Am I for a immediate pullout? NO!<br />Am I for a pullout, YES and NO.<br /><br />What I really want is some truth from the government regarding what we are going to do. It's already been hashed out and the undeniable truth is bush lied to go to war, and no we are there. So now, over three years later its time for the administration to own up to its failures, admit it's successes and tell the American people the state of affairs in Iraq. Not what the media is telling us, but what the government knows and tell us the truth, the first time, not when it is to a political advantage.<br /><br />As for your questions regarding Saudi Arabia and Yemen (and yes that is the proper spelling) IF they are harboring terrorists shouldn't they be treated like Afghanistan and Iraq? Isnt that the logical conclusion? Isnt that what baby bush said, if you harbor/protect/etc terrorists or aid them in anyway, you sill suffer the wrath of the United States? Or at least something to that effect/<br /><br />As for how thin our military should be, a competent commander in chief would listen to the military leaders, allow the military leaders to actual lead (now isn't that a novel concept?), and win this war, not drag it out as long as possible. It will be interesting to see how long the war lasts when there is no more political or personal gain for those in the top offices. It will be interesting to see how our next president handles this quagmire. What I really would like to see is a properly equipped military (body armor, secure and protected vehicles) and a sufficient number of troops to accomplish what we are there to do. And then I would like to see us DO IT. I would like to see us go in, kick butt, lock down and resurrect the country. Then I would like to see us turn control back over to the Iraqi people. I would even like to see Iraq pay for its liberation, pay us back. I mean if it is such a wonderful thing and they needed it so badly, shouldnt they be grateful enough to repay us for the favor? <br /><br />I simply am getting sick and tired of hearing about our brave soldiers getting killed for a lie. I am sick and tired of our current corporate pandering administration lying to me about how we needed this war, how we needed to liberate (read occupy) Iraq. I want to know where we are in Iraq in regards to securing it. I want to know what our plan and timetable is for returning control to the IRAQI people. They need trained police and military, I understand that. What is our/their progress in this mission? I fully understand that we may want this by then, but when that happens it puts this behind schedule. At least have the integrity to inform the American people of the truth and tell us what is happening over there. <br /><br />The best way to fight the "Liberal" media is to be honest. When you tell the truth, and have proof to back it up, anyone else's lies fall apart. But the redumblican party and the current administration do not respect us, the American people enough to be honest with us. I can tell you I would respect bush more if he was truthful and up front with us. Unfortunately after 5 years of his dishonesty and treachery I don't think I could ever completely believe him or his administration. And I really doubt that baby bush or his administration could/would ever be truthful or honest with the American people, politics (especially todays politics) dont work that way.<br /><br />So if you have read this far, I thank you. And if you have read and understood any of my other posts regarding baby bush, his administration or the war you know my positon. All I want is answers, not lies. But the current administration doesn't seem to have the integrity to give us answers. Thank you all for your time and consideration.Originally posted by 12Footer:<br />Are you serious? Are you also for an immediate pull-out from Iraq?<br /><br />Why not just nuke Saudi Arabia? And wasn't the USS Cole in the port of Yemmen when it was attacked by alqueda? Let's turn it into glass also, right?<br /><br />Sure, i am being flippant. But then, "baby bush" is the commander in chief, so let's negate any diplomatic efforts that serve our intersts in this war. Why should i quit being flippant now, right?<br /><br /><br />And i would be interested in knowing just how thin you would like to see American miltary spread in the many valid and plausible theatres around the planet.<br /><br />I'm not a follower of Sheehan, so i won't pretend to understand the mindset. However, i sure would like to. It defies logical thought, at least to my limitted ability to comprehend it all (i'm a redumblican, after all).
Glad to oblige. You speak the truth, but perhaps you should say :angry: just to prevent any misunderstanding.Originally posted by JB:<br /> Some of you guys only hear what you want to hear....<br /><br />Saddam has admitted that he planted false intelligence on WMD. Clinton believed it, a covey of Dems believed it, they all made speeches about it. Congress believed it enough to authorize the war and all of a sudden Bush lied? <br /><br />Gimme a break.
Yes, and it's surprising the parallels. <br />
Based on where it is now and where we go from here, I understand "the job" is essentially over for GWB.<br />1. Talk is cheap, so what GWB says becomes cheaper by the day.<br />2. The hardest part of "the job" against terrorism is ignored. And with GWB's failed leadership, that ignored portion of "the job" will bite us hard.<br />3. The only "job" GWB is likely to finish is his own in '08.<br />4. "The job" will never be "finished" unless we have re-newed leadership that isn't anywhere to be seen in all of Washington DC at this time. <br /><br />If "the job" was compared to ridding my yard of leaves, GWB did a fine job of raking them in perfect piles. There they've stayed for weeks now, the grass is dying under them and the piles are getting scattered in the wind.<br />"George, how 'bout those leaves?"<br />He replys, "I'm commited to staying the course."<br />"George you haven't moved the piles for weeks now."<br />He replys, "Yeah, but I'm thinking about them everyday. Can't you see the progress we're making?"<br />
JB,<br />I am astounded. You are generally so eloquent and astute. But here you are simply IMO repeating the redumblican party line.Originally posted by JB:<br /> Some of you guys only hear what you want to hear.<br /><br />GWB has said a bazillion times exactly what he is going to do: Finish the job, then get out.<br /><br />What part of that do you not understand? The job isn't done. Iraq has elections and stabilization yet to go. When a stable, democratically elected government has a trained and effective security force in place the job will be done. Then we will evolve our forces out.<br /><br />If you don't understand that the above is a plan and a strategy you just refuse to understand what you don't want to hear.<br /><br />Might as well take on the "Bush lied" myth as well.<br /><br />Saddam has admitted that he planted false intelligence on WMD. Clinton believed it, a covey of Dems believed it, they all made speeches about it. Congress believed it enough to authorize the war and all of a sudden Bush lied? <br /><br />Gimme a break.
As I have said, the intel that the political powers had before the war was just that, before the war. What was the credible intelligence that baby bush had/disregarded when making his decision to invade Iraq? Why is the current administration fighting so hard to never answer that question? If they had nothing to hide, had acted with irrefutable integrity then that would be proved out.<br /><br />What I don't understand about "Finish the job, then get out." is what is the job? How are we progressing? What steps are still needed? Why aren't we as Americans being informed as to this progress? What is baby bush scared of? <br /><br />If we were accomplishing anything, then it would be welcome news. Why do you think that his approval and the war approval is waning? America is getting tired of what we are hearing about the Iraq war. That is another soldier died today, another 100 billion dollars was approved, and we see our children falling behind the world in education. We see our streets devoid of police officers. We see failure on the administration's part everyday. Show us something to be happy about the war. Show us ANYTHING that show progress in Iraq. Show us ANYTHING that shows us any value to America in Iraq. Baby bush has shown us none of this, and I doubt will anytime soon. I would be ecstatic to know what needs to be accomplished, what has been accomplished and what is being done to get us to the point where we can leave.<br /><br />JB, your whole position is predicated on the assumption that baby bush only has your best interest in mind and you dont need to question. Your whole thought camp is acting like a bunch of lemmings, following blindly, with no concern for the results. Who really does not want to see is you. You dont want to know so you simply accept and dont question. I keep my personal and professional reputation and integrity above reproach but eliminating any room for doubt. How I do this is by making sure that any question or doubt is addressed. Unfortunately bushs supporters dont expect him to answer to them, instead blindly they answer to him. <br /><br />I am amazed to see this from you JB. 
Not sure I understand the question. Are you asking what about the people that didn't exist in some fundamentalist's version of history? Not sure how they can answer what happened to them if the "fundie" believes they didn't exist? Why would you want to go to a bible study that you do not believe or support? Not all creationist ideas nor the Torah, Bible or Koran require a 6000 year old earth . . .
<br /><br />
People that kill in the name of religion are Evil. Not the religion, the people who kill in its name . . .
Is that all? C'mon Elmer, we're not going to quibble over a paltry twenty-million dollars, are we?Originally posted by Elmer Fudge:<br /> Rodbolt, I know nothing about the $20 million which we've already spent, nothing!
