New bearings: too much movement on spindle

[six50joe]

My first experience replacing bearings & races on my double axle 3500lb trailer, my OP is here. Prior I had no knowledge or experience, so hoping what I'm seeing is not unusual.

Replaced the races & bearings in the first hub, quickly discovered I need a lot more grease than a single tub & cartridge to do all 4. The first one went together perfectly, no play at all before I capped it. The second one has me confounded.
With replaced races & bearings, when I slide the hub onto the spindle w/ outer bearing, washer & nut tightened slightly, hub spins smoothly, but I can easily push it further onto the spindle maybe 1/2" more. I can't tighten to that because the washer is stopped at the end of the threads, leaving a gap after that. With my lack of experience, I don't understand how this is possible. it's as if the race / bearing was set too far into the hub, or the spindle itself is the wrong size. The new races / bearings are identical to the ones that were replaced, and the spindle doesn't appear to have any wear/damage. Of the gazillion youtube videos I watched of this procedure, none mention this extra play.
Not going to continue with this one or the remaining hubs until I understand what I'm seeing.

Another problem I discovered, is that on this same hub, if I re-install the brake caliper w/pads and spin the hub, the outer pad falls out easily, there doesn't seem to be anything on it to get it to 'set' into the caliper. That's secondary issue fro now, perhaps I'll put that in a separate post.

Thoughts on this are greatly appreciated!

Joe

 

[Scott Danforth]

did you buy a new axle or try to put bearings on a buggered up spindle?

 

[Horigan]

It sounds like the inner race is somehow in the hub too far. You should be able to find a cutaway view drawing of the hub/axle/brake assembly on line. With that start making measurements of the spindle, hub, and race locations to confirm they are correctly positioned.

Are you sure you have the right bearings? What brand hub/brake assembly are you working on? Please post pictures of the spindle.

 

[tblshur]

sounds like one of the races didnt get put in just a thought of what i may have done

 

[bruceb58]

sounds like one of the races didnt get put in just a thought of what i may have done

If you didn't get the race pushed all the way in, you would have the opposite problem.

 

[bruceb58]

My suggestion....post pictures of everything. Include showing what the inner bearing looks like sitting in the cup(race).

 

[bruceb58]

I looked back at your previous post. Did you end up replacing the spindle for this one that you are having problems with?

 

[six50joe]

Thanks for the replies all. Because it was the first time seeing it, I hadn't recognized the spindle in my other post had a deformed piece of the old outer bearing on it. The first hub had gone on fine with no play with the replacement races and bearings. Pics here are of this second hub, with pics of the new bearings and races next to the old ones. One pic is of the hub from inner looking out (so you see the new seal in it), the other two are from the outer side looking in, where you can make out both races and the inner bearing. There doesn't seem to be any deformity or damage on the spindle. Any other thoughts?

 

[Horigan]

What brand rotor/hub is this? Kodiak, Dexter? Below is a link to example brake section views for Kodiak brakes. You can compare the critical measurements of your spindle and hub against the correct section view and determine what is out of place.

https://www.kodiaktrailer.com/resources/technicaldrawings/brake-section-view/

 

[dingbat]

Pics here are of this second hub, with pics of the new bearings and races next to the old ones.

Your IMG 0525. jpeg is puzzling.
How did you get a picture of the rear seal from the front of the hub without the rear bearing being in the way?

 

[six50joe]

Your IMG 0525. jpeg is puzzling.
How did you get a picture of the rear seal from the front of the hub without the rear bearing being in the way?

You're not seeing the seal in that pic, it's the inner bearing (which obscures view of the seal), the grease around the edge may be making it appear like the seal.

 

[six50joe]

What brand rotor/hub is this? Kodiak, Dexter? Below is a link to example brake section views for Kodiak brakes. You can compare the critical measurements of your spindle and hub against the correct section view and determine what is out of place.

https://www.kodiaktrailer.com/resources/technicaldrawings/brake-section-view/

I'm actually not sure how to tell which brand- is it stamped into the hub somewhere?

 

[dingbat]

One pic is of the hub from inner looking out (so you see the new seal in it)

Which picture is this?

Doesn't matter which brand... hubs of the same rating are interchangeable.

 

[six50joe]

Which picture is this?

Doesn't matter which brand... hubs of the same rating are interchangeable.

Sorry, should have named the pics accordingly before I uploaded them on my other computer. IMG_0522 is looking from inner to outer, so you're looking directly at the seal. You can see the inner bearing behind it.

 

[dingbat]

Sorry, should have named the pics accordingly before I uploaded them on my other computer. IMG_0522 is looking from inner to outer, so you're looking directly at the seal. You can see the inner bearing behind it.

Something doesn't look right....but it's had to see with all the grease and grime in the hub.

Can't tell shiny new from grungy old

 

[six50joe]

Something doesn't look right....but it's had to see with all the grease and grime in the hub.

Can't tell shiny new from grungy old

View attachment 331005

I wiped the remaining grease from the inside. It' now easy to see the seal and inner bearing. In the outer looking in pic, you can see the outer race flush up to the stop, and you can also clearly see the inner race and bearing. The part at 5 o'clock on the outer race is just little piece of grease I missed, not a deformity or gouge. Everything seems to be seated properly and evenly inside.
All the spindles are the original ones when the trailer was new, and the replacement races and bearings are all the same size. Is it possible that some hubs will settle and firm the bearings onto the spindle once under load- or should there always be zero in-out play with the nut hand tightened? When I did the first hub, I don't recall there being any play- but unfortunately I'm not 100% certain I really tried to push it on further after tightening the nut.

 

[Horigan]

I don't see an outer cup for the outer bearing in the hub. Are you including that in the installation?

 

[dingbat]

I don't see an outer cup for the outer bearing in the hub. Are you including that in the installation?

Me neither.
The brown "grease ring" where the cup normally would be looks suspicious...

 

[Grub54891]

I suspected the race was missing from the earlier pics also. I just assumed he took it out before the pics were taken. If its loose enough to remove by hand, it needs a new hub.

 

[six50joe]

I suspected the race was missing from the earlier pics also. I just assumed he took it out before the pics were taken. If its loose enough to remove by hand, it needs a new hub.

I must be losing my marbles. I could have sworn I put both races in. I even remember setting the outer race on top of the hub. I must have gotten distracted by a phone call or something and came back. What fooled me unfortunately were the two 'steps' in the inside of the hub that are roughly the width of the race, and that it was relatively smooth, which made me think the race was set all the way in.

Sorry to have wasted everyone's time on this one. Live and learn. I can't continue until I have more grease, so will continue later.

I still could use some advice on the outer brake pad just falling out of the caliper when the hub turns, if anyone has thoughts.