Hull Repair, should I attempt

[Scott Chinsota]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

i use a 4" angle grinder with a 45 grit flap wheel (for metal). i had to replace two drain tubes. on those, i sanded a tombstone shape, flat where the side turned into the bottom otherwise it would have been a 4" circle. this gives more area for the bond than just the area of the chip (or hole) and it's easier to cut a circle than an odd shape chip. also isolates any contamination to the edge of the patch which is larger than the chip (or hole). you just need to get to good glass for a strong bond.

Thanks for the welcome.

When you say grind, should I be opening the area up with a dremel and cut wheel or just sand until I get all the odd edges out? Should I have rectangle or other regular shape when I am done grinding.

Rivets....Wow I was lost. If it was metal this would not be a problem.

Thanks again

 

[lazyfish]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

OK I have been doing my research trying to find some of this stuff locally w/ not a lot of luck. I know I am not looking in the right place or asking the right questions. What I have found has raised some more questions.

I found resin and hardener #300 Resin and #21 Non blushing Cycloaliphatic hardener. Is this the right stuff?

Gel coat w/ wax of w/o?

Gel coat, should I look to be spraying it on or rolling it on? Spraying seems easier if you have the means.

Tiger hair I found locally but I can buy the ingredients to make peanut butter cheaper. I am sure this is one of those preference things. But is 1 really any better?

I know these are a lot of newbie questions but only one way to learn.

If anybody around Dallas, Tx and knows where I can buy all this stuff locally let me know. I know it is here local just not finding it.

Thanks

You might try west marine or westmarine.com,I have not been there yet but the website says the stock most of the stuff you will need like resin 1708 fabric and epoxys.One of the locations is in garland tx.

 

[Texfisherman]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

i use a 4" angle grinder with a 45 grit flap wheel (for metal). i had to replace two drain tubes. on those, i sanded a tombstone shape, flat where the side turned into the bottom otherwise it would have been a 4" circle. this gives more area for the bond than just the area of the chip (or hole) and it's easier to cut a circle than an odd shape chip. also isolates any contamination to the edge of the patch which is larger than the chip (or hole). you just need to get to good glass for a strong bond.

Thanks that is what I was thinking but I have never done anything like this.

 

[Texfisherman]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

You might try west marine or westmarine.com,I have not been there yet but the website says the stock most of the stuff you will need like resin 1708 fabric and epoxys.One of the locations is in garland tx.

Appreciate that lazyfish. That is just what I was looking for locally.

 

[oops!]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

I know these are a lot of newbie questions but only one way to learn.

this is the exact reasons this forum exists......ask away with out worry

 

[oops!]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

ok.....so hang on here for a sec....

you are looking for gellcoat and poly resin.

this can be purchased at any plastics store.....look for fibreglass supplies in your phone book......in dallas.....i would think that is a snap.

the non blushing stuff is epoxy......once you start down the epoxy route....you can never return.......that means, epoxy sticks to poly....but poly does not stick to epoxy.....so epoxy cannot be gellcoated.....and it must be painted......but even some paints dont stick to it !

do these repairs with standard poly non waxed resin.....and milled fibres. chopped strand fibres, and cabosil.

let me start right at the beginning here.

grind your areas till you have fibreglass.....no gellcoat....just glass. you want the area ground to the glass about 2 inches around the repair area.

in the void areas....open them up with a die grinder.

(as YD said....any time a grinder comes out....the safety equipment comes on....please read this http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=235651 )

mix up some peanut butter......use cabosil.....milled fibres, and 1/4 inch chopped strand fibres in a bucket of catylized resin......catylize at 2% mekp....then add the stuff till you have a peanut butter like goo......use an egg beater on a drill to stir, and work fast.....you have 5 mins to mix....and 10 to work with....thats all.

(tip.....add gellcoat pigment the color of the hull to this pb mix......so if you sand thru the gellcoat....it wont show as bad)

take the peanut butter and fill the voids......and then smear the stuff on your freshly ground and clean with acetone surface. try to get it as smooth as you can for the shape of the hull.....

let that cure for 1 hr.....and grind it semi smooth.....and make sure you have the basic shape of the hull......

clean with acetone.......

lay a layer of 1.5 oz csm over the area.....and glass that in with 2 % catted poly resin.......then add another layer over the whole area that goes right to the edges of the ground out area. roll out any air with a resin roller....

to glass on the edge of the transom will be challenging......glass likes flat surfaces....not corners......so keep working it......if it gets really messy and the whole area moves...just throw that layer of wet csm out and add a new piece of 1.5 oz csm.

as mentioned......the glass wont like the shape corner.....just do the best you can......

after this cures...(or hardens...approx 1 hr) take your grinder and make it smooth. dont worry about holes or pitts....just knock off ragged edges, and get the basic shape of the hull.

now lets make some gellcoat paste.......same as the peanut butter....cat the gellcoat (polyester based pigmented resin) @2%.......and add some cabosil to thicken it....you want this creamy......

then spread this over all the repair area. including over the edges of the old gellcoat.

let cure.......and using 120 grit.....knock off all the rough edges.....now change to 220 grit.....and fair that stuff all smooth,

now cat some waxed gell only at 2% and paint it or spray it on
(some people like to spray a pva over the gellcoat instead of using waxed resin).....pva is basically wax. air inhibits the cure of resin and gellcoat. the wax or pva will make it go hard and not sticky in an hour. the pva is washed off with soap and water......the waxed resin is sanded off.....but the paper will load heavily, so keep sanding till you break through the wax barrier of the new gellcoat.

.....start sanding at 320 grit..... and then move up to 400 grit......then 600 ....all the way to 1500.......then buff with a power polisher.

now.......this all sounds like a 10 day job that is a real headache.......the truth is that it would take me three hours, (not including cure time) to fix this whole thing !

in the link in my thread......is a basic understanding of this process.......click on gellcoating the hull (in the index)......and start reading till its shiney and rolled out of the shop !


i just did a quote today for an 04 malibu wakesetter with 4 holes in the hull.....similar to yours but far larger. the quote was for 6 hours labour total.

i hope this get you a better understanding on the process.

YD is going to have a different idea of the details.......but the process will be the same.

cheers
oops

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

Im right there with ya Oops! .. ( My post #16 agrees with you ).

You might even have to take that drain tube out for the grinding/glassin/gelling ..

6 hours for the proper tech with the tools and everything sounds solid .. but with a DIYer you will most likely spend additional time in the HD or Lows store just to get the 2 40 grit sanding disks you need ..

Yes.. these repairs have be advised well ..

YD.

 

[Solittle]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

I may have my head in a dark place but I would mix up some Marine Tex, apply it and be done with it. It is as strong as steel and will even cure under water.

 

[Scott Chinsota]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

You might even have to take that drain tube out for the grinding/glassin/gelling ..YD.

looks like it needs replaced anyway, changing it out may save transom damage.

 

[Scott Chinsota]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

I may have my head in a dark place but I would mix up some Marine Tex, apply it and be done with it. It is as strong as steel and will even cure under water.

...suggestion has merit...fastest path back to the boatramp! not a purist approach but much easier and cheaper...i'd probably try it.

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

I think that Don S., one of our Moderators, has this NAILED. His signature says...

Don S.


Why is there never enough time to do it right the first time,
But always enough time to do it again? ​

You can use Marine Tex but... There's a 99% chance you'll have to do it again in the near future. Why not do it right the first time???

 

[Scott Chinsota]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

Wood is right. considering the voids and the size of the larger area your repair needs more attention than a quick fix. if the drain tube is questionable, replace it. wood has an illustration of how to make the tool you'll need to flare the cut end and check my "relic" thread for an alternate nut for 1" tube.

 

[Texfisherman]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

Sorry it has been a while guys. Work just tried to kill me over the last week. At least I have a job.
Oops thanks for the step by step. I found all the stuff I need at a composite company just a few miles from my house. Also for the clarification on the waxed versus non. I knew there would be big difference just was not sure what that is.

The one thing that was a little different was with the milled fibers. they told me over the phone they had milled fibers but I did not ask about 1/4" milled fibers. I am guessing there is different grades of milled fibers like long strand fillers vs. short. That is one of the things that concerned me doing this repair myself. Sometimes you have to know the right question to ask or you get the wrong answer. I see it with my job all the time.

I have got some more reading to do. I am sure that will raise a question or 2.

Thanks again for all the input and help.

 

[oops!]

Re: Hull Repair, should I attempt

the 1/4 inch short strand fibres are sold under many different names.......so are the milled fibres......the milled kinda look like fluffy powder.....the 1/4 inch strands look like shory thick hairs.

the 1/4 inch are used for large filling repairs where structural stregnth is needed.

if you cant find the 1/4 inch....just use the milled fibres.....you will be more than fine with that ...as you will be glassing over the area any how....