Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

[comicazy]

Hello all,
I recently purchased a 1977 Grady white 19' boat. It has a 3.0 4cyl mercruiser inboard engine that will not start. I have done some testing, and determined that the starter solenoid is bad. I can jump across the solenoid and get the engine to turn over, but it still will not start. I took some pics of wire that are broken, and I believe this to be the cause. I just need to know what components I am looking at so I can get them replaced.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Comic

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

I just need to know what components I am looking at so I can get them replaced.

They aren't OEM parts, that's for sure. You need to back off with the camera a bit so we can see whats around it.

Also you will need to trace each wire and see what it goes to, then let us know and we might be able to figure out what it is.

Looks like a diode block for the alternator or something, but who knows.

 

[Bondo]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Ayuh,... Welcome Aboard,.... Donno what that is,... it Ain't stock parts.....

Post up some more pictures of yer motor, from further back, for some overall shots...

Have ya checked the points for power,..?? Coil,..??

Ya need to power 2 circuits to start a motor, the Ignition, 'n the Starter....

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Hello all,
I recently purchased a 1977 Grady white 19' boat. It has a 3.0 4cyl mercruiser inboard engine that will not start.

I think I see your problem, that's the air cooled rectifier and regulator for an early 470 (NOT a 3.0, it's a 3.7)
Never seen one before so will do some checking.

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Here are some more shots of the motor. The yellow wires go down to the front? of the motor. I'm guessing that this motor has a stator instead of the traditional alternator/generator? Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I get power at both of the right terminals on the starter solenoid at all times. The left smaller terminal I get power to when I turn the key, so that tells me the ignition switch is working. But the terminal that connects directly to the starter, never gets power. Does the starter solenoid need to be mounted to the block to be grounded and work properly?

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Yeah. you have a 470 with an OLD air cooled regulator.
None of that stuff is available any more.
The wiring has to be fixed, the charging system changed to an alternator. You probably have an ammeter on the dash instead of a volt meter which is going to make the rewire for the alternator a zoo. Plus it probably needs some new points so you can get spark.
Yes the solenoid need to be grounded to the block. Is it the right solenoid that puts full voltage to the coil while cranking?
Will the engine crank over now?

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

So what kind of modifications am I looking at? Wiring in an alternator I could probably handle. Would it run off the engine as it is currently set up? Or would I have to change that entire pulley at the crank? Are we talking about a couple hundred dollars worth of work, or upwards of a thousand?

I will have to look into the ignition system to see what power it is getting. I pulled the plugs to make sure the motor would spin without any resistance. Haven't checked to see if they actually spark or not.

From what I recall, the gauge on the dash reads voltage not amps. Is that what you meant?

Thanks for the help so far guys.

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Looks like I can get an alternator conversion kit for around $330 on ebay. I'm guessing that would be my best bet to fix this issue?

I'll worry about the charging system once I get the motor running. If I'm right, it should still start up and run without that properly wired up. Right? I'll check on the ignition system when I get some time off work next week. Retail is a b*tch.

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Really need to know if you have an ammeter for sure, because the wiring depends on that.

You may have to hot wire the engine to start it. Jumper wire from battery positive to coil +. and jump the solenoid to crank the starter.

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Alright, so I haven't checked if it's an ammeter yet, but I did try hot wiring it to get it to start. With the plugs in, it will not crank over. It tries, but I think the compression is too much. Not sure if it's my battery that is run down or what. I've got a red top optima, not as a permanent battery for it, just as one to see if I can get it started. How much cranking power does the starters on these engines usually require? Would it be worth trying to jump start from my truck, or am I asking for trouble trying that? I have the optima on a charger now, and will try again later.

 

[matt167]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

If you have a battery in the boat, that will act as an isolater and neither electrical system will get damage. Just jump start it as if it was a car.. Hopefully you have cables long enough and big enough gauge to work, otherwise you will be pulling amperage and just turning it into heat. 470's really don't take much to start tho.

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Well didn't make it as far as jumping it off. The battery had enough juice to turn it over once it was charged. Still no fire though. I am getting power to the + side of the coil. Should I be getting power to the negative side as well? My test light lights up on both sides, but I get nothing if I try the center outlet to the distributor. I'm guessing that means the coil is bad. Also the coil was very warm after a few minutes. Any advice?

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

You need new points and condenser. Not a new coil.

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Ok. Is there a way to get rid of the points system on this application? I know some older vehicles you can, but what about these?

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Why not stick some points and condenser (cheaper) in it first, just to make sure it runs and nothing major is wrong with the engine, which just happens to be a big concern at this point. Before you start doing a bunch of upgrades.
http://www.iboats.com/mall/partfind...gd_poid=111637&gd_row=11&session_id=141415076

Yes, there are conversion kits but they are expensive. ($125-$175)

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

ok. If you could point me in the direction of a site that I could buy them, that would be great. All I get when searching for "mercruiser 470 points " is links to the electronic kits, and replacement distributors. Even tried ebay and I get the same results.

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

ok. If you could point me in the direction of a site that I could buy them, that would be great.

I did, didn't you click on the link I posted ????????? That is why people post links. You are supposed to click on them and look.

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

There was no link initially. You added it in after you first made that post. Please don't jump down my throat for asking simple questions. I never said I wanted to get rid of the points instead of simply replacing them. I only asked if there was a way to get rid of them. I'm not completely familiar with a points system, but I do have a basic understanding.
Please understand that I am not new to working on engines. I know how to troubleshoot and I know how to make repairs. However, most of my experience is with automobiles. I know there can be major differences when it comes to marine applications, so the questions I ask are to make sure I am not assuming anything based on my auto knowledge.

 

[Don S]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

Man, you must have looked at that thread immediately after I posted. It only took me a minute to realize I forgot to paste the link, and I edited it.

 

[comicazy]

Re: Just bought a 1977 Grady White Need engine help

I was keeping a close eye on this thread. I had only come inside to ask about my results on my troubleshooting. I was just about to head out the door when I refreshed the page and noticed that you had posted. I thank you for your help thus far, and hope that my questions do not seem to na?ve. On things I haven't worked on before I tend to ask a lot of questions. And in my experience, it's when you think you know something, that it comes up and bites you in the *****.