taking the plunge

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Well, after months of researching, browsing the forums, watching videos, and now being a bonn-ee-fide expert on these things, I think next week will be the start of the rebuild. I currently have a 16 ft 1973 ebbtide lakemaster that is rotten to the core. I have to be carefull where I walk because of the multiple holes in the floor(yes it is that rotten). Next week I will begin tearing out the floor and stringers. I will not be able to put anything back in till spring, but this should give me PLENTY of time to get everything prepped like a champ, and the stringer, and transom templates made. That way hopefully the assembly time will be quicker. The goal is to cut the dual consoles out of the cap, and take the forward insert out. Upon reassembly I will be ATTEMPTING to turn this boat into a center console fishing machine. I will be trying to build in a bait tank into the front deck that i am building and then try to build the console. I want to cut out the back of the cap as well all the way to the transom and build the battery box and I have a 12 gallon metal gas tank that I want to build in to clean everything up. I will be running the electrical through conduits under the floor. I want this to be as clean as possible. At only 16 ft, there is not room to be jacking around with wires and crap hanging everywhere. Want some small fog lights on the top of the console for loading the boat and lighting the inside when I am fishing. The plan is to make this as functional a fishing boat as possible for me. Since 90% of the time I will be by myself in this boat, I will make it work for me and try to make room for others if I can. I will be doing the drivers seat as a cooler seat with the flip back rest, but am undecided for room reasons whether or not to put the other cooler/seat in front of the console that is so standard in these center consoles. I did see a great idea today though. A friend of mine has a center console and when the deck go redone he bolted the console to a piece of board just a little bigger than the console itself and then glassed the board to the deck. This cut down on the number of holes in the deck. I thought it was a good idea. Now the only hole that has to be there is for the conduit where the electrical and steering cables will run.
IMG_1428.JPG123.jpg139.JPG
(to give you an idea.)boat top.jpg
 

tpenfield

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Jul 18, 2011
Messages
18,095
Re: taking the plunge

Subscribing in and looking forward to following along.

My thoughts at this point are:

As you cut the consoles and forward insert out of the cap, make sure to retain the integrity of the cap perimeter by not cutting into the coping areas of the cap, etc.

Go with extra flotation and cockpit bailers on the re-fit.
 

jbcurt00

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 25, 2011
Messages
25,073
Re: taking the plunge

Several great conversions have been done in the past.

Sleeper-6 did an amazing job on his:
Project log : Runabout to Fishing machine


A built-in fuel tank & live well can be challenging to build low in the boat, depends on how your boat is built below decks.

Be aware that a live well can change the handling characteristics of the boat (free surface effect):
full9232bb.gif

And care should be taken to minimize it's impact on your boats stability: Water volume, orientation & location in the boat. All the more important since you'll be using this offshore in the ocean.

Permanent tanks above the deck, but under the splashwell are popular as is moving the tank to up under the covered bow.

If it's got soft spots, better to pull the deck & fully inspect the transom & stringers too, so good plan there. The transom replacement will require the boat's cap to come off the lower hull OR the splashwell to be cut off.

Before you get too far into demo mode, make sure you fully support the hull & transom, you don't want it to move/sag during demo & get glassed back permanently out of shape.

Lots of great info in here, dig into the resto threads, you'll pick up a great deal of info/tips that will help you along.
 

SAT_Bob

Seaman
Joined
Jul 17, 2013
Messages
67
Re: taking the plunge

Nice project. I'll be following along as this is similar to mine. I also want to make mine into more of a fishing boat but not a center console. I mostly bass fish.
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

as far as the cap goes, after i cut out the consoles, I will be using some thin wood to shape the area and then some layers of 1708 to hopefully make the cap look like it was made like that. I am not sure what type of floatation I will be using. They only thing that makes me nervous about the 2 part foam is the way it sucks up and holds water. If some does get in there, then it will suck into that foam and I am right back here in a few years. Any advice on the foam? I was thinking of the sheet foam, but then i thought if i do a good job sealing the hull and the deck, no water should get in in the first place. ideas????
 

jbcurt00

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 25, 2011
Messages
25,073
Re: taking the plunge

Don't think of the foam OR the water as the problem. IMHO, its careless owners, lack of maintenance & storing the boat improperly.

Boats get wet but NEED flotation foam in case of a problem, this is a common conundrum in both fiberglass & tin boat rebuilding.

Until you open up your deck, it's hard to be sure that the foam wasn't necessary to stiffen the hull &/or deck. If it does offer support, you will be hard pressed to do that w/ rigid sheet foam vs pour in.
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

I know that there is a kind of expandable foam under the deck from the holes that are in the deck. you can see the foam underneath it. I am with you on this. I was thinking of it and I think I came to the conclusion that if it had foam in it before, then its probably a better idea to put foam back into it. It will quiet the ride too as an added bonus. I guess if I do a good enough job sealing the floor up then that area under the floor should not be getting wet at all. I guess I just do not want to do this again in a few years because the foam is sucking up water and holding it. Like I said, I am not sure if this is really a problem, because I am really new at this.
 

jbcurt00

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 25, 2011
Messages
25,073
Re: taking the plunge

I guess I just do not want to do this again in a few years because the foam is sucking up water and holding it. Like I said, I am not sure if this is really a problem, because I am really new at this.
Yep ^^ nobody WANTS to do it again on the same boat. Hopefully knowing what can happen when you don't maintain & store your boat properly, and repairing it, will help keep you motivated to take proper steps to protect your investment in materials & time.
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

Well, I started tonight and am committed to it. Everything that was not bolted down in the boat was taken out. I also took off the rub rail and the aluminum rail underneath. The cap is still held on by a bunch of pop rivets all the way around so looks like I will have to drill those out. I junked the back to back seats as they were held together with a frame that I threw together one day, so they do not fold and all the wood on them is pretty rotten anyways. the on board charger that used to be bolted in but the wood that is was bolted to has rotted away was removed with a swift jerk. Tomorrow will be spent taking the wiring out, removing the trolling motor, building a motor stand, removing the motor and removing the wind shield. Hopefully by the weekend I will be ready to drill out the rivets holding the cap on and get that taken off. I was thinking about taking the cap off just to remove the inner insert and then putting it back on and cutting the consoles out but leaving the remainder of the cap on to make sure the hull does not flare when doing work and then I cannot get it back on. What do you guys think. I will get some pictures tomorrow of the boat's before pic before I do anything and then after i get each noticeable thing removed/changed.
 

73Chrysler105

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
Messages
407
Re: taking the plunge

I would leave the cap on cut the consoles and the floor out work on it and work on rebuilding it. You may want to try to do the cap work prior to cutting the floor out too to add some stiffness to the cut areas or at least brace those areas with some 3/4" plywood backer.
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

the plywood backer is a good idea. I will be putting some backer on it anyways when I do the fiberglass fill in so it would not hurt to put some on now at least temporarily. I have to take the cap off though to get to the whole floor. The front section of the boat has an insert that has to be removed but I cannot get to it with the cap on. I will be taking it out permanently as it has the two boxes in front of the consoles as part of it. After I get the insert removed then I can put the cap back on. I guess the alternative would be to cut it out in pieces. Don't know how fond I am of that idea.
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

while sitting around here on the info box, i was thinking about some things. First, as far as the built in bait tank, it really will not be huge. Maybe 30 gallons or so, which i know is alot of weight, but it will be offset(I think) with the addition of some extra flotation foam around the tank, underneath the new casting deck. Also, a question. I have attached a pic of a 73 Ebbtide. The rear has a small "deck" that I want to cut out to build a box that goes the width of the boat for battery, gas tank, and storage. The question is this. Is that deck critical to the structural integrity of the boat as far as the supporting the motor goes? I do not want to take it out if it is going to rip the back half of the boat apart when I take off. If it is not, then that is good, but if so, then is there any other way to support that weight than with this deck. Just trying to decide on the design in the back. Also trying to decide the best place for a thru hull pump to fill the bait tank. I was thinking of running a section of pvc from the transom to the front deck. Not sure of how to drain it though without adding ANOTHER piece of pvc back to the transom for the drain and just using a plug. The other option is to build in a second pump into the filter box and plumb it to pump the water out the side of the boat. Any thoughts?
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

just so you know what I am talking about with the rear deck, here is a pic of the boat I was supposed to attach to the previous post
IMAG0361s.jpg
 

jbcurt00

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 25, 2011
Messages
25,073
Re: taking the plunge

You want to cut the splashwell off from infront of the motor & build a platform to cover the battery, fuel & etc? Splashwells keep water from coming over the transom INTO the boat. And it gives the motor's powerhead somewhere to BE when raised (tilted) & not in use.

I don't know if Ebbtide made the entire structure to aid in support of & transmission of the OB's energy thru the hull, but I suspect SOME portion of it does both. If you remove it, I'd be sure to put back something that offered additonal support to the transom & the hull sides......

Look up livewell & baitwell installation instructions. Water from OUT of the boat in, often passive fill from a forward facing thru hull fitting or a pump (w/ strainer) and a drain OUT of the boat. The longer the hoses & the more fittings required, the more opportunity to spring a leak. Running PVC forward, I'm guessing you plan to change the layout at the front of the boat to include the bait well. I wouldn't run hard pipe in a small boat w/ a large baitwell (30gal sounds like a LARGE baitwell) except where I had to, like into & out of the tank & the hull. All else flexible, reinforced (to reduce the chance of a collapse) hoses.

Google both:

Free water effect

free surface effect

Large volumes of a liquid in a boat can be problematic, esp if placed above the center of gravity or the center of buoyancy.

BTW: many baitwells keep the bait alive & doing well much better when there are NO hard corners on the interior, round only.............

As you move stuff around & remove the boats original structure, keep weight balance in mind as you add additional weight (bait/livewells, permanent fuel tanks) and build new structure. Moving the batteries is a way to counteract any changes that affect the boat' s balance fore & aft but side to side as well...............
 

maryhannaj

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Sep 22, 2013
Messages
422
Re: taking the plunge

Hey bigmaac73. Welcome to the community. Would you mind if I follow along and maybe help out somewhere if I can? I'm just learning myself as well, but who knows, I might be able to throw something your way.
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

Hey bigmaac73. Welcome to the community. Would you mind if I follow along and maybe help out somewhere if I can? I'm just learning myself as well, but who knows, I might be able to throw something your way.

I would not mind at all, actually quite the opposite, I would encourage it. I need all the help that I can get.

The plan is to build the bait tank in the front,( i say small tank, because I typically use an external 40 gallon round tank) into a deck I will also be building up front. I know all about keeping bait alive so the design of the tank is not an issue as much as the placement. I will be making it round and low as I can to the floor while still having the amount of space I want. Performance of the boat is not a big thing, as I rarely travel far in the water to fish. Most of my time is spend drifting and anchored up. Interior space to work is what I am after. The space underneath the front deck and around the tank will be filled with flotation foam. These are two chamber tanks much like the design of a super bait tank. If removing the rear deck is an option(maybe not the splash guard in the center as much as the two small surfaces on either side) I want to build a box on either side of the splash well and house the engine start battery, fuel tank, trim motor, and if I can fit it, an anchor. There will be another two batteries under the center console. One for the trolling motor and one to run all accessories. I cannot have the console be very wide, because the boat is not as big as I would like. I am just trying to make this a more functional fishing boat. I do alot of striper and trophy catfishing and really need a center console for the way I fish but do not have the 5 grand or more to throw at a new to me boat. I have looked for ever for a hull that would fit my needs, but I find that if the motor is bad, most of the time the hull/deck is as well. I cannot find a hull that I can just put my motor on, so I am making the boat that I want since my deck is rotten anyways.
 
Last edited:

maryhannaj

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Sep 22, 2013
Messages
422
Re: taking the plunge

Ok. Thanks. I was looking at the pic of your boat. Now please keep in mind that I am no expert with boat hull performane and design. But I like to kind of try to envision things through modification if that makes any sense. I can picture the way I would try it if it were my project.

As Jbcurt00 mentioned in reference to your splashwell and stern area modification, cutting the structure away without replacement just doesn't seem like it would be very wise for your safety. Im not trying to lecture either, I promise. However, I think there is a way to accomplish what you want with a good end result and have what you want for storage space back there as well. This is all very hard to describe without being able to draw a pic for you but if you don't mind long winded post, I don't mind posting one.
It's my opinion that by cutting out the sides of the splashwell will weaken the necessary structure to keep your motor solid during acceleration. Try and imagine that when you accelerate, the force of the foot on your motor is not only pushing the boat forward, but it is also trying it's hardest to peel itself free of the transom on the top of the boat. The way I picture it, is that the powerhead is really being forced in the opposite direction of where your trying to go. Once you get onto a plane, the reverse forces relax a bit but they are still there and increase even more through a powered turn.
So by cutting away the sides around your splashwell, you are removing what looks to be at least 2/3 of your supporting structure. I feel as though what would eventually or even suddenly happen is that your motor would roll itself backwards pulling the remaining peice of the splashwell with it.:eek: It would then become barnicle housing or something like that.
I can't tell from the angle of your pic if the forward edge of you splashwell is enclosed or not. If it isn't, use that to your advantage. If it is in fact open, extend it forward a bit. Bring it toward your "to be" center column about 12 to 16 inches or so. Yes you will loose some walking space down in the deeper portion of the hull but you could use the raised space as a casting deck, a pedestal seat mount and a space to mount some downriggers as well. At the same time, you are actually strengthening the splashwell/transom area, strengthening the cap from port to starboard side, eliminating even more area were the water loves to jump in onto the floor through deceleration and creating a whole lot of storage space underneath.
I believe your plan was to run the controls, wiring, etc... beneath the floor as well. If you chose to try something along this route, this would also leave you more area to access your controls and stuff without working inside of a completely enclosed conduit or digging back into your floor in the case that some issue comes up.
Now try to visulize this as if you were looking underneath of the deck platform toward the transom. Now split the platform storage area into three seperate areas. This is where you would extend two supports from the forward most underside of the platform down to the existing floor. One on each side of the keel access area(assuming you will have one there). Now run a board from just one of the supports all of the way back to your transom and attach it there. You now have two unevenly seperated compartments. I feel this is necessary to completely seperate your fuel cell from any electrical components. Use the smaller enclosed area to bolt your fuel cell down to the floor. On the furthest part of the other side, mount your starting and trolling motor batteries next to each other closely in trays as if they were being joined into a parallel or series. Leave the center most area open to allow easy acces to a underfloor stern keel acces panel. Now just build a hinged panel that you can lift upward to access all of your stern storage space at once. In your lift panel, just install a small vent on each side to allow some air into and out of your fuel and battery compartments.

Ok. Here's where it really gets crazy. For your center console. Completly brace your cap from side to side and top to bottom with some 1x2s around the area of your existing consoles. Try so dang hard not to let them shift. Now right where the outcropping portion of the consoles are, use a router to as closely and flush with the sides where they attach to the cap and parallel with the floor, cut them free leaving the base of the consoles intact. If what I am seeing in the pic is correct, you just gained about a foot of free space on each side and just forward of where your new center console will be.
Use a section of 3/8 inch plywood, properly treated by the advice of one of the more knowledgeable members of the community, to run behind the area of the cut-out space on the sides of your cap and glass it in properly. If it were me, I would make sure that length of the cap side plywood extended a good 16 inches or so beyond both sides of the area that had been removed. Just for structural support. In my mind, doing this will replace the flex and bow resistance, and the rigidity of the area where the consoles were removed. Try when you remove the consoles to leave them as intact as possible so you can use them together to build your new console panel.
Now build your box base for your console with the forward edges of the base cornering into where the back edges of where the walk through starts. Attach and glass your base into the existing structure of where your walk through began. Now you have an open space in front of the console without doing any more cutting on the hull.
Next you could just take the two old console sections and peice them together. Trim them to fit together, build a solid backing board, attach each side to the backing board, fill the area where they come together and put a layer of glass over the entire top area of your panel to completly seal them together, re-punch your steering column hole and your guages and switch mount holes. Then mount the steering panel to the top of the base box. If you wanted glass, with a bit of ingenuity, I bet you could peice your existing peices of glass and channel together for a small windshield as well.
Now once again, this is obviously all from my point of view. I personally would convert the entire area forward of the front edge of the console into a deck as well. You don't loose any walking room and you add covered storage space beneath the deck. Maybe again, mount a pedestal seat up front as well and some storage space on each side of your bait well.
This bait well idea is kind of back yard I guess but I kinda like it and I think it would work too. Go to the store and buy a big old rectangular cooler. Completely foam in and seal off the drain hole. Punch one hole quite close to the top of the cooler for your fresh water earator line inlet and then another larger diameter hole at the opposite end and about 2 or 3 inches lower for your overflow releif drain. Somewhere on the transom in an area that will always be beneath the waterline, punch a hole for your aerator pump suction inlet. Properly seal your transom inside of the area that you drilled out for the pump inlet to go through so that water does not get into the transom core material. Install the aerator pump and plumb your your water line through a keel access panel area up to your bait well will be. Now cut a hole in your forward deck the right dimensions for the cooler to drop down into and secure the cooler to the floor and flush with the forward deck right in front of the console and into the same space where the walk through used to be. Now plumb your aerator inlet into the cooler upper hole.
From the lower, larger diameter hole in the cooler, plumb another water line out to a hole through the side of the hull in an area that will stay above the waterline under normal floating conditions. This will allow water to be pumped it at a continuous rate yet also just overflow and dump overboard. That's how the livewells work on my boat. Seal it all up real good so water isn't just being pumped from the outside of the boat and leaking down somewhere inside of the boat. Now you have a bait well in the front deck. It's already insulated for you and even has some built in flotation.

You've maybe guessed by now that I'm a bass boat guy. I just thought I would try and explain to you the way I can envision it from my point of view and from seeing the pic of your boat. I'm not sure if I made any sense, or if I did, it's even a plan of sorts that would fit your own personal needs. If not, it was fun trying to figure out how to write it all out anyways!:)
Whichever route you decide to go with it, you are in the right place to find the right answers for any questions that you may have to help you through your new project. The guys and gals of this community are very knowledgeable and eager to help out where they can.
Welcome again and good luck to ya!
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

I have envisioned the rear of the boat looking much like the one built in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRupg3kFyfI
this guy builds his own and the layout is pretty much what I want, only with a slightly larger front deck with tank, and no front cooler.
 

bigmaac73

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
45
Re: taking the plunge

well, bad news, actually good news for me. I crunched the numbers and found I was going to spend upwards of a grand or a little more. I was really not looking forward to this, so I started looking for another hull and hit the jackpot. Found a 20ft sea ox for less than I was going to spend on the rebuild. The hull, floors and transom are all solid so i went for it. Looks like this rebuild is not going to happen. I am stoked about the new boat so now the swap begins. Got to get all my stuff over to the new boat.
 

jbcurt00

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 25, 2011
Messages
25,073
Re: taking the plunge

The hull, floors and transom are all solid so i went for it. Looks like this rebuild is not going to happen. I am stoked about the new boat so now the swap begins. Got to get all my stuff over to the new boat.

Once you've got it home, confirm all the wood's really solid as it appears & start sorting out the stuff to be swapped.

Good luck w/ the new project...............
 
Top