Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Originally posted by POINTER94:<br /> Again, not true. There were several members of a certain racial community who suggested Bush was slow in responding so more people would die. This is the same type of people who posted the above mis-quotes in the link.

okay. let me clarify. You are the first and only iboater to suggest that Bush killed people.<br /><br />So, bluffing about the context, were we?<br />I'll take your silence on the "word games" question to mean agreement.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

The complete context was supplied in my first post.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Originally posted by POINTER94:<br /> The complete context was supplied in my first post.

this one?<br />"Bush said he didn't expect the levies to be breached,................................................ they expected them to be washed over as they were not designed for a category five hurricane and the storm surge was predicted to overwhelm/overwash the levies, not breech them."<br /><br />Bush didn't say any of that, apart from "didn't expect the levies to be breached," those are your words. <br /><br />The context was, he was asked to comment on criticism of the federal relief effort.<br /><br />Would he really respond to criticism of the federal relief effort by claiming advance knowlege that the storm would exceed the levees' design capacity, resulting in extensive flooding?

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Staying On-Message and Anti-Bush <br />In 1992 Hurricane Andrew swept over Florida. Not long after the governor (Jeb Bush's Democrat predecessor) complained to the media that the federal government was being slow to respond. This got the headlines. The fact that the governor was slow to request aid was relegated to the bottom of an inside page. This added to the perception that G. W. H. Bush was aloof and out-of-touch and contributed to his defeat that November.<br /><br />I doubt that any Democratic operatives have forgotten this. They have been working overtime, with some success, to create the same impression about G. W. Bush and Katrina. Even before the floodwaters started rising in New Orleans, the far left was blaming Bush. At that point, the best that they could come up with was global warming. If Bush had only joined Kyoto a few months earlier then the oceans would have cooled and the storm would have been a gentle breeze.<br /><br />Next they started insisting that Iraq had drained so many troops from the National Guard that they were unable to respond to a domestic crisis. This had as much basis as the global warming theory - none.<br /><br />Then they struck paydirt. Bush had cut funds for levee work. It didn't matter that this would have been a 20-40 year plan that could not possibly have made a difference so soon or that the levee that failed was upgraded just this Summer. They had something that they could pin on Bush.<br /><br />Things got even better when the Mayor of New Orleans started complaining about the slowness of relief workers. It didn't matter that his police force had lost control of the city and that relief workers had turned back in the face of gunfire. It also didn't matter that the Governor of Louisiana had been reluctant to authorize federal control. She worried (with cause) that once the feds took over they would blame the current mess on the state and local authorities (the ones in charge to that point).<br /><br />So far most of the MSM has taken the lazy route and followed the Democrat's pre-written storyline. There has been a lot of coverage that Bush cut levee funds. Much less covered is that presidents have been cutting levee funds since Jimmy Carter. Also not reported is that there was a floodgate project proposed in 1977 that would have made the levees proof against a Category 5 storm. This was stopped by environmentalists.<br /><br />Here is one timeline supporting the left's storyline. While much of it is accurate, it has some significant omissions. Bush declared a state of emergency on Saturday, August 27 and was urging residents to evacuate on Sunday, August 28.<br /><br />Democrats are also playing "gotcha", trying to find quotes that prove people knew that the levees would fail. This is an example: the Think Progress timeline has this headline, "LOUISIANA NEWSPAPER SIGNALS LEVEES MAY GIVE". If you read the linked story you find that what it really says is:<br /><br />Forecasters feared Sunday afternoon that storm driven waters will lap over the New Orleans levees when monster Hurricane Katrina pushes past the Crescent City tomorrow.<br /><br />Â&#147;Some levees in the Greater New Orleans area could be overtopped,Â&#148; he said.<br /><br />The model showed a storm surge of as much as 16 feet moving up the Mississippi River and topping levees in Chalmette and New Orleans. High water flowing from Lake Pontchartrain through St. Charles Parish would also flood over levees into Kenner.<br /><br />I hope I don't have to explain the difference between a storm surge coming over the top of a levee and a levee collapsing.<br /><br /><br /> http://marks-truths.blogspot.com/ <br /><br /><br />

I hope I don't have to explain the difference between a storm surge coming over the top of a levee and a levee collapsing.

Yes, yes you do..

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Here's some more.<br /><br />It turns out, Bush cannot possibly be blamed for the flooding in New Orleans. The section of levee that gave way was renovated just this Summer. It was thick cement instead of packed earth. The engineers in charge admit that this was the section they thought was least likely to fail.<br /><br /><br />Worse for the editorial writers were statements by the chief engineer of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, Lt. Gen Carl Strock: "I don't see that the level of funding was really a contributing factor in this case. Had this project been fully complete, it is my opinion that based on the intensity of this storm that the flooding of the business district and the French Quarter would have still taken place."

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

I'll take your silence on the "word games" to mean you now understand.

 

[mrbscott19]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

My post wasn't about the Bush quote. That just happens to be #1. The one that bothered me the most is Tom Delay trying to get some kids to say that they're having fun at the astrodome. What kind of sick person would say that after what has happened?<br /><br />And yes, all 25 are from conservatives, with sources. So say they are half-truths or whatever all you want. The sources are listed in the link. I can't wait to see the photo op of Bush sitting on the porch of Lott's new house.<br /><br />Another thing about this whole ordeal is that it took Congress 5 days to show up and get the emergency funding for NO. It took them a day to interfere for Terri Schiavo.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

You don't have to convince me that Bush isn't responsible for the disaster. I don't think you have to convince any iboaters of that, but I can't speak for all.<br /><br />Also I am familiar with the difference between breach and overflow.<br /><br />The statement at hand, in response to criticism of the federal relief effort, "I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees."<br /><br />My point, in the words of FEMA director Brown, "Hurricane Katrina caused the same kind of damage that we anticipated," (see below).<br /><br />The damage was anticipated; therefore the failure to anticipate an actual breech is irrelevant in the context in which it was spoken, i.e., as a reason for any delay (either real or perceived) in providing services.<br /><br />This is what qualifies that statement as a press conference faux pax. Not that it was false, just that it didn't apply in the situation.<br /><br />________________________________________<br /><br />from cnn.com Agencies drilled for 'worst-case scenario' <br /><br />[participants in the 2004 hurricane prep exercise discussed below included the National Weather Service and FEMA]<br /><br />

A fictional Category 3 Hurricane Pam, with "winds of 120 mph, up to 20 inches of rain... and a storm surge that topped the levees," was the picture presented to officials from 50 federal, local and volunteer organizations, according to a Federal Emergency Management Agency dispatch from July 23, 2004.<br />...<br />"Hurricane Katrina caused the same kind of damage that we anticipated," [FEMA director] Brown said Wednesday. "So we planned for it two years ago. Last year, we exercised it. And unfortunately this year, we're implementing it."<br />

btw, I won't accept any left-wing blog as credible source, nor will I accept any right-wing blog either. Note I'm not telling you not to cite them, just saying, they don't carry credibility with me.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Jtexas,<br /><br />What part do you not understand. The levies were expected fail during the storm. They failed AFTER the storm had passed. They failed AFTER the storm had passed and the greatest pressure had passed and they supressed the storm surge. Therefor his statement that a levie which had just been upgraded that year, was not expected to fail (breached) makes perfect sense. What is so difficult about this. They handled the storm itself. The newest and hopefully strongest area of the levie gave way. Does this not surprise you? <br /><br />The quote is intentionally misleading.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

sorry, I know I can be dense sometimes, thanks for being patient with me.<br /><br />I do understand that Bush's statement was not incorrect. <br /><br />What I don't understand is, since the actual damage equalled the predicted damage, how did the failure to predict a breach explain a delay in providing relief services? <br /><br />I mean, what difference did it make whether the flooding came over the wall or through the wall, it was the same damage as what FEMA was expecting.<br /><br />After the surge or during the surge, it was the same damage as what FEMA was expecting. Even if there is a difference between overtop-related flooding and breach-related flooding, the level of destruction was anticipated. <br /><br />So how did the fact that they expected the damage to be from over-top related flooding instead of breach-related flooding affect the federal relief effort?<br /><br />That's the part I don't understand.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Originally posted by mrbscott19:<br /> <br />And yes, all 25 are from conservatives, with sources.

beg to differ, mrscottb, #10 is a journalist (presumably liberal) and #25 is dem gov Blanco.<br /><br />but I agree with 100%, that Delay quote is just shameful, and the comment about Trent Lott's beach house was just downright insensitive.<br /><br />as much as I respect Barbara Bush, she should be ashamed of what she said.

 

[BrettNC]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Don't even bother with it Pointer. All they have is a bunch out of context quotes and jokes. That's it. That's all they have to stand on. It's pathetic and very weak. Don't waste your time on it.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Jtx,<br /><br />Lets say you flush the toilet. But you quickly recognize the water isn't going down. Now my wife and yours decorated this bathroom so there is about ten tons of decorative soaps, figurines, handtowels, kleenex, and one copy of boating magazine on top of the toilet tank. No way you will be able to get to it in time. So you sit and watch as the water fills up. Then through good clean living and the grace of god, it stops within a centimeter of top. You count your good luck and grab a cold one to wait while is slowly goes down. On the way to the refrig, the toilet bowl breaks and spills water all over the place.<br /><br />What did you do wrong? Was it the design or the construction of the toilet that failed? Do you tell your wife that the toilet overflowed? Do you tell her that it failed? Would it be more expected that the toilet would overflow or collapse? When your wife says "you overflowed the toilet"? You respond by saying what? Maybe something like, I was really surprised when the stupid thing shattered. And if so, does even saying it shattered make you an idiot?

 

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

You must've been in my house.<br /><br />But I still haven't explained myself very well. Mind if take one more stab at it? I'm not blaming the president. I'm not even saying there was any avoidable delay in relief. I'm just saying his answer didn't address the question.<br /><br />I like your analogy, here's how I see it:<br /><br />Let's say I had been to HD last month & took a seminar in toilet bowl management. Let's say they covered toilet bowl overflow remediation and clean-up.<br /><br />Let's further say that my wife was out of town when the incident occurred, so I decided to put off cleaning up the mess until tomorrow.<br /><br />Then the wife gets home unexpectedly next day before I get around to it. She says, why didn't you clean this up yesterday?<br /><br />I say, "At HD they only covered clean-up of water resulting from overflow, not breakage."

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

And the reason they only covered clean up resulting from overflow is because it would be completely unexpected to have the unit break. Hence, the context of Bush's comment. That is why I say it is a quote taken out of context and used to embarrass him. My comment is that the presidents comment wasn't stupid. The consequences of the failure were catastrophic. But as this is a debate about stupid comments it is my contention that when put in the correct context the presidents statement wasn't stupid. The ramifications of the type of failure not withstanding.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

It's the same. It doesn't matter where the water came from, we knew it was coming, and how much of it was coming. Furthermore we knew what to do about it. The source didn't hinder any effort at cleaning up the floor and drying out the carpet, or of delivering supplies.<br /><br />In the context in which it was uttered, the President's comment was stupid.

 

[cbnoodles]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Any idiot, yes, I said IDIOT, who believes this catasptrophe can be laid at Bush's feet oughta be drawn and quartered. NO is 300+ years old and has been below sea level since its establishment. That it was founded there is astonishing. The fact that people actually lend any credence to the view any single administration can be held accountable for this is as absurd as any cr*p I've ever read or heard. Wake up.

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

Ya know what gets me? It's the fact that the democrats and so-called mainstream press are FAR more concerned with trying to makin Bush look bad than they are with actually helping the people who really need it. This political game makes me vomit. The Louisiana government dropped the ball, plain and simple, and being the leftists they are, they can't ake responsibility. Why do you folks continue to spew forth the filth of the left's party line? I propose it's because to you, it's far more important to promote the left's agenda than it is to actually deal with the problems at hand. What a bunch of CRAP. You are hypoctrites and I believe you don't really give a damn at all about your fellow man.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

What's up with that, dogsdad, why you need to resort to name-calling and "you don't give a damn," and what other people are concerned about? "filth of the left's party line." <br /><br />Where's all this hostility coming from? Am I naive to think that there are actually some Republicans in America who think Mr. Bush makes mistakes, especially when speaking in front of a microphone?

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Stupid Quotes about Hurricane Katrina

No "need" other than to call a spade a spade.<br /><br />Sir, I'd say your side has the explaining to do. It's obvious as hell to me that there's only one thing that matters to the left, and that is POWER. And it is also obvious to me that from the left's perspective, the end justifies the means---and that's classic marxist doctrine. Damn, I am surprised...NOT.<br /><br />Would I claim Bush has made no mistakes? No. But you people want to make an impeachment issue out of anything that the media can spin into an alleged "mistake." For that reason, we'll give you NOT AN INCH.<br /><br />There are marxist paradises al over Europe. I suggest that you who are so intent on hioghjacking America just forget it, and emigrate---like so many of you promised in 2000 and 2004.