Looking for any suggestions

cyclops222

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 21, 2024
Messages
1,540
Has the TP sensor been checked for tightness ? Disconnect and reconnect the sensor connection a couple of times to rub off any corrosion ?
 

Bt Doctur

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Aug 29, 2004
Messages
19,321
next step is to hook up a remote tank (6 gal outboard type) to eliminate the tank and venting. Next is remove the fuel pickup tube from the tank and verify that there is no screen INSIDE the tube
 

Berkley1

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Jun 21, 2024
Messages
104
next step is to hook up a remote tank (6 gal outboard type) to eliminate the tank and venting. Next is remove the fuel pickup tube from the tank and verify that there is no screen INSIDE the tube
Well eliminated the fuel tank as an issue now I can start the engine only if I open the throttle once it starts I can adjust back to idle and it runs fine if I shut it down I have throttle up to start. Stumped at this point
 

muc

"Retired" Association of Marine Technicians...
Joined
Jul 7, 2004
Messages
2,167
This makes it difficult. It seems that the long block has been replaced. That's a long block only set of three numbers, it doesn't tell us anything we need to know about how the engine was "dressed" This long block was used in many models, unfortunately the 5.7GXi-A wasn't one of them. Either way, we need to know exactly what engine you have. Is there a sticker below the alternator by the dipstick? Or it's possible we can find the original engine's serial number by running the TSK - transom serial number or the drive serial number. Also might be possible to get what we need from the ECM stickers or possibly from the scan tool. Possible the title for the boat will also have this info - depends on what state it was first registered in.

Worst case is to contact a Volvo Penta dealer with the HIN - hull identification number. They should be able to pull up the registration.

Worst-worst case is we try to proceed with trouble shooting without this info, but having done that before ---- it can turn a few hour job into a weeks long ordeal.
 

Berkley1

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Jun 21, 2024
Messages
104
This makes it difficult. It seems that the long block has been replaced. That's a long block only set of three numbers, it doesn't tell us anything we need to know about how the engine was "dressed" This long block was used in many models, unfortunately the 5.7GXi-A wasn't one of them. Either way, we need to know exactly what engine you have. Is there a sticker below the alternator by the dipstick? Or it's possible we can find the original engine's serial number by running the TSK - transom serial number or the drive serial number. Also might be possible to get what we need from the ECM stickers or possibly from the scan tool. Possible the title for the boat will also have this info - depends on what state it was first registered in.

Worst case is to contact a Volvo Penta dealer with the HIN - hull identification number. They should be able to pull up the registration.

Worst-worst case is we try to proceed with trouble shooting without this info, but having done that before ---- it can turn a few hour job into a weeks long ordeal.
So far it has been an on going issue since July hours or weeks don't even matter at this point. I will go to see if I can find any other numbers the engine the Tech Mate Scan tool tells me the ECM is MEFI -3
 

Attachments

  • 20241017_132723.jpg
    20241017_132723.jpg
    1 MB · Views: 8

Berkley1

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Jun 21, 2024
Messages
104
So hooked up Tech Mate Scanner and these are the readings recorded no faults does anything look out of place?
 

Attachments

  • Volvo Penta 5.pdf
    66.5 KB · Views: 5

muc

"Retired" Association of Marine Technicians...
Joined
Jul 7, 2004
Messages
2,167
So far it has been an on going issue since July hours or weeks don't even matter at this point. I will go to see if I can find any other numbers the engine the Tech Mate Scan tool tells me the ECM is MEFI -3
The sticker on the side is the important one.
 

muc

"Retired" Association of Marine Technicians...
Joined
Jul 7, 2004
Messages
2,167
Assume you already have a copy of the MEFI 3 manual, but if not, here you go

I didn't know you were spending all this time and money without having the correct manual. You may want to rethink this, The correct manual and a scantool would have probably saved a lot of both.

This is the manual we used in Crusader MEFI class.
I have been to MerCruiser, Volvo and Crusader MEFI classes. This is by far the worst manual. If I remember right this one has my notes on half the pages, soo many things wrong that I asked the instructor why it was so bad. His answer was it's the GM manual and has very little changes for Marine. Crusader/Pleasurecraft didn't have the money to redo it like Volvo and MerCruiser did. He said "this is why you come to class, so you learn how the system works and you will be able to know when the manual is wrong"!
Even with a manual, here is a cut and paste from the manual @dingbat posted.

GM Powertrain Division service manuals are intended for the use by professional, qualified technicians. Attempting repairs or service without the appropriate training, tools and equipment could cause injury to you or others and damage to boat that may cause it not to operate safely and properly.

Something as simple as a compression test can be done wrong and lead to new issues.

Ignition Modules are sensitive to the amount of secondary voltage required to complete the spark plug circuits.
With the spark plug wires removed from any available ground, the module will be driven at maximum dwell saturation time for the coil(s) – read as HEAT. And when that maximum secondary spark is released, it may seek a ground right back through the ignition module – causing instant electronic failure.
When an engine is running with a spark plug wire “hanging”, you can bet the module and coil have had their service life compromised. How much depends on how long the wire was “hanging”.
To properly disable the ignition system on fuel Injected engines, with the key in the OFF position, unplug the crankshaft position sensor, remove the ignition relay or unplug the J-1 and J-2 connectors from the ECM before cranking the engine.

That said, the info on how MEFI works is useful.

I will warn you about using this manual to troubleshoot. While most of the components are the same, the software in the ECM is very different between the engine manufactures and also engine years. This can lead to replacement of good parts, and when that happens. The chance of getting the wrong/bad part increase and now you have 2 problems. This may explain why your symptoms have been changing. It's highly possible you swapped out a good part with a not so good part. I'm hoping you saved all the stuff you have replaced (especially the fuel injectors) they may be needed.

Because of the differences between software packages between models and years it becomes very important to know what software your engine has installed. The serial number can help so so much.
A few of the questions.
Does this engine use B+ to help control injector pulse width?
What strategy does this engine use to determine closed and throttle %?
What strategy does this engine use for engine protection?

Remember, the ECM’s decisions are only as good as the input information. If bad information is input to the ECM, then the ECM will make bad decisions. Bad decisions cause running problems.

Unwanted resistance due to corrosion is the hardest to find because the extra resistance usually doesn’t set any fault codes. The extra resistance does cause the circuit to flow less current which causes a voltage drop to or from a sensor, or it reduces current flow to an output (load device) which may cause the output to malfunction. Unwanted resistance due to corrosion usually will not set a DTC because the circuit still functions, just not properly.
 

muc

"Retired" Association of Marine Technicians...
Joined
Jul 7, 2004
Messages
2,167
So hooked up Tech Mate Scanner and these are the readings recorded no faults does anything look out of place?
Unfortunately this is just a snapshot of a moment in time, it really isn't very useful without knowing what came before and after it.
 

Berkley1

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Jun 21, 2024
Messages
104
I didn't know you were spending all this time and money without having the correct manual. You may want to rethink this, The correct manual and a scantool would have probably saved a lot of both.

This is the manual we used in Crusader MEFI class.
I have been to MerCruiser, Volvo and Crusader MEFI classes. This is by far the worst manual. If I remember right this one has my notes on half the pages, soo many things wrong that I asked the instructor why it was so bad. His answer was it's the GM manual and has very little changes for Marine. Crusader/Pleasurecraft didn't have the money to redo it like Volvo and MerCruiser did. He said "this is why you come to class, so you learn how the system works and you will be able to know when the manual is wrong"!
Even with a manual, here is a cut and paste from the manual @dingbat posted.

GM Powertrain Division service manuals are intended for the use by professional, qualified technicians. Attempting repairs or service without the appropriate training, tools and equipment could cause injury to you or others and damage to boat that may cause it not to operate safely and properly.

Something as simple as a compression test can be done wrong and lead to new issues.

Ignition Modules are sensitive to the amount of secondary voltage required to complete the spark plug circuits.
With the spark plug wires removed from any available ground, the module will be driven at maximum dwell saturation time for the coil(s) – read as HEAT. And when that maximum secondary spark is released, it may seek a ground right back through the ignition module – causing instant electronic failure.
When an engine is running with a spark plug wire “hanging”, you can bet the module and coil have had their service life compromised. How much depends on how long the wire was “hanging”.
To properly disable the ignition system on fuel Injected engines, with the key in the OFF position, unplug the crankshaft position sensor, remove the ignition relay or unplug the J-1 and J-2 connectors from the ECM before cranking the engine.

That said, the info on how MEFI works is useful.

I will warn you about using this manual to troubleshoot. While most of the components are the same, the software in the ECM is very different between the engine manufactures and also engine years. This can lead to replacement of good parts, and when that happens. The chance of getting the wrong/bad part increase and now you have 2 problems. This may explain why your symptoms have been changing. It's highly possible you swapped out a good part with a not so good part. I'm hoping you saved all the stuff you have replaced (especially the fuel injectors) they may be needed.

Because of the differences between software packages between models and years it becomes very important to know what software your engine has installed. The serial number can help so so much.
A few of the questions.
Does this engine use B+ to help control injector pulse width?
What strategy does this engine use to determine closed and throttle %?
What strategy does this engine use for engine protection?

Remember, the ECM’s decisions are only as good as the input information. If bad information is input to the ECM, then the ECM will make bad decisions. Bad decisions cause running problems.

Unwanted resistance due to corrosion is the hardest to find because the extra resistance usually doesn’t set any fault codes. The extra resistance does cause the circuit to flow less current which causes a voltage drop to or from a sensor, or it reduces current flow to an output (load device) which may cause the output to malfunction. Unwanted resistance due to corrosion usually will not set a DTC because the circuit still functions, just not properly.
Thanks for the info mechanically inclined I am electrically inclined I am not it is frustrating to say the least as the number of Volvo Penta mechanics in my area are far and few between I have to rely on what knowledge I can find and friends with limited knowledge to track down issues. so far I seem to be chasing gremlin when I think one issue is resolved it has just moved somewhere else. I will continue to trouble shoot and before I'm done will probably have a new boat LOL Thanks again for your advice.
 
Top