First time winterizing 4.3 mercruiser, alpha one.

[QBhoy]

I understand pouring the AF into the big hoses to get it into the exhaust.

Wouldn't I have to remove the thermostat to get the AF into the block (through the intake manifold)?

I would guess draining all the water first, then put the drain plugs back in, then filling with AF and drain again so air don't freeze. Correct? Or no?

No. The big hose will fill the engine…fill until it comes out the thermostat housing where you took the hose off. Then fill each of the exhaust (smaller) hoses that are attached to the t stat housing…This will run to the manifolds and out the outdrive, if you keep going. No need to remove the t stat. It’s a 5 minute job.

 

[poconojoe]

No. The big hose will fill the engine…fill until it comes out the thermostat housing where you took the hose off. Then fill each of the exhaust (smaller) hoses that are attached to the t stat housing…This will run to the manifolds and out the outdrive, if you keep going. No need to remove the t stat. It’s a 5 minute job.

Thanks for that explanation.
So, the AF will fill the engine and intake, get past the thermostat and pour out where you take off the big hoses?

 

[Lou C]

Yep I've done it that way every time 20 years of winterizing. Says so in my OMC owners manual... no need to remove the 'stat.

 

[QBhoy]

Thanks for that explanation.
So, the AF will fill the engine and intake, get past the thermostat and pour out where you take off the big hoses?

Yeah. It literally fills up and over flies back out the housing. You’ll need about 20 litres all in. Usually not that much though. But I like to prove it’s good, by flushing a little out the drains…

 

[crazy charlie]

I know I am in the minority here big time.....HOWEVER I have done the "Camco" method since my 1st i/o in 1989. I have done this every year since
on 3 different boats.The most recent is on twin 305s that i have owned for past 20 years.I have done this a lot of times.Never an issue.I used to pull the Tstats when winterizing however I came up with a better method a little over 20 years ago.No matter how long it takes on muffs ,the engine temp must be at least at the 145 mark and must continue to keep that temp for another 5-10 mins.Then I switch over to 5 gals of warm/heated AF .This makes certain that the Tstat stays fully open.I store the Af in my boiler room which is a VERY warm room.I then do the 50/50 water mix with warm to hot water.So when the AF is introduced into the engine ,the temp actually rises.
When the 5 gals of Af is running out ,I fog the motor thru the carb and all good till spring.My belief is that when a block and manifolds are stored being filled with AF ,everything internal is much less prone to rust and corrosion.
Like I stated, I know I am in the minority here but my track record speaks for itself.Never an issue in over 50 winterizings. Charlie

 

[tpenfield]

I have a poor man's Camco Kit . . . which is a 5 gallon homer bucket with a hose attached at the base. At the end of the hose are the muffs. The whole business goes up on the swim platform to get positive flow into the outdrive, etc.

The garden hose then just goes in the bucket and I set it to a faster flow rate than the engines consume while running so the bucket once filled stays filled. When I want to switch over to AF, I merely toss the garden hose aside and let the engine consume most of the remaining water in the bucket, then pour the anti-freeze in the bucket on-the-fly while the engine is still running. Seems to be quicker than swapping from the garden hose to a Camco bucket.

Anyway . . . there is no wrong method, as long as it works

 

[crazy charlie]

I have a poor man's Camco Kit . . . which is a 5 gallon homer bucket with a hose attached at the base. At the end of the hose are the muffs. The whole business goes up on the swim platform to get positive flow into the outdrive, etc.

The garden hose then just goes in the bucket and I set it to a faster flow rate than the engines consume while running so the bucket once filled stays filled. When I want to switch over to AF, I merely toss the garden hose aside and let the engine consume most of the remaining water in the bucket, then pour the anti-freeze in the bucket on-the-fly while the engine is still running. Seems to be quicker than swapping from the garden hose to a Camco bucket.

Anyway . . . there is no wrong method, as long as it works

Your method is exactly what I planned on doing a loooong time ago and then my wife bought me a Camco kit for Christmas. It was only about $50 for the kit back then.the Camco kit has a valve to turn to switch from water to AF .Probably even easier than your method but both are fairly easy to do .
Charlie

 

[tpenfield]

The only dis-advantage of an AF kit is that you need to swap the muffs from the garden hose to the kit. Probably takes only a few minutes if you have it already to go.

Some folks feel that the 'cold' AF coming into the engine will 'close' the t-stat . . . but that is generally not the case. Else the cold water from the garden hose would have done the same and the t-stat would never open (right? ).

The problem is in knowing how much antifreeze is enough to purge the water from the engine. Most engines have hoses connected directly to the riser/elbows which by-pass the engine entirely. How much AF went into the engine???

If you want you could take a sample of the liquid remaining in the engine block and the exhaust manifold(s) after running the AF and throw it in the freezer for a day or 2.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Some folks feel that the 'cold' AF coming into the engine will 'close' the t-stat . . .

thats how T-stats work

 

[tpenfield]

that's how T-stats work

Yes, my point is . . . what some folks don't always realize is the the incoming water flow will be going to the engine (and exhaust) first and not immediately hit the t-stat. So, for winterizing as long as the engine is sufficiently warmed up, the heat of the engine will continue to heat the incoming water/AF before it gets to the t-stat.

'Charlie' mentioned pre-warming the AF before using it, which is fine, but not really necessary as long as the engine is sufficiently warmed up.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Ted, let's agree to disagree.

On a raw-water cooled installation, the thermostat is used as a mixing valve for the lock/heads

Incoming water from the transom shield hits the thermostat and is either split to flow to both exhaust manifolds and mix with block/heads, or just flow to exhaust manifolds. While the wax pellet in the Stant thermostat does have slight lag, it will close off at temps about 5 degrees below it's "set point". And that closing only takes 5-8 seconds from full open.

Without draining, it's a crap shoot and your block will be mostly water. If you fully drain, the AF is not needed

Don't believe me, use a refractometer and test the AF in the block

On a half system......the block/heads already should have appropriate AF (need to tear annually). The thermostat isn't in play with the raw water side. Water comes into the HX and exits the manifolds. You can get away with not draining if you run enough AF thru (again, need to test with refractometer . Drain the manifolds first, and no need to test.

Full system..... Blocks/heads/manifolds should be good (test to verify)....run a bit more than a gallon of AF thru the system and it's good

 

[tpenfield]

This is what I am referring to (below) . . . in that the incoming (cool) water does not immediately hit the thermostat, but gets sent to the recirculating pump (provided that the t-stat is open, i.e. warm/hot engine.).

As for taking the AF in through the muffs, Yes, we agree . . . probably will end up with only about 50% concentration of the AF in the engine block, since it is mixing with the water that was previously in the engine block.
.

 

[Lou C]

I agree with testing the AF that comes out of the block drains if you don’t drain first. Risky otherwise. First year I tried it that way & what came out looked like rusty water so drained it all again. Ever since drain goes then back fill with AF….

 

[poconojoe]

I have a poor man's Camco Kit . . . which is a 5 gallon homer bucket with a hose attached at the base. At the end of the hose are the muffs. The whole business goes up on the swim platform to get positive flow into the outdrive, etc.

The garden hose then just goes in the bucket and I set it to a faster flow rate than the engines consume while running so the bucket once filled stays filled. When I want to switch over to AF, I merely toss the garden hose aside and let the engine consume most of the remaining water in the bucket, then pour the anti-freeze in the bucket on-the-fly while the engine is still running. Seems to be quicker than swapping from the garden hose to a Camco bucket.

Anyway . . . there is no wrong method, as long as it works

What I do is similar, but I use a wye hose and garden hose valves to switch over to AF.

I have a homemade bucket someone gave me that has a clear hose and garden hose fitting on the end of the clear hose. I sit it on the swim platform, same as you.

I added a wye hose meant for a washing machine. The single end of the wye hose connects to my muffs. I have garden hose valves on the other two ends. I connect my garden hose to one of those valves and the bucket connects to the other.

I close the valve from the bucket and fill the bucket with AF. I open the other valve and run the garden hose until the engine is up to temperature. Then I close the valve for the garden hose and open the valve for the bucket.

When it's almost done, I fog the engine.
Then I completely drain everything.
I leave my 5 drain plugs out for the winter. I keep them in a zip lock bag with my garboard drain plug and tape it to the steering wheel.

 

[Lou C]

I’m going to stick with the drain & back fill routine but I’m working on a way of making it possible to drain the engine, change the oil & spark plugs without having to pull out the rear seats. Kind of a modified easy drain system but that can be rodded out with a coat hanger wire…

 

[poconojoe]

I’m going to stick with the drain & back fill routine but I’m working on a way of making it possible to drain the engine, change the oil & spark plugs without having to pull out the rear seats. Kind of a modified easy drain system but that can be rodded out with a coat hanger wire…

Do the seats just pull out or do you need to remove hardware to get them out? Bummer if it's a project to remove them.

I guess I'm lucky, I have the big sun pad that covers my engine compartment. I open that and there's tons of room to work. There's space on each side of the engine too because it has the "sport" seating, which is a bench seat forward of the engine compartment.

 

[Lou C]

In order to get at the drains on the block & oil filter the seats have to come out. I modified the rear seats to make it easier than it was but as I’ve gotten older they seem to have gained weight
So I have some ideas to make it easier & less time consuming….

 

[poconojoe]

In order to get at the drains on the block & oil filter the seats have to come out. I modified the rear seats to make it easier than it was but as I’ve gotten older they seem to have gained weight
So I have some ideas to make it easier & less time consuming….

Easier is always good.

 

[Lou C]

If I actually get this done I’ll post up pix

 

[crazy charlie]

What I do is similar, but I use a wye hose and garden hose valves to switch over to AF.

I have a homemade bucket someone gave me that has a clear hose and garden hose fitting on the end of the clear hose. I sit it on the swim platform, same as you.

I added a wye hose meant for a washing machine. The single end of the wye hose connects to my muffs. I have garden hose valves on the other two ends. I connect my garden hose to one of those valves and the bucket connects to the other.

I close the valve from the bucket and fill the bucket with AF. I open the other valve and run the garden hose until the engine is up to temperature. Then I close the valve for the garden hose and open the valve for the bucket.

When it's almost done, I fog the engine.
Then I completely drain everything.
I leave my 5 drain plugs out for the winter. I keep them in a zip lock bag with my garboard drain plug and tape it to the steering wheel.

Sounds like you made a "redneck" Camco kit.Lol