MFG Niagra '65

[bigbrokechevy]

After reading many posts I decided it was time for a restoration job of my own. Heres what I came up with.

The transom is shot and the floor is shot. They are getting torn out.

Over the past weekend I removed much of the floor and all of the transom. The transom was quite unlike most I have seen on here it was end grain balsa sandwiched between plywood.

Also the cap and hull seemed to be held together with a thick block of some sort of plaster. The cap, except on the transom, is about a two inches bigger all the way around. The void was filled with this plaster that was kind of broke into a million pieces in my drive way. If you got any ideas on what that was, please let me know. I still have a large piece that is attached to the bow but my antique digital camera takes terrible pics so they didn't come out that great.

 

[bigbrokechevy]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

The transom is fully removed now and part of the floor. I had to squeeze this thing is the worlds smallest garage because of the weather. Of course I found the stringers to be bad. They are mostly fiberglass but the wood in the middle is so soaked with water I will be replacing those as well.

You can see the dreaded foam everywhere but that is the least of my problems. After I cut the floor with the saw and popped the fiberglass off I used a shovel, thats still in the bow, to shovel out the floor. The glass was all that was holding the floor together.

By the end of the week, I hope to have the entire floor removed and bad stringers and foam. I went to harbor frieght and bought a grinder and some supplies and after using the chicago electric grinder or what ever it is, I hope it lasts through half of this job. It is poorly made, but for $20 I cant really complain that much. I also found that a respirator is a must. Ten seconds into the transom and I knew I was going to buy one right then and there. Best money spent on the project so far, besides kerosene for the heater. If you fellas have any pointers for a first timer feel free to chime in and let me know when I screw up. I have zero fiberglass experience but it dosen't look that hard.

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

Looks like fun.

Welcome to iboats.

Please re-read the rules in reference to photo size.

 

[Greg Mrozinski]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

Big,

Welcome to Iboats. Looks like a great project and you will learn first hand what you have been reading on here. Keep up the good work. Definitely use proper safety gear especially when grinding fiberglass. Check out my resto thread for helpful hints. Keep the pics coming.

 

[bigbrokechevy]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

Got a little work done today. The snow in VA got us a half day at work.

Bob-If my photos are still way to huge I am sorry but I think I got it fixed. Turns out I wasn't hitting apply in the photobucket editing screen. Thanks for the welcome.

Greg-Thanks for the heads up on your resto thread. Don't know how I missed it. May be sending you a PM or two with questions.

And now for the updated pics. I finished removing the floor to find six stringers in really bad shape and some wet foam. I was only able to save the bow section and foot rest piece for patterns as they were the only pieces not completely rotted.

You can see how much the half of the floor that I already removed dried out. The stringers were shot. The fiberglass was cracked and weak because the wood rotted on the inside. Here is my arsenal of tools. The shop vac doesn't seem to like fiberglass dust.

Heres where I left off for the night. Removed three of the six stringers. The pink stripes are from where the resin was holding the braces. It was about 1/4 inch thick and just peeled out after I cut out the stringers. Oh yeah, brand new respect for you guys that have an entire bilge of foam. I only have a little and it is a PITA to get out of there.

 

[Mark42]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

Welcome to iboats, bigbrokechevy! And the MFG Niagara is a true classic! It looks like someone has been into the boat before you, because MFG did not put wood or foam in the floor like that. The floor was one piece molded fiberglass that dropped in over fiberglass stringers that kind of look like the core of corrugated cardboard. The only place there should be plywood is in the transom, under the gunnels, behind the dash, and in the center of the front deck (where the mooring bit would have been bolted on).

Regardless, the hull is very tough. Do a nice job with new stringers and floor and it will last many years. If the steering wheel and drum are in good shape, then all the other pieces of the wire cable steering are available. I think even iboats had most of the pieces in their parts store.

The shape of the splashwell (the notch in the front) makes me think its a 66-68 model year, not 65, although it was just the splash well and dash that changed over the years.

That filler used under the cap can be replaced by polyester resin with thickener like wood flour or ez-thick, or other similar thickeners. Mix it up really thick land apply. I've looked at a few small pieces that I pried out of my boat and it appeared to be poly resin with a light weight filler mixed in.

For new stringers, I suggest two on each side of the keel. Don't put one right down the center, because it will tend to sit in water. Go to a lumber yard (not the home centers) and get some good pressure treated ply in 5/8" to make the floor and stringers from. Its generally drier than the home centers too. If you can tack it to a stud wall and let it dry a week or two before using.

Going to put foam back in? MFG put it under the gunnels and under the front deck. Would also be a good idea to put a big block in the corners under the splash well. But you are going to have to use the Coast Guard forumulas to figure out how much flotation foam is needed for that boats weight (w/motor).

Good luck with the rebuilding. Looks like you're going a great job.

Mark

 

[bigbrokechevy]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

Hey mark,
I read your post but I think the stringers are all original. They were like corrigated cardboad or the corrigated roofs. But on the top "flats" there was plywood molded in. I will cut one in half tommorow and post a picture of the cross section and see what you think. The floor could have been replaced but there is know way for me to know, but now it is gone and I am going to do it the right way. Luckily I am a Coastie, so I can call a few friends and they can probably give me all the info I need on the floatation. If not it won't be hard for be to break out a manual or two, but thanks for the heads up. The bow underside has about a foot or so foam and the gunwales are about six inches deep with it. I would rather glass in some closed cell if possible. I have all of the complete cable steering minus the cable because the clamps were rusted so bad i had to cut it. My dads ancient starcraft had this so I am familiar and will keep with what was there. I want to try to keep the strings the way they are laid out. They seemed like when they were fresh they were rock solid. I believe this also attributes to the deck being solid even though it was mostly mush so I will definately be following your advice. The only reason I think its a 65 is because of the paperwork that came with it. Other than that, I have no idea and just went with what I could deduce from the packets of paperwork. I will scan a few of them if I can and post some of the MFG nostalgia as well. I really appreciate the info you gave me and look forward to you opinions in the future.

 

[bigbrokechevy]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

On second thought Mark,
I just went out and looked at the boats old stringers. I think that you and I are both right...
The orginal stringers are there, but you were right the floor was replaced. One of the boats 2 previous owners must have replaced the floor tearing up the tops of the original stringers. Rather than just replacing them, they skinned the tops of them with plywood and fiberglass to add the strength back that they destroyed when tearing out the floor. I can imagine why. Those suckers were built really well, its just ashame they were too far gone. Also, do you know if they were tied into the transom? My new ones will be for sure but when I opened the floor up the aft sections of the stringers disentegrated, so I can't really be sure.
Thanks again.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

I can't imagine why anyone would ever have ripped up the original glass deck?
They never go bad, there's nothing to rot.

I'd probably be thinking about a way to make it wood free again, maybe even a poured transom? I'm planning that for one of mine here.

Maybe find a source for one piece fiberglass panels that you could cut to fit and install after fixing the damaged stringers?

One of the benefits of the original construction is it's light weight, the wood you add will always be heavier than what it had when it was new.

The one thing that's pushing me to do a poured transom in mine is to preserve the all original look where the transom meets the deck.

 

[bigbrokechevy]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

reelfishin,
i was thinking of that but i don't know how cost effective it would be. i think i will sacrafice the fiberglass for wood. I know it will be heavier but most of the supplies I need are local to do it this way. If the boat was going to be something that I need to go fast then weight could be a concern but its going to be a fishing boat and cruiser to take the wife out on. It would be nice to go all fiberglass so I will do a little looking around but wood is my current building material of choice. The stringers are really ruined though. I have been cutting them out in as intact condition as I can just in case i decided to attempt at replicating them in new glass.

 

[Mark42]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

On second thought Mark,
I just went out and looked at the boats old stringers. I think that you and I are both right...
The orginal stringers are there, but you were right the floor was replaced. One of the boats 2 previous owners must have replaced the floor tearing up the tops of the original stringers. Rather than just replacing them, they skinned the tops of them with plywood and fiberglass to add the strength back that they destroyed when tearing out the floor. I can imagine why. Those suckers were built really well, its just ashame they were too far gone. Also, do you know if they were tied into the transom? My new ones will be for sure but when I opened the floor up the aft sections of the stringers disentegrated, so I can't really be sure.
Thanks again.

I can look in the lower transom drain hole (there are two on my Niagara, one above the floor , one below) and see the stringers ended about 10 inches or a foot from the transom. The floor is glassed to the transom. The floor also had a recess molded in it as if a small bilge pump was intended to sit in it. But its not open to below the floor. Never did figure out why they did that.

I wouldn't bother glassing in any foam under the gunnels, Thats a spot that just don't get soaked, so there is no real need to make it water proof.

One of the reasons I believe the Niagara boats are still around is the construction of the hull. A huge steel hull mold was filled with chopped glass/resin. Then a matching steel mold was lowered over it and the two steel molds were pressed together under great pressure. This produced a very dense chopped glass boat. Amazing for the time. Those steel molds must have weighed tons.

 

[Fisherball]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

BBC, Check out the MFG forums in the manufacturers section of this site. Here's a link. http://forums.iboats.com/MFG Many Niagra owners who could offer advise on what they did to theirs. We'd all appreciate any pics. I own a 16' '75 Gypsy that I love but had to rip out deck & working on stringers, transom & reglassing it. Here in Ohio that won't happen til Spring.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

I had another make boat, made by Glastex, which used a lost cardboard mold for the stringers. They took round cardboard tubes, cut them lengthwise and used them to form the stringers in glass. The cardboard added no strength and over time just rotted away. It was cardboard similar to the tubes used inside a bolt of carpet.

One of the Niagara's finest points is it's light weight. It's lack of weight allows it to carry more weight, and its construction makes it feel like a much larger boat.

The double lower hull was most likely there as both a trapped air flotation feature below deck, as well as acting as a double hull in the event of a hull puncture. If you were to poke a hole in the lower glass, no doubt the boat would still float even though the lower compartment would fill with water. Keep in mind that this is only true if your deck is all original and all the seat anchoring well nuts are still well sealed. Having the flotation up high in the gunwales is also an important feature in that it keep the boat upright if it were to get swamped.

 

[bigbrokechevy]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

hey guys,
thanks for all the info. I will be busy reading over the holidays I see. Progress came to screeching halt due to title problems. After hours on the phone I have some paperwork and waiting ahead of me. Hopefully it all works out. The "oringinal title" was for a 65. As it turns out I have a 1972 with a 1965 title... essentially the wrong title. Luckily i hadn't bought any supplies yet so worst come to worst, all I have lost is time. Wish me luck.

 

[bigbrokechevy]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

I finally got the title straightened out. Came in the mail today. Mark42, you were definately right, it was not a 65 it is a 72. I gave the wrong title to the state and jumped through some hoops but all is well now. While I was waiting I began to tackle the trailer. Its in really rough shape and I haven't taken many pics but I will see what I got later tonight. The tongue was so badly bent the trailer pulls one way when towed. This will be resolved. And I think a new axle is in order because the spindles looked like a beaver chewed on them. Honestly, I don't know how I didn't die towing this to my house. Also what do you guys recommend for bunk material. I was thinking pressure treated 2x4s. Thanks.

 

[mr 88]

Re: MFG Niagra '65

I can look in the lower transom drain hole (there are two on my Niagara, one above the floor , one below) and see the stringers ended about 10 inches or a foot from the transom. The floor is glassed to the transom. The floor also had a recess molded in it as if a small bilge pump was intended to sit in it. But its not open to below the floor. Never did figure out why they did that.

I install my upper drain plug from the inside of the boat. Why? Fish guts and anything else that spills is easy to wash out.A 2-5 gallon bucket of water, throw her in gear ,get the bow up a little and empty bucket in offensive area.Also works for any rain water,water skiers etc that bring unwanted water onto floor. Water drains out and plug is put back in. Lower plug installed from outside,water pressure and relatively tight, keeps it dry.