getting this engine to fire on the ground? I know how to get this engine to spin but what needs power to run?

I know this is kind of a backwards swap but would like to get this boat fixed and out of my yard. The thought of parting her out has crossed my mind but she is to nice to do that to beside I like doing this kind of project. Now if the temps and humidity would drop I might be able to get the 5.7 out.

As always any advice is always appreciated.

Mike

 

[achris]

The best way to do it would be to remove the entire plant, pulley to prop, and swap the 5 litre in as a complete unit, including the gimbal housing and drive... Trying to swap in a Bravo EFI engine into the place of a carbed Alpha engine has too many 'gotchas' to be easy, time or money effective...

But the instrument harness should be the same plug and pinout.

Chris.........

 

[mr300z87]

Achris thanks for the quick response but I think you have it backwards I want to put a EFI 5.0L alpha in place of a 5.7L Bravo and keep the Bravo Drive. I found a pic of stern drive setup with power steering and sea water pump and there looks to be to many bracket and pulleys needed. Could the V-belt setup including the sea water pump from the 5.7L swap to the 5.0L? This seems like the only way to make it work cost effectively.

 

[achris]

Achris thanks for the quick response but I think you have it backwards I want to put a EFI 5.0L alpha in place of a 5.7L Bravo and keep the Bravo Drive.

Ah, ok... 5L Alpha EFI engine in place of a 5.7L Bravo engine... Gotcha...

I found a pic of stern drive setup with power steering and sea water pump and there looks to be to many bracket and pulleys needed. Could the V-belt setup including the sea water pump from the 5.7L swap to the 5.0L?

Should work. You'll have to move the alternator and water pump pulley across too. The only difference between a 5 litre block and a 5.7 litre block is the bore. Externally, they are exactly the same. As long as the EFI engine includes the engine harness, I can't see too many insurmountable problems. The EFI (being Alpha) will include a shift cut-out switch, that a Bravo engine doesn't have. You should be able to just ignore that...

Chris........

 

[Scott06]

Per question of how to fire on the ground a couple of ways. There's feet on the flywheel cover it can sit on, a cinderblock and wood under each side motor mount. A garden hose clamped into the water from drive hose for cooling.

Electrically need a battery, put a spare battery cable to positive side of starter. In the ten pin plug maintained jumper from 6 (red/purple) to 5 (purple) and also a momentary jumper to pin 7 yellow red. Jumper to purple supplies 12v to ignition coil. Momentary jumper to yellow /red bumps the starter. Also need a ground from negative on battery to block stud by flywheel cover. Bump starter to turn it on, pull off ignition supply to shut it down.

 

[Scott Danforth]

I would build a stroker with a carb before swapping to a 5.0 efi or not

 

[Tassie 1]

Just a question,
will the " new " motor use the same bed?

repowered a few yrs ago, went from carbed holden ( gm ) 308's to merc mpi 350's,
major delay was getting someone who knew what they were doing ( not me lol ) to make new beds for different motor mounts,

 

[Scott Danforth]

Tassie 1 , all GM SBC's have the identical exterior mounting points

 

[achris]

Tassie 1 , all GM SBC's have the identical exterior mounting points

:lol::lol::lol: Scott Danforth

Tassie 1... 'Tassie' is short form for 'Tasmania' (an island to the south of the eastern side of mainland Australia)...

This bit right here.....


In 'Tassie', and all of the rest of Australia, we don't have the standard lot of GM engines, SBC or BBC... They are something of a rarity here. We have/had an arm of GM, once called GMH (H=Holden), which built their own engines, with little compatibility with the GM SBC/BBC engines...

Tassie 1 removed a 308 engine (an Australian built engine), and replaced it with a Mercruiser 350MPI... He might as well have had a 470 in there, as far as engine mount positions are concerned....

Cheers,

Chris........ :lol::lol:

 

[Scott Danforth]

Chris, as a wrench turner of odd engines, fully aware of the Holden vs GM (all divisions - Chev, Buick, Olds, Pontiac, GMC ) vs Vauxhall vs Opel engines.

however regarding SBC's (Small Block Chevrolet), all external dimensions are identical.

 

[mr300z87]

I am in the US so the above does not apply. LOL So if I am reading correctly I should be able to bolt my V-belt set up that is complete BTW on the 5.7L to the 5.0L but will need to extent the wiring for the alt to move to the other side as it is on the 5.7L now. The 5.0L is compete drop and supposedly comes ready to run including ECU, engine harness and bullet connection. Going to check it tonight and see how it looks Will keep you all posted.

Another question that I thought of this morning is will the Bravo coupler bolt to the 5.0L flywheel?

 

[nola mike]

Wouldn't it be much cheaper to go to the wrecker and pick up a $400 long block 5.7?

 

[mr300z87]

I boat in Salt water here at the NJ coast, converting a truck engine cost time I money to convert, since core plugs need to be recplaced with bras and head gaskets need to me SS marine grade. I have been looking for the correct vintage Merc 5.7L for a while now. This 5.0L was listed on craigslist but as a 5.7L. GM has not used a the 350 in any of there trucks in a long time and finding a good one at wrecking yard these days in not a easy as you may think. I actually have one in my garage but it is a bit tired and the compression#s did not come up good. I may just have to bite the bullet and get it rebuilt and stop messing with this newer technology. LOL I am a pretty decent mechanic but engine rebuilding is a little out of my wheel house.

 

[mr300z87]

So I went to check out this supposed drop in 5.0L and is was frozen, would not turn by hand or with the starter :grumpy::grumpy:. Its back to plan B rebuild the truck motor in my garage or buy a reman long block. Thanks for all the info.

 

[Scott06]

Did you consider putting it on Craigslist or similar site as is advertised as handyman’s special ? I bought my boat that way knowing it had a cracked block. Worked out well for the seller and me

 

[mr300z87]

I thought about just doing that but I have a friend who wants to buy it from me after it's fixed. The plan is he is going to fund the engine I am going to install it and then we would settle up after is runs. At them moment the biggest issue I have to lack good weather and time to get the engine out. I was hoping to find a drop in so I didn't have to spend a day swapping hardware. I will let this thread rest until we figure out a plan. Now if the hot sticky weather here in NJ would break so I could go out and work on it with out sweating, something might get done.

 

[Scott06]

If you are friends and want to remain friends work it out to get a reman (or rebuild yours) or new base engine vs polishing others turds. When I did mine I got a new base engine, new exhaust, carb. Ok easier for me to say then you guys to spend it .... Yeah I spent more money but in three years I've only put gas and oil in it. I went through the same looking at bobtail engines, but really wasn't much work to swap over all accessories. From what I've seen of your other build shouldn't be more than a day or two if you have the same vintage block.

 

[mr300z87]

So i am not sure if I should just revive this thread or start new, but we pulled the engine out yesterday with plans to install a remanufactured long block. It was a pretty easy job pulling it out. The only real issue I had was one or the rear mounting nuts spun in the cage in the inner transom housing, to get the engine out I had to cut the head off. Not sure how to get the nut and bolt out, was thinking I would try and cut the nut with my dremel and a cut off tool then screw out what's left of the bolt. I do not think bigger cutting tool will fit. I have not had a chance to look closely at it yet. Another bad thought is I am hoping the nut cage in the transom housing isn't destroyed. Here are some pics of progress

dirty old frozen engine waiting to come out

magic flying 350

Dirty empty bilge. You see the port side rear mount bolt still in place. Any recommendation how to go about getting it out.

The best place for a Chevy engine, in the bed of a Dodge!!!

have a great night all

 

[Scott06]

I believe the nut is caged in the transom plate and held in place with friction tape? I would try to jam a big flat head screwdriver in there to keep the nut from turning and use a pipe wrench on what’s left of the bolt to see if you can get it out maybe put a little heat on the nut

 

[Ed Harris]

MR300 you are speaking blasphemy!!!!:laugh: