Going electric vs marinas

dwco5051

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My car i can make 200 mile trip for $5 in electricity and drive 85 or 110 if the moment arises ( I’m just making a point) a gas car that gets 25 MPG $26 thats enough to think about a boat fuel bill of $400 v $75
That holds true today but won't stay that way for long. I pay 99.6 cents per gallon of diesel for my pickup in state and federal fuel taxes that are supposed to keep up the roads here in Pennsylvania. When fuel sales start to dwindle I foresee a mileage tax in the near future. The same goes for boating. The Pennsylvania Fish & Boat Commission receives money from the state liquid fuel tax for the fuel used in boats. If that were to decrease registrations would have to increase. See; https://www.fishandboat.com/Boat/RegisterTitle/Pages/ReportBoatFuel.aspx
 
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Plus, I cant in good conscious support something that can not be fully recycled. right now EV battery recycling is not widely supported and is extremely costly. there is no good method of recycling e-waste.
As with all things, it doesn't happen in a blink of the eye. J.B. Straubel who was one of the guys that started Tesla (before Elon Musk) started a company called Redwood Materials that is focused on closing the battery loop so that they are 100% recycled. Not there yet but there are people working on solving all of the concerns that most of us have about electric-powered cars/boats/snowmobiles/airplanes/etc.

 

GA_Boater

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That holds true today but won't stay that way for long. I pay 99.6 cents per gallon of diesel for my pickup in state and federal fuel taxes that are supposed to keep up the roads here in Pennsylvania. When fuel sales start to dwindle I foresee a mileage tax in the near future. The same goes for boating. The Pennsylvania Fish & Boat Commission receives money from the state liquid fuel tax for the fuel used in boats. If that were to decrease registrations would have to increase. See; https://www.fishandboat.com/Boat/RegisterTitle/Pages/ReportBoatFuel.aspx

It's kind of a no good deed goes unpunished thing.
 

nola mike

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Seems like a serious safety issue if you run out of battery power. You would be stranded and let's not forget what would happen in high seas with no power.
How is that different than running out of gas?
 

Scott Danforth

Grumpy Vintage Moderator still playing with boats
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As with all things, it doesn't happen in a blink of the eye. J.B. Straubel who was one of the guys that started Tesla (before Elon Musk) started a company called Redwood Materials that is focused on closing the battery loop so that they are 100% recycled. Not there yet but there are people working on solving all of the concerns that most of us have about electric-powered cars/boats/snowmobiles/airplanes/etc.

they have been working on EV battery recycling for 5 decades. they also have been working on E-waste recycling for the past 4 decades.

however until the producers are held accountable for end-of-life recycling, it wont happen. a good example is the canadian OPEI stewardship for electric-powered outdoor power equipment sold in Canada. it forces the manufacturer to have an end-of-life plan prior to the ability to sell in the first place.

truth is it is cheaper to ship e-waste and EV battery systems to a 3rd world country and polute that country than it is to recycle the currently designed products.
 

nola mike

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they have been working on EV battery recycling for 5 decades. they also have been working on E-waste recycling for the past 4 decades.

however until the producers are held accountable for end-of-life recycling, it wont happen. a good example is the canadian OPEI stewardship for electric-powered outdoor power equipment sold in Canada. it forces the manufacturer to have an end-of-life plan prior to the ability to sell in the first place.

truth is it is cheaper to ship e-waste and EV battery systems to a 3rd world country and polute that country than it is to recycle the currently designed products.
Unfortunately all true. This is going to be a case where government is forced to get involved and everyone will whine about it. In general, pollution is a cost that should be borne by manufacturers in many sectors--it carries a tangible financial cost.
 

poconojoe

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How is that different than running out of gas?
At this time, I think you can carry more gas/diesel than banks of batteries.

Until they can increase the range that batteries will give you in comparison to conventional fuels, it doesn't seem feasible.

I think it's just not there yet.

Just my opinion. I'm not an engineer.
 

Stinnett21

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Not saying this will be reality but It's quite possible that our liking of electric, once we experience it, will trump our gas boating habits. In other words instead of venturing 30 miles out we'll settle for the fishing spot at half the distance in order to own the electric craft.
 

racerone

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The alarm will sound if you have 16 miles battery capacity and you are 15 miles from your dock.
 

poconojoe

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Not saying this will be reality but It's quite possible that our liking of electric, once we experience it, will trump our gas boating habits. In other words instead of venturing 30 miles out we'll settle for the fishing spot at half the distance in order to own the electric craft.
I really don't think most fisherman will take to that compromise. There are favorite spots that they will not be willing to give up.

It's definitely catch fish with your current gas/diesel or maybe catch with an electric setup.
 

mr 88

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The alarm will sound if you have 16 miles battery capacity and you are 15 miles from your dock.
With my limited math expertise I calculate that you have 14 miles of paddling to get back to your dock.
 

Mcfltfyter

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The thought of stealing from my unborn grandchildren to subsidize uneconomical electric vehicles today makes me sick.
 

Lowlysubaruguy

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The thought of stealing from my unborn grandchildren to subsidize uneconomical electric vehicles today makes me sick.
I’m trying to see the uneconomical side of an EV. can you share some of that in writing for me.

Id like to see the math.
 

racerone

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Another factor is taxes.---When you charge an EV at home how does you state collect taxes for road maintenance.----
 

Lowlysubaruguy

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While these rebates are a point the reality of them is there creating jobs your not seeing them yet but there converting manufacturing plants and building plants all over the US right now to build EV and there parts this is in fact the first investment the US has made in any way shape or form thats actually going to pay off. If you take the time to research the number of plants and jobs EV are going to create in the US it will show you. So dont worry about the government throwing away money again on something like the crap for clunkers program it is nothing like that. And a majority of the EVs that are going to be in the US in ten years will have the highest content of American labor and materials since the 70s. These figures will offset these rebates and completely negate your fears were adding debt to the US economy. EVs wont be where the debt will come from.
 

Lowlysubaruguy

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Another factor is taxes.---When you charge an EV at home how does you state collect taxes for road maintenance.----
There working on it and its going to be a learning curve this is really the only current downside to EVs that the US faces right now as they do not offset the taxes collected from gasoline sales enough to cover road maintenance. But its in the works. most states have a tax plan for them. Myself I think in ten years they will charge you by the mile as all of them will be communicating with each other and that info will be available for them to use to set up a fair system. Like it or not all cars made today have the tracking to do so so its not something new. one thing you dont have to worry about is the government figuring out how to get your money they will overcome that hurdle. I have no doubt on that.

Next will be the infrastructure for the needed electricity which to will come thats already being addressed will it be fast enough in areas that already have electricity supply problems who knows. It is also opening a ton of high paying jobs as well. From top to bottom. From your local suppliers who sell wire to homeowners installing there own charge stations to actual Sources of power

Mind you I’m very informed on the actual EV event coming our way. I own two automotive shops. And I should be the one resisting this but that wont put me in very good position in ten years when this whole things turned upside down. This is something thats not going away no matter how much you think it ain’t going to happen. I can tell you from the very top to the bottom EV are coming and there coming faster than we can imagine.

Its being suppressed so we dont freak out over it but its going to happen. And the biggest driving factor in this isnt that were being force fed them. It will be when you actually drive one long enough. Ok like three days youll think why would I buy a gas vehicle over this. There 5 times the car almost no maintenance ( remember I make my living servicing andrepairing your cars ) your moneys not going to Saudi Arabia and you can go to walmart and drive home at 150 MPH if you feel like it. Soon you will be riding in one a buddies a neighbors what have you and youll think twice about everything that is now making you say it will never happen. Then theres the wow factor. You know when some guy pulls along side of you in a $600,000 sports car and he cant beat you to the next light let alone pass you on the highway. While not all EVs will be that car that car can be had for $43K right now. Ok lets say you happen to be in your new EV truck you bought to pull your 30 foot boat. Same story it’s going to have 1000 HP 500 mile range and beat that sports car in everything except handling tight corners. That trucks already being driven on a road near you. In a year or two there going to be on the market. I love my duramax crew cab 1 ton dually. But I’m betting the comparable Electric Truck will make that truck seem out dated no more diesel fuel dripping all over me from leaking fuel nozzles DEF or standing in some diesel soaked concrete pad in front of a truck stop. Not helping my business at all am I.

So far the only downside to them is the ability to charge from home if your in an apartment. And thats going to change fast as well.
 

Mcfltfyter

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Tesla has the best EV battery today, yet it is only a slightly better version than the NCA batteries of 20+ years ago. Subsidies make ancient technology profitable, and it hinders the energy storage breakthrough we need to make EV's much other than a political statement.

I'd be first in line for an EV if they were a feasible option for me.
 
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