Opinion and religion.

mikeandronda

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 13, 2003
Messages
1,888
Re: Opinion and religion.

Well Snapper Im gonna pray that we do see you there. :) And a pleasent evening to you too
 

LubeDude

Admiral
Joined
Oct 8, 2003
Messages
6,945
Re: Opinion and religion.

Mikeandronda has made it as clear as it could be made. Jesus Christ fullfilled every single prophesy in the old testament about the coming savior, the exact # skips my mind, but it was everyone to the "T". Jesus himself said, "Knowone gets to the Father except by me". I believe it, That settles it for me.
 

1730V

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Feb 14, 2004
Messages
563
Re: Opinion and religion.

Amen. BTW there is a big diffrence between religion and faith.
 

rolmops

Vice Admiral
Joined
Feb 24, 2002
Messages
5,342
Re: Opinion and religion.

yes 12footer that was the one.I was just doing some friendly teasing.
 

mellowyellow

Vice Admiral
Joined
Jun 8, 2002
Messages
5,327
Re: Opinion and religion.

good question rolmops. perhaps it's human nature<br />to internalize everthing in life and put it into<br />human terms. heck, we even though the earth was<br />the center of the universe for thousands of years.<br />when astronomers learned this was incorrect, it<br />was blasphemy.<br />personally I believe the more you learn, the more<br />you realize you have absolutely no clue in this world...
 

aspeck

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
May 29, 2003
Messages
18,705
Re: Opinion and religion.

rolmops, I don't believe it was God's intention to ever "hide" from His people. He DOES want us to understand Him - that is why He gave us the Bible. How much we read, study, pray, and are OPEN to what He teaches us is up to US.<br /><br />I wish I had all the answers, but I do not. However, I try to remain open to all views, sort through them, pray, and sometimes, on further review, I have to eat my words and admit I was wrong.<br /><br />I don't think we will ever know everything (till we meet Him face to face), but till then, I will be seeking, and hopefully learning, to understand Him more nad more.<br /><br />I know that doesn't answer your question completely, rolmops, but for me, with what has been said already, that is the best I can do. I am a human trying to understand the divine. I understand more of God's attributes, His mercy, His love, and His will for my life than I did 10 years ago, but with everything I learn, I realize there is so much more I do not know.<br /><br />I do have some strong convictions about God's will for my life, this country, etc. Some may be proved wrong over time, but I would rather aim at something, then just shoot blindly. However, I must also be willing to adjust my aim, if, and when, I understand His Word better.
 

Mrs Soulwinner

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Oct 18, 2004
Messages
221
Re: Opinion and religion.

Originally posted by rolmops:<br />
My question is this: How can anyone justify himself claiming that this or that way is part of the Greater plan. How often is it a way of justifying oneself and how often is it used for ulterior purposes?
IMHO I do not believe that any one person or even domination knows the greater plan. I do know that we are all called to repent. Christ came that we may have everlasting life. <br /><br />Luke 5:32 I am not come to call the righteous but sinners to repentance.<br />2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some count slackness; but is longsuffering to you-ward, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.<br /><br />But not all in this life are going to choose that path. <br /><br />Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in by the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many are they that enter in thereby. 14 For narrow is the gate, and straitened the way, that leadeth unto life, and few are they that find it. <br /><br />Our example from life must not be taken from the multitude; we are to look straight to Jesus for our example. We are to try to become as He is. How do we do that? By renewing our hearts and minds daily. Reading the Word keeps us in close relationship with our Lord and the closer you are, the more you will receive the truth. The more you are willing to be used by Him, the more He is willing to use you.<br /><br />Romans 12:2 And be not fashioned according to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.<br /><br />Do I believe you can know the will of G-d? Yes, I certainly do. Why? Because the Bible tells us what the will of G-d is. Start off with the basic foundation, the Ten Commandments: <br /><br />Exodus 20:1 And God spake all these words, saying, 2 I am Jehovah thy God, who brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. 3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me. 4 Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them, for I Jehovah thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, upon the third and upon the fourth generation of them that hate me, 6 and showing lovingkindness unto thousands of them that love me and keep my commandments. 7 Thou shalt not take the name of Jehovah thy God in vain; for Jehovah will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain. 8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work; 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath unto Jehovah thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy man-servant, nor thy maid-servant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11 for in six days Jehovah made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore Jehovah blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. 12 Honor thy father and thy mother, that thy days may be long in the land which Jehovah thy God giveth thee. 13 Thou shalt not kill. 14 Thou shalt not commit adultery. 15 Thou shalt not steal. 16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor. 17 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife, nor his man-servant, nor his maid-servant, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor anything that is thy neighbor's.<br /><br />And from the NT, Jesus Himself tells us that He came to fulfill the law, not destroy it. Matthew 5:17 & Matthew 5:18 <br /><br />This law is to remain and by looking to Jesus, we can find the way to better keep these laws. Jesus is loving, merciful, long-suffering, etc….we are told what we are to become as we receive the truth; that is to be more like Him. How are you to receive the Truth if you do not read the Truth?<br /><br />Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 meekness, self-control; against such there is no law. 24 And they that are of Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with the passions and the lusts thereof. 25 If we live by the Spirit, by the Spirit let us also walk.<br /><br />When we decide that we are not going to be lead by the Spirit, we are prone to give in to the desires of this world. It’s inevitable. We are sinful by nature and that nature tends run as it pleases should we not be lead by the Spirit. IMHO, I believe that is when the Word gets distorted and then is used to become someone’s justification. We all want to believe we are good and that what we are doing is right and good. Everyone has their ‘good intentions’ but even our best is nothing when compared to what we are called to do; which is to repent, keep His commandments, be lead by the Spirit and love Him with all are heart, minds and souls. <br /><br />Matthew 22:37 And he said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second like unto it is this, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. 40 On these two commandments the whole law hangeth, and the prophets. <br /><br />G-d gave us free will to enable us to make our own choices. Because He so loves, He would never force us to worship and love Him. Just as we cannot make our children love us, He will not make you love Him.<br /><br />He has given His promises for those who choose to love, worship and follow His commandments, i.e…..<br /><br /> Deuteronomy 28:1 And it shall come to pass, if thou shalt hearken diligently unto the voice of Jehovah thy God, to observe to do all his commandments which I command thee this day, that Jehovah thy God will set thee on high above all the nations of the earth: 2 and all these blessings shall come upon thee, and overtake thee, if thou shalt hearken unto the voice of Jehovah thy God. (It then goes on to list blessings that will come upon you for keep all His commandments)<br /><br />He has also listed the things that will come upon you should you choose the way of this world. <br /><br />Deuteronomy 28:15 But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of Jehovah thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day, that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee. (It then goes on to list curses that will come upon you for not keeping all His commandments)<br /><br />I know that there are those out there that will argue that this is OT teachings, but remember, Jesus Himself said He did not come to destroy the law, but to fulfill it. The laws of the OT are quoted several times in the NT. Not to mention in Revelation, He speaks of those who have kept all of His commandments.<br /><br />Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.<br /><br />Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that wash their robes, that they may have the right to come to the tree of life, and may enter in by the gates into the city.<br /><br />You will find people that take special care in small matters, and neglect the things which matter the very most; the basic foundational teachings. When we are faithful in the keeping our promises of obedience to Him, He will surely come, because he has promised: and neither sooner nor later than he has promised. <br /><br />Do I believe there are people that use the bible to their advantage? To justify their own actions and nature? IMHO, Yes! Jesus tells us that there will be deceivers and trials and tribulation. But when you know who you are and what you are in Christ, you have the ability to be lead by the Spirit and not give into the deception of this world. I know that as a Christian decides to walk with & work for the Lord, it becomes a battle. You will know when someone is trying to justify their actions.....hold it up to the Truth, the Word! He will tell you.<br /><br />Ephesians 6:12 For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood, but against the principalities, against the powers, against the world-rulers of this darkness, against the spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.<br /><br />I do not believe that G-d sends trials and tribulations in life, because He sent His only begotten Son so that we can have the promises. I believe the Lord allows things to happen in our life, such as with Job, which allows His people to be brought forth, strengthened and used to bring glory to His name. He will only allow in your life what He already knows you are able to handle. Having faith is the key. I also believe that the Lord does allow us to reap what we sow. Follow this world and you get what this world offers. Follow Christ and you will get what He offers.<br /><br />Matthew 18:7 Woe unto the world because of occasions of stumbling! for it must needs be that the occasions come; but woe to that man through whom the occasion cometh! 1 <br /><br />Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also factions among you, that they that are approved may be made manifest among you.<br /><br />1 Corinthians 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as man can bear: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation make also the way of escape, that ye may be able to endure it.<br /><br />During those times you have to have that faith in Him and know your promises. Look to Him not this world. (Psalm 118:8 It is better to take refuge in Jehovah than to put confidence in man.) How can you receive what He has promised & know His will if you don’t read and know what that is?<br /><br />Matthew 17:20 And he saith unto them, Because of your little faith: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.<br /><br />Hebrews 10:36 For ye have need of patience, that, having done the will of God, ye may receive the promise.<br /><br />Throughout the bible it tells us what G-d’s will is and it tells you what you will receive by doing His will. You just have to make up your mind (and heart) that you will be faithful, patience and willing to do it when He speaks to your heart. Listen to your Spirit….He makes intercession for us and helps where we lack. <br /><br />Galatians 1:3 Grace to you and peace from God the Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ,4 who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us out of this present evil world, according to the will of our God and Father: to whom be the glory for ever and ever. Amen.<br /><br />Romans 8:27 and he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.<br /><br />1 Thessalonians 4:3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye abstain from fornication; 4 that each one of you know how to possess himself of his own vessel in sanctification and honor, 5 not in the passion of lust, even as the Gentiles who know not God; 6 that no man transgress, and wrong his brother in the matter: because the Lord is an avenger in all these things, as also we forewarned you and testified. 7 For God called us not for uncleanness, but in sanctification. 8 Therefore he that rejecteth, rejecteth not man, but God, who giveth his Holy Spirit unto you. 9 But concerning love of the brethren ye have no need that one write unto you: for ye yourselves are taught of God to love one another; 10 for indeed ye do it toward all the brethren that are in all Macedonia. But we exhort you, brethren, that ye abound more and more; 11 and that ye study to be quiet, and to do your own business, and to work with your hands, even as we charged you; 12 that ye may walk becomingly toward them that are without, and may have need of nothing.<br /><br />1 Thessalonians 5:9 For God appointed us not into wrath, but unto the obtaining of salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. 11 Wherefore exhort one another, and build each other up, even as also ye do. 12 But we beseech you, brethren, to know them that labor among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you; 13 and to esteem them exceeding highly in love for their work's sake. Be at peace among yourselves. 14 And we exhort you, brethren, admonish the disorderly, encourage the fainthearted, support the weak, be longsuffering toward all. 15 See that none render unto any one evil for evil; but always follow after that which is good, one toward another, and toward all. 16 Rejoice always; 17 pray without ceasing; 18 in everything give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus to you-ward. 19 Quench not the Spirit; 20 despise not prophesyings; 21 prove all things; hold fast that which is good; 22 abstain from every form of evil. 23 And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24 Faithful is he that calleth you, who will also do it.<br /><br />1 Peter 2:15 For so is the will of God, that by well-doing ye should put to silence the ignorance of foolish men: 1 Peter 2:16 as free, and not using your freedom for a cloak of wickedness, but as bondservants of God. 17 Honor all men. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the king. 18 Servants, be in subjection to your masters with all fear; not only to the good and gentle, but also to the froward. 19 For this is acceptable, if for conscience toward God a man endureth griefs, suffering wrongfully. 20 For what glory is it, if, when ye sin, and are buffeted for it, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye shall take it patiently, this is acceptable with God. 21 For hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, that ye should follow his steps: 22 who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth: 23 who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously: 24 who his own self bare our sins in his body upon the tree, that we, having died unto sins, might live unto righteousness; by whose stripes ye were healed.<br /><br />IMHO I do not believe that we will ever be able to find that person or church or organization that has it correct. We are human. The only way we will ever know the truth is to turn to the Truth……Jesus! He is the Way, the Truth and the Light. Ask with an honest heart and He will be faithfully to give the answer. It may not be the answer you wanted to hear, but it will be the Truth!<br /> :D :D
 

mellowyellow

Vice Admiral
Joined
Jun 8, 2002
Messages
5,327
Re: Opinion and religion.

aspeck says:<br />"I wish I had all the answers, but I do not. However, I try to remain open to all views, sort through them, pray, and sometimes, on further review, I have to eat my words and admit I was wrong"<br /><br />I am so impressed sir!<br />u have the right combo to actually touch folks<br />IMHO aspeck. MY even more proud of the work u's<br />doing brother...
 

mellowyellow

Vice Admiral
Joined
Jun 8, 2002
Messages
5,327
Re: Opinion and religion.

if u only had the faith of a mustard seed!<br /><br />many talk the talk, but few walk the walk IMHO.<br />and it has NOTHING to do with religion! it's<br />all about(real)faith.<br />keep on creating Aspeck ;)
 

Rudderman

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jan 14, 2004
Messages
283
Re: Opinion and religion.

As a christian myself, I find it hard to understand how some people who claim to be christians just totally disregard what it says in the bible. Their actions are totally different to their stated beliefs. Whatever happened to "thou shalt not kill", "turning the other cheek" and stuff like that? These days it seems that we all pick out the bits that are easy for us to live with and just disregard the rest.
 

LadyFish

Admiral
Joined
Mar 18, 2003
Messages
6,894
Re: Opinion and religion.

Rudderman, I totally agree. And, you might as well throw in "Thou shall not stand in judgment". I see this one abused the most. Mainly by religious extremists. It makes no sense to me.
 

Barlow

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 11, 2003
Messages
1,794
Re: Opinion and religion.

Papa always told me ... <br /><br />"If ya want to get along with folks ... NEVER discuss religion or politics!"<br /><br /><br />a lot a both on this forum ///
 

wilkin250r

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Feb 9, 2003
Messages
570
Re: Opinion and religion.

Originally posted by rolmops:<br /> Personally I feel that it borders on blasphemy to claim to understand the greater will and plans.<br /><br />My question is this: How can anyone justify himself claiming that this or that way is part of the Greater plan.How often is it a way of justifying oneself and how often is it used for ulterior purposes?
I'll disagree to some extent (surprise).<br /><br />I'll agree that we can't truly understand the whole of God's Greater Plan. But I don't think it's unreasonable to understand bits and pieces of it.<br /><br />This can easily be seen in retrospect. Look back at your life, at some of the trials you have endured, and the lessons that you have learned as a result. Do you see other places that those lessons have applied? Do you see the meaning and purpose for those lessons? You begin to understand the reasons for the trials and lessons in your life. You see bits and pieces of the Greater Plan.<br /><br />It's very easy to see looking back. However, many of us have difficulty seeing and understanding God's lessons and plans going foward . Me personally, one of the most difficult lessons I've faced is learning to hear God when he speaks to me, and acting according to Him even when I cannot understand the reasons. But when I do, I see my course of action, and even though I do not understand His Greater Plan, I can see little bits and pieces, and I understand my involvement in it.
 

spratt

Lieutenant
Joined
Oct 13, 2004
Messages
1,461
Re: Opinion and religion.

I still do not feel nor believe that it is paramount that we "understand" the whole plan of God. I DO believe it is of UTMOST IMPORTANCE that we each prepare ourselves to BE a PART of that plan. When we take our last breath in this life, nothing will matter except what we have done for Him. God uses us, people, humans, to make His plan work. His whole plan in the end is to have a people that He will call His BRIDE, to live with Him in Eternity. It is completely up to each of us to decide if we want to partake...I understand that some folks say that God forces us to "live for Him" inasmuch as if we do not do what the Bible says to do then we are cast into Hell. That is true, but God doesn't do it...we do it to ourselves!!! He provides the salvation, we choose to enjoy it or not...<br /><br />What a benefit to serve God!!! What a pleasure not to have to deal with the problems most sinners have to live with. It is so nice to wake in the morning and know that the law is not looking for me, that I can breathe and look every other man in the face and know I have nothing to hide. <br /><br />We were a created people, by God, for His pleasure, then sin entered into the picture, but God already had a plan in place to provide a way of escape for His people. <br /><br />If you haven't already accepted that avenue of escape, today is the day of Salvation, not tomorrow...we have no promise of tomorrow!!!
 

spratt

Lieutenant
Joined
Oct 13, 2004
Messages
1,461
Re: Opinion and religion.

Mrs Soulwinner: Your studying is showing thru:)
 

Mrs Soulwinner

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Oct 18, 2004
Messages
221
Re: Opinion and religion.

I believe the reason why people who claim to be christians just totally disregard what it says in the bible is because they are more concerned about this world than about Who they are supposed to be following. Their actions are totally different to their stated beliefs because they are more influenced by this world than by the Word. <br /><br />Think of it like this....the more you take in, the more you're going to think on. If you spend more time concerning yourself with this world, you are going to be concerned with things of this world. If you concern yourself with the Lord, you are going to find yourself being more concerned with Him. <br /><br />Me....I find that it is easier to be concerned with my realtionship with Him than it is with anything in this world. Because when I find myself constantly in His prescence, I then know how I am supposed to be...how I am supposed to treat others, to handle myself in life and living.<br /><br />We are not supposed to stand in judgment of anyone. We all have a purpose in life and we are to seek His guidance in what that is. We may not agree with what others do, but we also don't know where others stand in their relationship with Him.<br /><br />I agree that it has nothing to do with religion. It has everything to do with our own individual relationship with Him and we are not all in the same place. Some struggle harder than others. We should all remember that and apply the compassion we are taught from the bible to our lives in regards to giving each other support.<br /><br />I check myself daily. I am not perfect by no means. Do I love? yes, do I get angry about other people's actions? better believe it! But it's not my issue. I pray for people and believe that when the time is right (His time) He will enlighten that person to the wrongs in his life or enlighten me to how I am preceiving those actions.<br /><br />I love to the best of my ability through the good graces of G-d. It is only though His graces that I am able to accomplish anything in this life. And I know that. How? I've been living it for several years.
 

LubeDude

Admiral
Joined
Oct 8, 2003
Messages
6,945
Re: Opinion and religion.

Originally posted by Rudderman:<br /> Whatever happened to "thou shalt not kill", "turning the other cheek" and stuff like that? These days it seems that we all pick out the bits that are easy for us to live with and just disregard the rest.
Thou shall not kill is better translated, Thou shall not commit murder if you really study it out. Also the turn the other cheek phrase is only applied to being chastised for your faith, you certainly are allowed to defend yourself and your family otherwise..<br /><br />There was a lot of killing of animanls and wars after the ten comandments were given, God cannot go against his own comandments, therefor many have taken these two things out of context for many years. Kinda like, the "meek" shall inherit the earth, It dosent meen the "week" shall inherit.
 

spratt

Lieutenant
Joined
Oct 13, 2004
Messages
1,461
Re: Opinion and religion.

Originally posted by Mrs Soulwinner:<br /> hey spratt......is it too much?<br /> ;)
TOO MUCH??? Only if one dislikes what is said:) I am biased of course, as you well know, so no I would never think it is too much ;) Great posts!!!!
 

KaGee

Admiral
Joined
Aug 14, 2004
Messages
7,069
Re: Opinion and religion.

Originally posted by LadyFish:<br /> ... And, you might as well throw in "Thou shall not stand in judgment". I see this one abused the most.
The 11th Commandment???
 
Top