Ethanol added fuel

[burroak]

Since my area of the country has mandated ethanol added up to 10%, what can be done to mitigate the effect of using this fuel in 2 cycle outboard motors? The gasoline, as it comes out of the pump, has the 10% ethanol in it. The ethanol binds to any water or moisture in the tank; with permanently mounted tanks the water could be considerable. That leaves the gasoline with all of the 2 cycle oil blended and the ethanol with the water. At some point the ethanol and water blend will be consumed, and as I see it, the motor will be without lubrication. Do products such as Stabil remedy this situation? Are there other additives that will help?

 

[WillyBWright]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Stabil will only help keep the fuel fresh, it won't help with the ethanol situation. In fact, Stabil is alcohol based. Merc used a similar product (probably Stabil) and changed last year to a non-alcohol-based stabilizer. I hear that synthetic 2-stroke oil mixes better with alcohol-blended gas. To get water out of a portable tank, I prop it so that the corner below the fill neck is low and syphon out the water from the bottom corner.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Stop worrying so much about using ethanol blended fuel. We in the midwest have been using it since 1997 with very few problems. There are issues with older engines that weren't designed with rubber parts that were ethanol tolerant. But modern rebuild kits solve that issue. Old gunked up fuel systems will be cleaned in short order when running E10. A couple of filter changes may be needed until things are cleaned up. E10 will also loosen up crud in gunked up carbs which may plug up small orfices. Again, a rebuild will fix it which probably was due anyway. If your boat has a fiberglass tank (not plastic) you have my deepest sympathy as E10 will get after it. As for the moisture issue, you folks on the east and west costs with larger boats and hence larger tanks will probably have some moisture issues. But chances are you already have water separating fuel filters so that will not be a problem either. If you don't have a filter, add one. This is simply not as big an issue as many make it out to be. The real downer is that a great number of mechanics are quick to blame E10 for a whole gamut of problems as a way to get deeply into your wallet.

 

[bds85466]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

I guess I never even thought about it, but I usually fill my tank with mid-grade gasoline (10% C2H5OH) just to try and be "kinder" to my motor. It's a 72 125hp Johnson. I haven't had any issues...yet. I wouldn't think that adding ethanol would change the amount of moisture in your tank, and if anything it would actually keep the moisture regulated. Like most alcohols, ethanol absorbs more than it's own weight in water (that's why we get headaches from drinking...we're dehydrated from the alcohol stealing our moisture away and absorbing it!). The water/ethanol & gasoline/2 stroke oil mixture is safely burned through a combustion engine. It's like when you add HEET to your car in the winter when it's going to be really cold.

 

[mike176]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

The ethanol binds to any water or moisture in the tank; with permanently mounted tanks the water could be considerable. That leaves the gasoline with all of the 2 cycle oil blended and the ethanol with the water. At some point the ethanol and water blend will be consumed, and as I see it, the motor will be without lubrication. Do products such as Stabil remedy this situation? Are there other additives that will help?

I don't think that would even be a consern if your running oil injection.

 

[ziemann]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Silvertip hit it right on the head. It's not to say that there haven't been isolated problems with E10, but as a whole it has been really over blown. As Silvertip said, there are many places that have been required to use E10 for many years. And the problems have been very minimal.

Many people wrongly blame the ethanol if problems arise. Its kinda like an OMC motor. If it blew up, it must have been the VRO...

Between outboards and snowmobiles, Minnesota has a ton of high rev-ing 2 strokes. If ethanol was creating a crisis, you would know about it....

 

[Texasmark]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

The shop manual for Mid power Mercs from back in '94 (earliest engine in this manual) says that E10 is an acceptable fuel.

Mark

 

[eipeldau]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Good news to you!
I've had a 2-stroke 14HP Evinrude for 20 years here in Brazil. Our gasoline has 25% ethanol in it! I have never had any carburetor or fuel problems and I can say that ethanol is not usually harmful to the 2-stroke Johnson/Evinrude engines that we have here. And I've never heard of anyone using water separation filters or fuel stabilizers. These outboards just keep going.
A whole different situation applies to 4-stroke engines, though: I currently have a 3-month old 20HP Honda and I installed a Racor filter and I always add Starton to the gasoline. So far, it's worked like charm. If you don't take these measures with our gasoline, it will be hell for you to start and you'll never be able to idle. Ethanol is definitely harmful to 4-stroke outboards here. I'm not saying this based on theoretical knowledge, this is just how it works in Brazil.
I hope this helps!

 

[Cricket Too]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Most E10 is actually closer to 20 or 25% ethanol. The biggest problem we had here when it came out about 4 years ago was it loosening up all the crap in people's older tanks, and as was mentioned you just need to go through a couple of fuel/water separator filters and once your tank is cleaned out your fine.

Ethanol doesn't add any moisture to the tank, it just sucks the moisture up and combines with it, which will in turn cause the fuel to separate, but it has to sit for a while for that to happen, and if your boat is sitting that long you should be stabilizing anyway.

There is a product out called Startron that eipeldau mentioned above. This product helps keep the Ethanol from combining with any moisture and helps keep the fuel from separating, I use it whenever I get fuel as cheap insurance, it's $12 a bottle but one bottle will last you a couple of tanks. Plus it helps you burn any crud that is going to come out of your tank that the Ethanol will loosen up, and it's a biocide that helps to keep anything from growing on the bottom of your tank when any water accumulates down there. It has been around for Diesel engines for a while, but they now have a Gas version.

All in all I haven't had many problems at all with any of my motors and ethanol. Except for some slight problems with the stuff in the tank loosening up, and that was solved after changing filters one time. You really shouldn't running anything without a fuel/water separator.

You should be fine.

 

[jspringator]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Does Star Tron replace other fuel stablizers?

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Here in the East, the problems we have are due to mixing e10 with gas containing the other additive (mbte or mtbe something like that). The combination makes a goo much like Jello. The fix? stick with one brand of gas The problem only occurs with the two additives together in the presence of moisture.

 

[Cricket Too]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Star Tron doesn't really stabilize the fuel like say Stabil will, it just really keeps the etanol from sucking the moisture into your fuel and keeping your fuel from separating out. It keeps your fuel tank clean a bit also, I think, as it's a biocide as well.

But for storage I would still use Stabil or an equivalent.

 

[jspringator]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

How can you tell if your fuel has alcohol? Is it required to be labeled?

 

[burroak]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

How can you tell if your fuel has alcohol? Is it required to be labeled?

It's labeled on the pump.

 

[hitace]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

my dealer said make sure to have a fuel filter on the boat because he said he is seeing alot of E10 problems mainly with the older boats that never came with a fuel filter.

 

[dingbat]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

It's labeled on the pump.

Not necessarily. Not all States require labeling. Mine for one does not.

The smell is the giveaway.

 

[burroak]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Not necessarily. Not all States require labeling. Mine for one does not.

The smell is the giveaway.

Apparently there are other states that do not label as well. It makes one wonder what else is being consumed in those states ignorantly.

 

[Monterey 1900]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Hi guys, I just read this thread and just learned that ethanol eats up fiberglass gas tanks. I just happen to replace 2 yrs ago my old pitted aluminum gas tank from the belly of my 19' Monterey bowrider with a new tailor made fiberglass gas tank. What is it with fiberglass and E10? Will I see he effect overnight? ....I will hate to see $400 down the tube and another $400 ON NEW TANK!

 

[Monterey 1900]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Hi guys, I just read this thread and just learned that ethanol eats up fiberglass gas tanks. I just happen to replace 2 yrs ago my old pitted aluminum gas tank from the belly of my 19' Monterey bowrider with a new tailor made fiberglass gas tank. What is it with fiberglass and E10? Will I see he effect overnight? ....I will hate to see $400 down the tube and another $400 ON NEW TANK!

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Ethanol added fuel

Don't panic just yet. First -- are you sure it's fiberglass? It may be plastic in which case it is not a problem. If it is indeed fiberglass, the resins used in the manufacturing process is what mucks things up. That said, if the tank was manufactured two years ago, perhaps there were some changes in the process that eliminated this problem It was primarily the older fiberglass tanks that were a problem. Why don't you ask over on the Mercruiser/I/O forum as there are a lot of older cruiser owners over there that have had problems with their older tanks.