Is the bible fact or fiction?

[rolmops]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Mikeandronda.The problem that I have with the fundamentalist view is that it simplifies things.To me it seems that the bible is a tiny glimps of what faith and creation are about.To accept it as the whole picture is to grossly underestimate the Creator.Just because He gave us a little peek in a book does not mean that there is not a lot more.Every time science discovers something new,we learn more about creation.The bible is only the basics.

 

[scrapper]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Are the writings Fact or Ficton? <br /> Hmmmm! If the word ended tomorrow and eons passed, and was populated by Humans again, And someone dug up this thread ,..... Would it be considered Gospel, the true word for all to worship ? <br />HMMMMMMMMMMMM!!!!<br />I don't know, I just got here!<br />

 

[Link]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

18rabbit<br />Thanks for bringing up the other scrolls as normally I would not have known about things like that. By accident this time I did.<br /><br />rolmops<br />

Link,The hebrew text is what you would know as the old testament.The new testament was never written in hebrew,it was written in greek.<br />I do not know of any big differences between the King James and older texts.but language is a living thing and meanings change.

That clarifies things a lot. And I concur with meanings change over time.<br />Your explanation of the other scrolls is the same as the documentary I saw.<br /><br />Mike<br />

Which is the belief that much of the Bible can be proven scientifically and historically though I pale in comparison to the teacher but I believe I outlined what we learned.

I think you did very well. Goes along well with a lot of what I’ve watched and read.<br /><br />IMO there is a lot not covered in the bible (about our world and the universe) that we are supposed to discover on our own. <br /><br />IE: You don’t read in the bible about Adam and Eve having problems with dinosaurs.<br />But we know they existed. <br /><br />As you can see by my most basic questions here I’m not qualified to debate anything in this thread. <br /><br />I think in the end carbon dating will be another tool to prove things.

 

[--GQ--]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Alright let see if we can clear things up a little. the original question was/is "the bible fact or fiction"? In order for the bible to be fact, the people, places and events mentioned must all be true and can not be disproved to the smallest detail. Any discrepancy and the book is toasted. This is so easy. Several events come to mind. I'll start with the easiest.<br /><br />According to the bible, we are all descendants of Adam and Eve. which means we belong to the same species. Along with the prestige, we are able to reproduce and multiply thus passing on Adam and Eve genetic blueprint from one generation to the next. Sometime, somehow after the bible was written, a piece of our genetic link was lost. We average less than 100 years. A fraction of our ancestors life-span as was written in the book of Genesis. Not true. The people mentioned in the bible could not have lived more than 100 years if that. In order for this to be true, the human species must have gone through the process of speciation. A process by which members of the same species become separated by geographical barriers resulting from such natural event as Earth Quake. Through million of years of isolation from one another a new species arise and are no longer able to reproduce with the original species. In short the history of the bible is less than 3,000 years old. It takes million of years for speciation to occur. In-addition according to the bible and modern history, there was never a discontinue of human interactions from the time of the bible to now. GENESIS BUSTED! Moving on.<br /><br />As stated in the bible there were only two people, Adam and Eve. They had two sons, Jacob and Abel. In their late teen, due to sibling rivalry, Jacob killed Abel and was sent to a far away land as punishment from the all mighty God. Then the bible went on to say he married a local woman. Stop, who was this woman? There were only three people left. Could it be Adam and Eve had a daughter after Jacob was sent away? If this was true, the story contradict the morals of the bible telling the story right? What does the Bible say about Incest? BUSTED<br />Moving on.<br /><br />I found this paragraph in Deuteronomy very ungodly. I'll recite from memory. " When you go into battle, God will help you defeat your enemies. You shall kill all your enemies. If a female among the enemies, you may disrobe her and take her as your wife".<br /><br />Hmmm, male chauvinistic point of view to me. What if you are a female and you find a male enemy attractive, can you disrobe and marry him? It seems the bible portray women as properties. I disagree. We are all equal but separate. I think it is safe to say the person who wrote the Bible was a very disgruntle member of society. Ungodly behavior for sure. BUSTED<br /><br />Another section reads, "Thou shall have no other God before me".<br /><br />WOW, a little insecure don't you think?

 

[--GQ--]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Gonfishin, you are correct about Noah's Arc. for a ship to support the lives of two of every kind of animals, it would have to be a million times the size of the Titanic. i mean we are talking about a whole eco system on that ship. You need trees plants to feed the living creature and a few animals will have to be sacrificed to feed the lions and other meat eating animals. And how long was the flood? Was there enough sunlight to support the plants that feed the herbivores which feed the carnivorous.<br /><br />Assuming there was a Noah's Arc. Where is it now? Surely something of that size is hard to miss.<br /><br />BUSTED

 

[--GQ--]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Mike or Rhonda,<br /><br />1) when I said "dance" don't take it literally I was referring to this debate. I mentioned the "Bee-Gees" to keep in tune with the older crowds in DC.<br /><br />2) The people I referred to in my second post are not my friends. They are my brother's wife side of the family. Extended family if you will.<br /><br />3) No I don''t do drugs. I am allergic to all form of controlled substances. <br /><br />4) Those numbers are not direct quotes. Just logical reasoning. I'll compose an equation for you if needed.

 

[bootle]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

"In the grand scheme of the world, the Jewish people and their religion remain insignificant."<br /><br />18R, That statement is truly fiction and you know it to be so, your arrogance has preceded you with respect to this topic.

 

[mikeandronda]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

GQ, I knew what you meant when you said lets dance......was kiddin around.......Being Im 35 your 32 we probably grew up listening to simalar music.......though there is no telling for taste. I need no equations composed but you having that opinion is one thing, stating it as a fact is another. If I misunderstood Im sorry. If the numbers your refering to are the size of people back then I would love to see any scientific studies on this, if we lived, say 200 years we would be bigger and wiegh more? Im not sure that makes any sence. Oh and you must be a 2nd shifter huh? Only see you post at night. I will be back on tomarrow to continue the ummmmm. "dance" Im tired but I will answer to your posts above tommarow

 

[12Footer]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

It's not a matter of fact or fiction. It's a matter of faith.<br />To explain my position further, it's a personal belief one way or the other. To dictate the validity of the scriptures is a human, not spiritual endeavor.

 

[rolmops]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

18rabbit,your earlier comment here about the insignificance of the jewish religion and people and in another post your mentioning the Jerusalem Post as a news source makes me wonder.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Not that the individual people are insignificant, the number of people (or lack there of) yields Judaism an insignificant religion. If you look at the demographics inside of Israel it looks even worse, kind of surprised it has lasted as long as it has. The actual number of Jews in Israel yields the country well beyond the resources that have been expended on saving her. It’s kind of like trying to save the last black rhino…why do it?!? Take a picture, write it down in some book or remembrance, and lets get on with life.<br /><br />There are about 6.3 million people in Israel (including the occupied areas of the West Bank and Golan Heights); but only 3 out of 4 of those people are Jewish, or 4.8 million Jews. Almost 1-½ times that number of non-Jews died in the Nazi death camps. Nothing personal, just business; there isn't enough to the Israel (4.8 mil in a world of 6 bil+ people) to justify the resources expended on her.<br /><br />If you prefer, I believe there is also a christian version of the news on jpost.com, tho I have never bothered to look at it.

 

[tuahcodem]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

It is both

 

[--GQ--]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Originally posted by 12Feetz:<br /> It's not a matter of fact or fiction. It's a matter of faith.<br />To explain my position further, it's a personal belief one way or the other. To dictate the validity of the scriptures is a human, not spiritual endeavor.

12Feetz, interesting concept. Always looking to update my mental library. If it is a matter of faith, therefore I have no say in it. God created me. Either it was part of my design or it wasn't. For him to deprive me in faith of his greatness is unfair to say the least. What is the point of my existence? When I die, does the end justify the mean? And what would that be?

 

[--GQ--]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Originally posted by mikeandronda:<br /> GQ, I knew what you meant when you said lets dance......was kiddin around.......Being Im 35 your 32 we probably grew up listening to simalar music.......though there is no telling for taste. I need no equations composed but you having that opinion is one thing, stating it as a fact is another. If I misunderstood Im sorry. If the numbers your refering to are the size of people back then I would love to see any scientific studies on this, if we lived, say 200 years we would be bigger and wiegh more? Im not sure that makes any sence. Oh and you must be a 2nd shifter huh? Only see you post at night. I will be back on tomarrow to continue the ummmmm. "dance" Im tired but I will answer to your posts above tommarow

Mike or Rhonda, I expect explanations to my post above. Or at least show me the light. Forgive me I have sins.<br /><br />I hit the beach in the day time. If you see a guy riding the wave in the middle of a thunder storm: it would be me. Explains the reason why I only post at night. Can't see the wave. <br /><br />If you read some of my past posts, you would notice, I haven't been working since the end of last year. Wrote my last good-bye letter to the IRS in April. The saddest moment in my 32 years of living. I will miss those folks dearly. But you know absent makes the heart grow fonder.<br /><br />Ahhh, we're heading off-course. In danger of high jacking this thread. <br /><br />Back to the subject. You asked me to prove one point. I say you got plenty above. So educate me.

 

[--GQ--]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Originally posted by txswinner:<br /> Mike, My answer is yes. I have not that much to add as I am a Christian and follow my belief in God and our savation through Jesus Christ. Guess I am one of those less educated ones. "And may the good Lord take a liken to ya." Tennesee Ernie Ford (I think).

Txs, don't make yourself a victim of my opinions. It wasn't meant to be that way. What can I say. After reading it, yes indeed my bluntness, I failed to see. If I make the same mistake again the next round is on me. <br /><br />To answer you pondering, no one created "all this". our mere existence is one in an infinite chance. A cycle that has been go on way before the presence of man only to be disrupted by natural disaster. Then the next cycle starts all over again as long as the Sun still shine. We maybe the second or third cycle already. Who knows. How can it be. Hard to see.

 

[Speedwagon]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Originally posted by Kenneth Brown:<br /> Thanks for your views on this. I have always accepted that Jesus was a Jew while others argue against it. Many of the hate groups don't see it the way we do. I used it to try to help these people let go of their hurtful ways.

What else would Jesus be(other than a Jew)? I grew up Protestant, though I claim nothing at the moment. But I don't logically see how Jesus could be anything other than a Jew. <br /><br />And the bible, I do believe, is a historical account of history, with many facts in it, but ultimately it is written by man, and subject to errors and exaggerations. After all, history is written by the winners.

 

[bootle]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

" After all, history is written by the winners."<br /><br />Gee! Am i glad that the dinos did'nt write anything, or did they?<br />Naaa! they probably never really existed 65 mil years ago as some may lead you to believe.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Is the bible fact or fiction?

Interesting point, Darth. But keep in mind there is nothing currently in science that proves the dino’s are anything older than 5000 year. That’s a huge problem because if a person really did live to be 1000 years old, what would they look like? They would like pretty much like Neanderthal man. And if no one can definitively say the dino’s bones are older than 5000 years, then Neanderthal isn’t necessarily any older.<br /><br />Another problem is that all dino’s shared something in common; lack of lung capacity. The chest cavity of dino’s does not allow for the size of lungs needed to keep the mass of their body alive. If t-rex did live on this planet he spent his life lying on the ground gasping for air, unless…<br /><br />If the earth’s atmosphere was denser there would be more oxygen molecules available and an animal could survive with smaller lungs. Now the dino’s existence is possible; the earth’s atmosphere must have been denser.<br /><br />Back to Neanderthal: if the earth’s atmosphere was denser, injuries heal much faster so things are less likely to die, and things live longer…much, much longer lives. It is very possible that a human living in a denser atmosphere could live to be 1000 years old. And if they did, they would leave behind a skeleton that resembles that of Neanderthal man. How old is Neanderthal man? ... we don’t know. But what’s that have to do with Mt. St. Helens?<br /><br />The eruption of Mt St Helens did in a few minutes what would have otherwise taken about 20,000 years to accomplish. That’s the estimate of geologists; 20,000 years of sediment was deposited within minutes. The way bones are dated is by dating the sediment around them. There are a few people missing after Mt St Helens erupted. It is entirely possible that in a thousand years or so from now someone will be digging around in that area and find a skeleton, date the substrate as 20k years worth/old and think they have an ancient skeleton 20,000 years old, when if fact they don't. We don't have a way to accurately date the substrate around dino bones...or Neanderthal man.<br /><br />The point of all of that is that science knows a good world less than what many of us presume they do. Folks in those fields are doing the best they can but at the need of the day all we really have is someone’s ‘best guess’, not anything that is definitive or without controversy. And “no!”, no one has yet definitely proved the world or anything on it or in as older than 5000 years. ‘Best guess’ says it is, now all we need is the proof.