MFG Niagara

[lonewolf8814]

I just got a '62-'65 MFG Niagara for $20.00 ..... I kid you not. This guy was actually gonna turn it into a planter!! He said he thought it was "shot", but I've cleaned it up and discovered he was SOO off the mark! It appeared to have a solid hull & floor, which is what sold me on it. Here's what the MFG brochure said about it's features "MFG Unitized construcion .. one piece pressure molded hull ..... full length, all fiberglass reinforced glass bridge provides the strongest bottom reinforcement. MFG doesn't rely on plywood stringers, balsa, or foam floatation for structural strength. Not subjected to rot ... " Oh my my my!! However, the floor has been breached by a few seating holes, and a hull drain was installed by s/o as well, leaving a square hole cut out of the floor beside the main drain well. Any ideas on how I should go about a quick & easy fix? Should I use the opportunity the seating holes present to inject some foam, or leave it as is?! There appears to be no foam underneath where the holes are, though the specs say there's foam in the bottom. Anyone know these old MFG's?? Gonna go get some pics, I know how much everyone likes the pics!! LOL!

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

Forgot to mention it was a custom made patrol boat for the corps of engineers, so it's LOADED with the works!! OK, here's the link to the pics, got some old catalogue goodies in there too. http://s101.photobucket.com/albums/m76/lonewolf8814/MFG/ I can't figure out what year this one is cause it has so many extra custom goodies!! Anybody get a good guess let me know!

 

[reelfishin]

Re: MFG Niagara

Early MFG boats, those made after about 1960 or so used an all fiberglass hull with the exception of the transom core.
There's a pic of a 1960 with no deck here under the earlier 'Transom materials' post. This will give you an idea of what yours looks like under the deck. I'm not sure if they continued with this construction into the 1970's or not on some models but I do know that newer models had common glass over wood decks.
I do know that all of the 1963 through 1966 Niagara hulls I've had were built with no wood below deck, as were all the other models with a lapstrake hull that I've seen.

http://forums.iboats.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=65141&d=1282624461

The newer models had two fiberglass rails or light stringers that supported the middle of the deck in addition to the lower hull structure. There was no foam in the lower hull and should never be any. The flotation in these boats was under the gunwales and under the deck plate up front.

The seat holes originally had toggle bolts with rubber grommets that sealed the holes when tightened down. If the original seats are gone, and you don't plan on using those holes, I'd fill or at least plug them to maintain the trapped air space flotation feature of the sealed lower compartment.
The holes can either be filled with blank grommets or filled with fiberglass or epoxy.
I used them on mine to anchor the new back to back seats I bought from a local dealer. installed grommets over the toggle bolts which I used to hold down the new seats. The holes I didn't use I filled with 5200 sealer with a small tape patch over top. All o the holes landed inside the new seats so none were visible with the new seats installed.

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

Yeah, ok. Alot of these holes have black rubber plugs in them, with an epoxy of some sort on top of them. Only, the epoxy sealing cover has come loose from most of them and can be fingered off top of the rubber plugs easily. The plugs themselves ..... well they don't look too trusty, if ya get my drift, so I guess I'll patch over them. I just was hoping to keep them, being all original & such. Ya sound like ya gotta ton of MFG knowledge! Can ya put a year on this beast?? What's throwing me off most are the style & lines of the ski racks and the deck! I've looked at all the old brochures and can't find a match to save my life!! No way it has custom ski racks too!! LOL!

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

The hull in that pic is definately different from mine, I promise! I can see enough under the floor to know for sure that it looks like this.

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

Also, the brochures for '63 to '69 all say that there's "positive foam-in-place floatation in bottom, gunwales, and under the deck". '70 and up, no mention of any of those features, so I guess that's when they went standard on all that.

 

[Schwagner]

Re: MFG Niagara

Hey Lonewolf that 1960 mfg in the transom materials post is mine. I've been trying to research the mfg line-up. http://www.fiberglassics.com/library/MFG
mine is a 1960 17' Northeastern Hardtop Deluxe, which is basically an edinboro hull with a little "deluxe" trimmings. I'm looking for the searchlight, if you come across one let me know. Good luck with the restoration. Check out the transom materials post if you need info on transom replacement

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

AAAHHHAAAA!!!! I got it!! It's a '66 niagara custom, with some added goodies thrown in that were technically only available for some of niagara's bigger sisters like the seaway & seacruiser. I guess they made an exception cause it was the corps of engineers, who no doubt required those features! Lucky me!! LOL! Yeah Schwagner, I've been pounding fiberglassics since I got it! They're the ONLY place I've found that gives ya the dirt on these ancient babies. I'm gonna be needing to find the bulb for this deck light, so I'll keep my eyes open for a complete one, you're needing the whole thing right? I haven't decided if I'm gonna tackle the transom right now, I doubt it though. It has some damage, but it's 2'' thick & still pretty dang sturdy, plus it has a 50hp limit, so it should be ok for a good while, so long as I clean it up good, kill all the ants, and reseal it all like it's supossed to be. But if I do, I'll definately hit the transom materials post.

OK, back to the original question= this thing's supposed to have foam in the floor for pos floatation. Should I try to get as much in the seating holes as I can before sealing them up or not? Anyone wanna weight in here!?!?

 

[lonewolf8814]

'66 MFG Niagara custom

'66 MFG Niagara custom

the original question= this thing's supposed to have foam in the floor for pos floatation. Should I try to get as much in the seating holes as I can before sealing them up or not?

 

[reelfishin]

Re: MFG Niagara

I cut up a 1963 about two months ago which had it's transom ripped off by a way too big motor and lots of wood rot. There was no foam in the lower floor, there was a chunk under the bow deck, behind the dash, and both gunwales were filled. There were two fiberglass forms to support the deck, and waffle like forms on the inside of the outer hull as on the boat in the pic. I actually cut out and saved the deck panel just in case I needed one someday.
There was some foam at the very front under the forward deck, beyond the foot rest panel but not more than enough to fill a 5 gallon bucket or so once it was broken up.
The later boats used wood decks with a thin layer of glass over top and pour in flotation foam, I've never seen any such foam in the older hulls below deck. My 1965 is wide open below deck, I can take a borescope and look around and see the area is clear of foam and the hull does indeed have the waffle look on the bottom.
I cut apart the damaged deck on a 1967 Westfield and that did have poured in foam and molded stringers much like the pic you posted.
The theory behind that sealed off lower deck is to provide flotation in the event of swamping, as well as a double hull to some degree. Foam isn't needed. I would not add foam to that hull if you have the type of hull which uses two drain plugs. The sealed air space will provide flotation. I'd seal up the holes with grommets and some 5200 sealer and call it a day.

 

[Schwagner]

Re: MFG Niagara

Yeah.
I'm looking for the whole damn searchlight. Let me know for sure if you find one. Good luck. Post pics. Hey, now's the time to rebuild the transom. Before you bottom coat it or even topcoat paint it. A few hundred and a few hours now with the nida-pour and done.

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

"A few hundred" .. er .. uuhh ... therein lies the difficulty! The wife! Nuff said, right?! LOL! If it'll work, I gotta live with it. As for keeping my eyes open for a seach light, will do. You know anything about tempo-curtis trim tabs? I can't find jack but 1 fiberglassics post about them, and that don't include any info or pics!! Got some on the Niagara, but they're not all there it seems.


"I would not add foam to that hull if you have the type of hull which uses two drain plugs." That's the thing, like I was saying, if ya look closely at the pics, that odd shaped square hole starboard of the drain well is a poor attempt at making another drain hole, for the hull bottom. But it didn't have one originally. I was planning on patching that back up good & tight once I have the floor & transom sealed. I'm thinking it probably wont matter if there's foam or not if the hull's solidly sealed, I just like the positive floatation concept. My bad luck + gnarly stump = you get the point.

 

[Schwagner]

Re: MFG Niagara

Hey then ride it till it rots. Take the wife out in it, get in the middle of the lake and tell her it might sink because the transom is screwed. That might loosen up the noose a little.. LOL! Anyway, run it.
I know nothing at all of these trim tabs you speak of. My northeastern doesn't have any. Ask google in as many ways you can think of to say it. rephrase and rephrase until your eyes are gritty. That usually works for me. Oh, and search google images with all those phrases as well, sometimes that helps.

 

[mfgniagara]

Re: MFG Niagara

Hey then ride it till it rots. Take the wife out in it, get in the middle of the lake and tell her it might sink because the transom is screwed. That might loosen up the noose a little.. LOL! Anyway, run it.
I know nothing at all of these trim tabs you speak of. My northeastern doesn't have any. Ask google in as many ways you can think of to say it. rephrase and rephrase until your eyes are gritty. That usually works for me. Oh, and search google images with all those phrases as well, sometimes that helps.

Take her to see something like Piranha or Jaws first too.
If the transom is rotted, it needs to be fixed. Its a matter of safety not just an expense.

That hole to the starboard side of the bilge drain shouldn't be there. There should be only an external drain from that compartment. With the hole cut in the deck like that, the lower hull section can't trap air and act as flotation.
The single most important things about these hulls are first the transom strength and second, the integrity of that lower chamber. The sealed air space feature both adds strength, buoyancy, and double hull protection.
The trapped air pocket is far more buoyant than foam, plus being a sealed lower hull compartment, it acts like a double hull in the even that the outer hull is compromised. With the section cut out, and any unplugged seat holes, this function is defeated.

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

OK, new more detailed pics!!

http://s101.photobucket.com/albums/m76/lonewolf8814/boats n stuff/MFG/

So the external drain IS supposed to be there?! I figured someone added it too, along with the lousy square hole they made by the bilge drain. No, If I had any doubt in the strength of the transom I wouldn't even think about floating her. It seems to me that it's still real stout, there's no rot to speak of. It did have ants begining to nest in it, but they've done very little damage that I can find, and I sprayed their lights out. I'm gonna put a stainless plate on the outside of the transom as well, to even out the pressure from the motor on the transom. Not to worry though, I'm gonna seal up those seat holes , the transom, and the cutout tight as a bangkok ... nevermind .. LOL!! I got 2 broke feet and wear heavy metal upright braces!! I'm not taking any swimming chances, trust me!!

 

[mfgniagara]

Re: MFG Niagara

That second drain is there to drain the under deck area, it should be the only way into that area. The drain is there to let out any water that may get in by mistake or through the seat hardware.

Those tabs are aftermarket, they're a fixed method of leveling the hull. You adjust the bolts to raise of lower the tabs so that the boat rides level.
They're meant to level an uneven load but on a boat that size I don't see much need for that. They can also be set evenly and downward to push the bow down and get the boat on plane faster but they will take away speed.

If that were mine, I'd fix that hole cut out in the deck, seal the seat mounting holes and get that thing in the water.

My guess is that someone cut that hole in your deck to install a bilge pump in the lower hull. I'd look close for any signs of leaks too, it may well have just been to pump out rainwater though with all those seat holes open.

I just picked up a 1966 Niagara today, here's a shot of the drains.

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

I bet they cut it out to replace the fittings, cause they're definately not original (some cheap screw together plastic dudes), likely when they did that terrible patch work on the transom. Yeah, I knew what trim tabs were for, just never seen any that were bolt adjusted like that. Gonna see about engineering me a more adjustment while under way freindly attatchment.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: MFG Niagara

The upper drain looks to be plastic, the lower one looks too short. I'd pull both out and replace them with proper length drain tubes and seal them in place with some 5200.
There's nothing wrong with the screw in type but since someone already cut the hole, I'd just use the brass tubes like the factory did. Just be sure to roll the edge over and seal both sides well. Then patch up the hole cut in the deck.

Then hunt down a splashwell for that boat. The splash well bolts in place and seals to the transom with a rubber molding. I suppose they did that fiberglass patch on the transom to either fill in old motor bolt holes. Hopefully it's not there to cover cracks in the transom from where the motor flexed against a rotted transom. I cut one up last year that had broke there, and finally tore all the way down to the bottom when the motor fell off. The guy had an old 50hp V4 on a rotted transom. I see the two drain holes are still in the transom which drain the splashwell.

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

oh, sorry bout that, I have the splash well. It's not in the pics cause I stripped the boat to clean it & check it all out good, I need to put some new strips of wood under the lip/edges of the ski rack so I can refasten the trimming, that's why they're pulled away from the gunwales. Yeah, they patched up some holes , and what looks to be a split in the fiberglass where the motor sat on the transom. That's why I figured it was shot to start with, but aside from a little in close proximity from the splashwell holes, I can't find any soft spot's. Plenty strong enough I think, but I may go ahead and replace the whole transom anyways, just to be sure. No hurry to get it in the water since I don't have a working motor to push it right now, so I may as well do the transom.
How do you come up on so many of these MFG's?!?! Are there THAT many of them still around? I'd never seen one, and can't find many pics of them online.

 

[lonewolf8814]

Re: MFG Niagara

Well, I have a motor ... a '66 33hp super sea horse in fact, but it's out of order right now and nobody will give me any more help on that thread, so I'm at a loss there.